Madd Killer Strikes Back!

[kiteparsons]

Sean advised centering the stance on the inserts. I have had good results with that. My stance is pretty wide for my height so that might help pressure the nose more than normal. Ive ridden it that way on "ice" and soft conditions and don't see any reason to set it up otherwise.  

[BlueB]

Centered for me too. 

[workshop7]

Centered.

[nekdut]

Looks like SkiMD/Mike DeSantis is out of the snowboard prep/tuning business.  I got a note from him today stating that he is only working on skis going forward.  Big bummer for the alpine snowboard carving community!  I'm glad I got my MK and latest Nirvana in through him before our time was up.

Edited January 23, 2017 by nekdut

[lonbordin]

21 hours ago, nekdut said:

Looks like SkiMD/Mike DeSantis is out of the snowboard prep/tuning business.  I got a note from him today stating that he is only working on skis going forward.  Big bummer for the alpine snowboard carving community!  I'm glad I got my MK and latest Nirvana in through him before our time was up.

He should probably take @Jack Michaud picture off of his website front page then and remove all the snowboard menu and pricing options.

[Eric Brammer aka PSR]

6 minutes ago, lonbordin said:

Looks like SkiMD/Mike DeSantis is out of the snowboard prep/tuning business.  I got a note from him today stating that he is only working on skis going forward.  Big bummer for the alpine snowboard carving community!

Big Bummer!  I have a fresh, vintage Madds here, rust on the edges, but factory wax on it. Never had the $$$ to set it right.  So, now where do I go?!

 

[najserrot]

So, somebody got a video of this bad boy in action?

[polaris]

20 hours ago, Eric Brammer aka PSR said:

Big Bummer!  I have a fresh, vintage Madds here, rust on the edges, but factory wax on it. Never had the $$$ to set it right.  So, now where do I go?!

 

PSR take that Madd to Dave at The Speed Factory in Campton, NH.  You only need $$ instead of $$$ and the tune is the best in NH. 

[skidad62]

Picked up my MK this week!  Still can't ride due to my Achilles rupture but stoked to have the new Donek in my quiver.  

With my Track 700s in 29.5 my stance angles came in at 70* front and rear.  I usually run 3-4* of splay so final set up is 73* front and 70* rear.  Might try 70/70 too which is flush to the edges   

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rjnakata]

I think it's been established this board has fantastic edge hold, great energy and is generally tonnes of fun.  Some have said they would like it wider. (BTW: I like its width)

My question: is there a relationship between all the good things about the board and its width?  I'm assuming you can't just add a couple of cm in width and still have all the same positive characteristics, am I right?  Has this board balanced all the variables (sidecut, flex, width etc etc)  so much so that any change of just one variable would throw it all off?

[lonbordin]

46 minutes ago, rjnakata said:

I think it's been established this board has fantastic edge hold, great energy and is generally tonnes of fun.  Some have said they would like it wider. (BTW: I like its width)

My question: is there a relationship between all the good things about the board and its width?  I'm assuming you can't just add a couple of cm in width and still have all the same positive characteristics, am I right?  Has this board balanced all the variables (sidecut, flex, width etc etc)  so much so that any change of just one variable would throw it all off?

The weight of the rider might offset the increased width... Just sayin'. ?

[rjnakata]

21 minutes ago, Jim Callen said:

It was made in the spirit of the Original Madds, and from what Sean told me it won't be made wider.

Could it be made wider?  Any board can (save the MK and Pilots), which is why we love working with Donek.  You should see the spreadsheets of his doing the math when a single variable is changed, let alone several.  It's amazing what he does.

I guess that was my question: is a wider board with all the positives of the MK possible?  It sounds like it is; it just wouldn't be called and MK (or MKw).  

If it can be made, why not make it (or has it been done under some other name)?  Again, I like the current width of the MK, I'm just curious about what goes in to board design.

[rjnakata]

1 minute ago, Jim Callen said:

I wold imagine that adjusting any of those variables would make it ride differently than intended.

I could see it with all the R&D.  It can't be as easy as adding a few cm here and there.

[BlueB]

Widening of a board should reduce the torsional stability for given flex, all the other things being the same. 

[Neil Gendzwill]

5 minutes ago, BlueB said:

Widening of a board should reduce the torsional stability for given flex, all the other things being the same. 

If you widen it and keep everything the same (construction, materials thickness), it's going to get stiffer both in flex and torsion, isn't it?  Making it the same flex while adding width, maybe that means it's less stiff in torsion?  Not a mechanical engineer.

