Ladia Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 4 hours ago, daveo said: OR ... everyone could just buy a pair of F2 bindings and call it a day They are kind of readily available anywhere in the world, as well as spare parts, as well as being reasonably affordable ... *whistles and walks away* Sorry to say it, but it looks like only option for future after couple years replacement parts will not be available to salvage. I have 3 pairs of SW and 1 regular TD3 so I should be OK for a while. Elastomer inserts of SW will go first, to make die to cast them should not be big problem. We will have to go to DIY mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowwjob1 Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 19 hours ago, trailertrash said: On 4/23/2018 at 3:05 PM, Wolf said: described and shipped nice and fast. Isn't this basically theft? He's creating a knock-off of something patented From my understanding there is no patent on the bindings. This was part of the issue with the sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted April 25, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 33 minutes ago, Ladia said: Sorry to say it, but it looks like only option for future after couple years replacement parts will not be available to salvage. I have 3 pairs of SW and 1 regular TD3 so I should be OK for a while. Elastomer inserts of SW will go first, to make die to cast them should not be big problem. We will have to go to DIY mode. Hopefully someone comes up with a good way to get some Bomber parts! There is nothing wrong with F2s though. Titanflex, Race Ti, CNC, RS and Intec versions of each. I think they have pretty much everything covered. There are also the SG version, which seems like an updated F2. Don't despair, of good quality bindings out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
workshop7 Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Wolf said: Bomber's cant disks don't have any angle marks either. It's the center disks that are marked, and you're right, Travis' center disks don't have any marks. Not true. On the 0 degree cant there are no markings. On the 3 degree cant there are 3 hash marks. On the 6 degree cant there are 6 hash marks. I believe this is what the original question referred to. @Dan? Edited April 25, 2018 by workshop7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 I messaged the Travis guy about his parts and others he might have milled for Bomber.... but no response! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 To avoid any confusion about markings on the cant disks, here's a photo of a genuine Bomber 6 degree disk (used) next to the 6 degree disk I bought from ebay seller travisspeed939. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 24 minutes ago, barryj said: I messaged the Travis guy about his parts and others he might have milled for Bomber.... but no response! He replied to me pretty quickly when I contacted him a week ago, so maybe give him a little time. I also asked him if he had any lugs, lug shafts or bails. His reply was interesting: I will look around and see what I have. Those parts were made in Taiwan / China 15% of bomber binding part were made in Taiwan / China. Any cnc lathe part for the binding was made out of the states in Taiwan / China. I know this because I manufacture the bindings at my machine shop. I will let you know what I have. and, I unfortunately do not have any of them. I'm sorry. I have considered making the lugs and shafts now for a while as spare parts for the binding. I'm not too sure about the bails yet. Thanks for your purchase on the 6 degrees. I will ship those out today. Barry - More of us showing an interest to Travis about replacement parts can only be good. Let us know if you learn anything useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 For the price these piece parts and disks and what not are selling for... Im going it part out all my TD2 and TD3 bindings! and then buy 5 pairs of F2..... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 5 hours ago, workshop7 said: Not true. On the 0 degree cant there are no markings. On the 3 degree cant there are 3 hash marks. On the 6 degree cant there are 6 hash marks. I believe this is what the original question referred to. @Dan? Wolf was right, I was thinking about the angle markings on the center discs -- sorry for the confusion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 6 hours ago, snowwjob1 said: From my understanding there is no patent on the bindings. This was part of the issue with the sale. Oh? I'm surprised to hear that...if so, does that mean that anyone with the designs can legally fabricate and sell TD3s? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted April 25, 2018 Report Share Posted April 25, 2018 4 hours ago, Dan said: Oh? I'm surprised to hear that...if so, does that mean that anyone with the designs can legally fabricate and sell TD3s? A patent does not stop someone from producing an object unless the patent holder has the funds to sue the infringer. There is no patent on the Bomber binding. The design files would be intellectual property that could be purchased in order to make reproduction easier. Reproducing parts by making careful measurements and creating a design facsimile is not an infringement on the IP. There may be an infringement on a copyright, should one exist. Generally there is a percentage change in design that is required to overcome a copyright infringement. Google would tell you what that change needs to be. Once again the person with the copyright has to have the funds and desire to litigate the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRAZZ Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 I would add that if you're making it for yourself no patent matters. Patents are usually used to prevent a competitor selling like products. I am making a set of cad files from my own TD2. I'm hesitant to share them because I don't want to damage any possible new owner though it looks like this is becoming a moot point. