I take it all back, in regard to softboots working well to carve on.

[bobdea]

so, took out my Kessler SL today. 

Ohh

my

god

I’m seriously questioning spending so much time in softboots now....

I have not felt good, or even comfortable on an alpine board in years. Today it just worked. 

I wasn’t carving aggressively, I wasn’t going fast, I was just having a ball on the thing. Actually was seeing how slow I could still make it work. Turns out, pretty effing slow. 

Stoked!

That thing is amazing, even with the stupid heavy hangls.

its starting to delam, this upsets me. 

So, what’s the closest thing now that doesn’t say Kessler on it? That’s as much as what this thread is about, what’s a comparable replacement? 

As of now the closest thing I’ve been on are coiler NSRs. There’s some special sauce in the Kessler though, more predictable or something. Are the newer ones closer? 

[daveo]

I got an idea for a board...

I did the same thing with softboots last year. Bought an SG Soul 164, Apex Gecko Free, Burton Driver X, Flow NX2-GT even bought after market liners for my Drivers and then I realised I preferred hardboots for literally everything. What an effin' waste =\

Edited March 26, 2019 by daveo

[bobdea]

35 minutes ago, daveo said:

I got an idea for a board...

I did the same thing with softboots last year. Bought an SG Soul 164, Apex Gecko Free, Burton Driver X, Flow NX2-GT even bought after market liners for my Drivers and then I realised I preferred hardboots for literally everything. What an effin' waste =\

They still slay powder really well and carve ALRIGHT. That Kessler though, magic. 

[scottishsurfer]

Your probably getting the similar effect albiet going the opposite way that i get when ive ridden hards then jump on to softs all of a sudden its so so much easier and i feel like a carving god lol.

 

[JohnE]

For myself - it is not so much about hardboots -vs- soft. It is more about the angles that a wider board allows me to ride. It seems far more natural to drive my knees forward & back rather than side-to-side. 

 Has anyone tried hardboots on a wide board with low angles? Does it work?

[Jack M]

Love it.  You should really try my Kessler 168.  For my taste/style/location, it is the holy grail.  My quest for the perfect short board is at an end.

[BlueB]

9 minutes ago, JohnE said:

For myself - it is not so much about hardboots -vs- soft. It is more about the angles that a wider board allows me to ride. It seems far more natural to drive my knees forward & back rather than side-to-side. 

 Has anyone tried hardboots on a wide board with low angles? Does it work?

Yes it works with any angles, duck stance included. Mind you, you need to have right boot/binding setup. Boots need to flex a lot in forward direction and bindings sideways, at very low angles. 

[st_lupo]

Gotta love that board!  This year my 162 became my best friend and is my goto for icey and steeps.  I’m a bit worried about mine delaminating too so post your solution when you find one!  Right now I’m hoping to hook up with another 2nd hand 162.

 

Do you have the build specs on yours?  I know my board is a bit unusual (more taper than standard) and I’m wondering how the side cut radius variation compares with the standard.

[Erik J]

waitaminnit, yer tellin me hard boots carve better than soft boots? mind. blown.

welcome back! 

[bobdea]

53 minutes ago, Jack M said:

Love it.  You should really try my Kessler 168.  For my taste/style/location, it is the holy grail.  My quest for the perfect short board is at an end.

I’m in! 

37 minutes ago, st_lupo said:

Gotta love that board!  This year my 162 became my best friend and is my goto for icey and steeps.  I’m a bit worried about mine delaminating too so post your solution when you find one!  Right now I’m hoping to hook up with another 2nd hand 162.

 

Do you have the build specs on yours?  I know my board is a bit unusual (more taper than standard) and I’m wondering how the side cut radius variation compares with the standard.

I don’t remember who it came from Reiter maybe, IDK so I have no specs other than it’s slightly softer than another one I scored on eBay. 

[workshop7]

6 hours ago, bobdea said:

I wasn’t carving aggressively, I wasn’t going fast, I was just having a ball on the thing. Actually was seeing how slow I could still make it work. Turns out, pretty effing slow. 

 

This is how I feel about riding the MK.  So much fun at slow speeds and on crowded and/or narrow trails.