[BlueB]

Yes, for a given flex, all the rest the same... 

Edited January 26, 2017 by BlueB

[RobertAlexander]

Finally got some snow to test the tight 8.4 scr on the MK.  About 1 to 1 1/2 " of man made and natural groomed and set up for a couple days at zero and single number temps.

Could hold an edge any where, doing anything, hard and fast or slow and smooth. The slow part was fun as the Mk holds very tight circles if you go slow and back up the hill a bit. Kind of a drop and pivot around your arm/hand in one spot. Was able to do 8 more than complete 1/2 circles in between the lift line poles , all the way down. More of a balancing act than a ripping run. But the snow enabled the MK to do it,  so use what is there in front of you.  That snow condition only happens a couple times a year here. So the MK can be ridden slow, sort of, in this type of snow and method, if you choose to,  but it still is plenty of work/energy. Another two thumbs up for the MK. Still need to test it on so so bad condition snow.

Also this snow condition brought out another mode of riding , that had not been done since snow like this last year.  I wear solid one piece shin guards, real gate ones,  and when the knee is bent a bit , this gives a perfect extended handle for your front leading arms'  hand to hold onto and push down to control the carve.  The snow and the MK was so controllable, that arms out in front was not needed for balance.  Kind of like your legs below the knee become part of the machine that you are on... good fun.

Edited February 1, 2017 by RobertAlexander

[Kerrc]

I have got my MK and all I can say is this is the funniest board I have road. To say it is turny is an understatement. It can burn your legs fast but love it. 

[John Gilmour]

On March 26, 2015 at 7:35 PM, west carven said:

howdy all

thank me later

I'll thank you,

 

that was a refreshing read. I wrote all of it. The spec sheet is not for the originals , I think it is from the short lived cap boards I used to love to delaminate them to prove a point that the sandwich construction was vastly superior and cap would be a passing fad.  I blew up three boards in a single day at Killington in ice and slush to prove it to Mike Banker and said, " hey let me try a forth one, " and he said " Ok, ok, I got it, the cap boards are toast".

On March 26, 2015 at 7:35 PM, west carven said:

 

 

[Eric Brammer aka PSR]

I remember those placards, still have one tucked away somewhere..  Great advice on how to ride a Madds, but few others , 2 decades ago!  Well, kinda worked on the G-6 and Knifer, but not so much on a Nida-Fly...

Thanks JG!!

[RobertAlexander]

good carving snow today, 3 inches of groomed hard pack on the sides, with the MK, really like this board, it does what I want it to do.

Edited February 4, 2017 by RobertAlexander

[lonbordin]

2 minutes ago, RobertAlexander said:

good carving snow today, 3 inches of groomed hard pack on the sides, with the MK, really like this board, it does what I want it to do.

I see you ride a predictable line. 

[Eric Brammer aka PSR]

I got out on one of CMC's M.K.'s yesterday. My lower back is still in recovery mode, but, surprisingly, the knees are OK?! I stanced the board a bit 'off', as being centered with a Burton Cant and Burton Race-plates wasn't quite available at my stance width, so I was 'behind' the board all day (Yeah, would've fixed that, but it's too many screws to f#c& with, and time was a premium). I think with the stancing sorted, just perhaps 1/4" ahead-of-center, and a slight bump up in my angles, I would've had better day. And, it's been awhile since I've been out on angles over 50*; some muscle memory has definitely been lost. So, a bit of being in 'chase-it' mode, and an occasional 'boot-out' moment aside, here's my thoughts on this excellent board.

It has great edgehold, as good as the Madds 170, and perhaps better than the 158. The slight 'pop' available from the tail is very predictable, controllable, and definitely Not like a metal board; very refreshing and welcome! I think in a race course, this could be a Very Fast board! I could 'feather' edging as needed, and I could 'dive+Drive' right up to the point of the boots snagging. Getting very low early, and using correct angulation (refer to Chris Karol's 'Pat-the-Dog', JG's 'Gunfighter', my 'Swing-wing' Fighter drills, or CMC in motion) pays huge dividends in turn arc response! Very adaptable in line choice, but it's up to You to Commit to the line. I only had it 'break loose' on a frozen puddle that had been lightly groomed over, although I booted out 3 times heelside,& once on toes. I was good for 70-75* of edge tilt otherwise. In more relaxed, down-the-hill riding, I could play with my turn arc still, going from sk8-Slalom wiggles up to Super-G turns as I chose, though deceleration was not as confident in an arc, as I recall it being on the 170 Madds. This board has a Gas Pedal. It rode 'damp', but not 'isolated'; I could feel the snow textures, even from partial shade into sunlit areas as I went. It exuded confidence 99% of the time, with that 1% being that surprise Ice patch (true ICE, not any type of snow),and my slight delay in getting into some toe turns (stance issue, my bad). I'm duly impressed. Sean Martin got it right, and I'm very grateful to Curt for his persistence, as the notion of having 'some-one else' make a Madds board goes back to when the Factory in ('01?) Italy got flooded out. That it took this long is no surprise; that bar was set rather high by John Gilmour awhile ago. 