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Bottle Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 (edited) 21 hours ago, daveo said: Seems like the guy who they outsourced machining to can make a decent side business out of supplying replacement parts for Bomber bindings. Or others could possibly do the same, but he has the technical know-how, cnc cad thing or whatever is used for this stuff, machinery and materials. Perfect. It would be advantageous to our community, but if you consider he's stating up to a month for shipping (and I'm less than 20 miles away), he probably doesn't have any items in stock currently and he may be making the items once he's paid. It may be okay, but it's something to think about. Edited April 26, 2018 by Dusty Bottle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted April 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 4 hours ago, Dusty Bottle said: It would be advantageous to our community, but if you consider he's stating up to a month for shipping (and I'm less than 20 miles away), he probably doesn't have any items in stock currently and he may be making the items once he's paid. It may be okay, but it's something to think about. He could do crowd funding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobble Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 22 hours ago, snowwjob1 said: From my understanding there is no patent on the bindings. This was part of the issue with the sale. fwiw... a patent was created for the design of the binding: 5,895,068, April 20, 1999 the patent has expired -- only lasts 14 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 hour ago, bobble said: fwiw... a patent was created for the design of the binding: 5,895,068, April 20, 1999 the patent has expired -- only lasts 14 years. That's only the TD1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colozeus Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 It should be fairly easy to 3d scan all of the parts and make the associated cad or whatever files. Also, we could probably arrange for a group buy of parts or bindings with the ebay guy that was making them. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kirk Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 One of the main issues with getting Bomber compatible parts made will be quantities. The only way to keep the costs in check with CNC parts is to spread the programming, set up and tear down costs over lots of parts. The old CNC saying is usually something like "the first part will cost $1000 and each following part will be $10." If someone is asked to make a few 3° base plates and a few 6° base plates I'd expect the cost of them to be very high. The only way to have it make financial sense to a machinist is if someone buys the design and name and puts it back into production. If that doesn't happen i seriously doubt that anyone will step up to make replacement parts for the existing market. dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colozeus Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 47 minutes ago, David Kirk said: One of the main issues with getting Bomber compatible parts made will be quantities. The only way to keep the costs in check with CNC parts is to spread the programming, set up and tear down costs over lots of parts. The old CNC saying is usually something like "the first part will cost $1000 and each following part will be $10." If someone is asked to make a few 3° base plates and a few 6° base plates I'd expect the cost of them to be very high. The only way to have it make financial sense to a machinist is if someone buys the design and name and puts it back into production. If that doesn't happen i seriously doubt that anyone will step up to make replacement parts for the existing market. dave School (ME|US). Why is the upfront cost so high? I thought cnc machines will just mill/cut the parts out of a solid block. Isn't it just a matter of feeding it the design and pressing a button? Again, i have very little knowledge about machining. The most i have done is woodwork (i built a desk once...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kirk Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Colozeus said: School (ME|US). Why is the upfront cost so high? I thought cnc machines will just mill/cut the parts out of a solid block. Isn't it just a matter of feeding it the design and pressing a button? Again, i have very little knowledge about machining. The most i have done is woodwork (i built a desk once...) Good question. Yes for the most part putting the program into the machine doesn't take much time and the real hands on time is placing the raw material into the machine and getting it indexed (finding ground zero if you will) before you can start the machine. And then there is the run time for a given part. CNC machines are massively expensive (they vary in cost - I've worked with some that were merely $75,000 and others that were closer to $250,000) and the only way to pay for the machine is to keep it cutting parts 24/7. The time for set up, programing, tear down, cleaning, maintenance, etc....is not billable so that time needs to be paid for out of the parts that were cut. Does that make sense? dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colozeus Posted April 26, 2018 Report Share Posted April 26, 2018 30 minutes ago, David Kirk said: Good question. Yes for the most part putting the program into the machine doesn't take much time and the real hands on time is placing the raw material into the machine and getting it indexed (finding ground zero if you will) before you can start the machine. And then there is the run time for a given part. CNC machines are massively expensive (they vary in cost - I've worked with some that were merely $75,000 and others that were closer to $250,000) and the only way to pay for the machine is to keep it cutting parts 24/7. The time for set up, programing, tear down, cleaning, maintenance, etc....is not billable so that time needs to be paid for out of the parts that were cut. Does that make sense? dave Yup. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post forrest Posted April 27, 2018 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 27, 2018 Hello Folks, Directly to the point I have purchased the Bomber inventory other than the Deeluxe boots Sean has. This has been in the works for a little while and today it finalized. I'll be starting a thread tomorrow with information on status, plans, etc. I will attempt to keep current and respond to these threads but there is a mountain of inventory to sort through and lots of wheels to set in motion so I may be slow to respond for the near term. The important take away is the inventory has been acquired and I will be making Trench Diggers, Fintec, BTS, etc going forward. Cheers, Walker 14 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted April 27, 2018 Report Share Posted April 27, 2018 Ohh shit! Bomber is now a Maine company! Tell us about yourself! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrest Posted April 27, 2018 Report Share Posted April 27, 2018 Oops, I should update that I'm in Colorado now, about 30 minutes from where Bomber used to be in Summit. I've been riding since I was a teenager. Bought my first Trench Diggers in college, I still us them actually. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted April 27, 2018 Report Share Posted April 27, 2018 Awesome stuff Walker! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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