I want to thank CMC again for his taking the day to include me in his riding plans. It was very spur-of-the-moment, but it worked out. It was a great day, with great company, on a great hill, and great boards!  

My only request for future plans with this construction are these ideas; A 173 cm version; and 1.3cm wider-at-the-waist variant. The board, as it is, is nearly perfect, and I wouldn't change the existing model at all. But, I see where the potential of this construction could go. Hence the two/or/three suggestions. Kudos to Donek for doing such a great job on this board!  When, if, my personal fortunes change, I'll be looking for one (or two)!

Edited February 7, 2017 by Eric Brammer aka PSR

[Erik J]

On 2/7/2017 at 1:02 PM, Eric Brammer aka PSR said:

I got out on one of CMC's M.K.'s yesterday. My lower back is still in recovery mode, but, surprisingly, the knees are OK?! I stanced the board a bit 'off', as being centered with a Burton Cant and Burton Race-plates wasn't quite available at my stance width, so I was 'behind' the board all day (Yeah, would've fixed that, but it's too many screws to f#c& with, and time was a premium). I think with the stancing sorted, just perhaps 1/4" ahead-of-center, and a slight bump up in my angles, I would've had better day. And, it's been awhile since I've been out on angles over 50*; some muscle memory has definitely been lost. So, a bit of being in 'chase-it' mode, and an occasional 'boot-out' moment aside, here's my thoughts on this excellent board.

It has great edgehold, as good as the Madds 170, and perhaps better than the 158. The slight 'pop' available from the tail is very predictable, controllable, and definitely Not like a metal board; very refreshing and welcome! I think in a race course, this could be a Very Fast board! I could 'feather' edging as needed, and I could 'dive+Drive' right up to the point of the boots snagging. Getting very low early, and using correct angulation (refer to Chris Karol's 'Pat-the-Dog', JG's 'Gunfighter', my 'Swing-wing' Fighter drills, or CMC in motion) pays huge dividends in turn arc response! Very adaptable in line choice, but it's up to You to Commit to the line. I only had it 'break loose' on a frozen puddle that had been lightly groomed over, although I booted out 3 times heelside,& once on toes. I was good for 70-75* of edge tilt otherwise. In more relaxed, down-the-hill riding, I could play with my turn arc still, going from sk8-Slalom wiggles up to Super-G turns as I chose, though deceleration was not as confident in an arc, as I recall it being on the 170 Madds. This board has a Gas Pedal. It rode 'damp', but not 'isolated'; I could feel the snow textures, even from partial shade into sunlit areas as I went. It exuded confidence 99% of the time, with that 1% being that surprise Ice patch (true ICE, not any type of snow),and my slight delay in getting into some toe turns (stance issue, my bad). I'm duly impressed. Sean Martin got it right, and I'm very grateful to Curt for his persistence, as the notion of having 'some-one else' make a Madds board goes back to when the Factory in ('01?) Italy got flooded out. That it took this long is no surprise; that bar was set rather high by John Gilmour awhile ago. 

I want to thank CMC again for his taking the day to include me in his riding plans. It was very spur-of-the-moment, but it worked out. It was a great day, with great company, on a great hill, and great boards!  

My only request for future plans with this construction are these ideas; A 173 cm version; and 1.3cm wider-at-the-waist variant. The board, as it is, is nearly perfect, and I wouldn't change the existing model at all. But, I see where the potential of this construction could go. Hence the two/or/three suggestions. Kudos to Donek for doing such a great job on this board!  When, if, my personal fortunes change, I'll be looking for one (or two)!

Quoted for posterity. Great review. 

[Eric Brammer aka PSR]

And, today, I got to see a racer (John; um, sorry, forgot his last name?!) use an MK in both GS/Hybrid and Slalom races, with two Silver medals resulting.  Yes, it's got legs!