[barryj]

4 hours ago, daveo said:

Bought an SG Soul 164, Apex Gecko Free, Burton Driver X, Flow NX2-GT even bought after market liners for my Drivers and then I realised I preferred hardboots for literally everything. What an effin' waste!

Ditto!  

[Beckmann AG]

6 hours ago, bobdea said:

so, took out my Kessler SL today. 

Ohh

my

god

I’m seriously questioning spending so much time in softboots now....

I have not felt good, or even comfortable on an alpine board in years. Today it just worked. 

 

 

Surface today was almost uniformly 'match grade'.

[bobdea]

2 hours ago, Beckmann AG said:

 

Surface today was almost uniformly 'match grade'.

Yeah, was insane 

[JRAZZ]

18 hours ago, bobdea said:

its starting to delam, this upsets me. 

 

 

18 hours ago, bobdea said:

 

 

Roasting a board over an open flame tends to do that

 

[dhamann]

19 hours ago, bobdea said:

 

limbo line!

more torque/g's from hardboot equipment for sure. then there's snowboarding...

[AcousticBoarder]

21 hours ago, Jack M said:

Love it.  You should really try my Kessler 168.  For my taste/style/location, it is the holy grail.  My quest for the perfect short board is at an end.

If @bobdea doesn't take you up on that, I so want to!

I am still really trying to find a used 168 somewhere. I don't know I can justify spending that much on a new board when I have never tried it...

[davekempmeister]

when one Kessler arrives at it's end the thing to do is get another.

[2012Alpine1]

JB Weld it back together. Couple of big C Clamps and two 2x4's use something thin to get the epoxy in deep, good as used!!  My NSR tail delamed 3 years ago still holding strong. But yes my Kessler 180 has something about it that makes it bite more. Not as forgiving as the NSR. Would love to try a 168 Kessler though would have to try it before buy it cause in my mind its too short. I do wish my 180 was shorter though.

[bigwavedave]

On 3/26/2019 at 12:39 PM, bobdea said:

So, what’s the closest thing now that doesn’t say Kessler on it? That’s as much as what this thread is about, what’s a comparable replacement? 

As of now the closest thing I’ve been on are coiler NSRs.  

163 SG Full Race Titan. I loved mine, except that I don't love racecourse sidecuts that require extra input to complete turns. Still, an amazingly fun board! If you like that open ended sidecut, you should consider trying one (provided you're in the rider wt range). I definitely see more SG's on a NorAm race course than any other board. Might be just because they have similar performance for less money than Kessler or Oxess? World cup races seem to have a more even mix of the top boards. Virtually all SGs are standard builds, so you can pick up a used one and know that it will be the same build as any other used one. 

There seem to be a number of custom K162s on the used market that are built for women (smaller) racers, and they feel like they have a tighter sidecut and softer flex. A telltale sign might be if they have a narrower waist than the  stock 20cm....But, you asked about "not Kessler"...

For a new custom build, that costs less than a new stock SG, the Thirst SF 162 is easily as good or better than the 162SG I had. The first time I rode a Thirst (a Superconductor) the feel of the carve reminded me of the feel of a Kessler carve (I've owned a few Ks). One difference that I liked was it was easier to complete turns compared to the typical racecourse sidecut. And you won't want to put those Hangles on it, even if it had the inserts. 

I think one of you stick-in-the-mud Yankee skeptics has to be the first to get on a Thirst. And I say this with all due affection, having grown up in RI,  lived in VT and spent time sailing the coast of Maine. I know,  you're thinking how can some hillbilly from Montucky come out of nowhere and make boards comparable with the best boards out there? And where is Montucky exactly? It doesn't even sound like a real place...

I haven't ridden an Angrry . Only rode an MK and 163 REV once on rough ice. Not the best conditions to form an opinion. But they all might be contenders.

 

[bobdea]

2 hours ago, bigwavedave said:

163 SG Full Race Titan. I loved mine, except that I don't love racecourse sidecuts that require extra input to complete turns. Still, an amazingly fun board! If you like that open ended sidecut, you should consider trying one (provided you're in the rider wt range). I definitely see more SG's on a NorAm race course than any other board. Might be just because they have similar performance for less money than Kessler or Oxess? World cup races seem to have a more even mix of the top boards. Virtually all SGs are standard builds, so you can pick up a used one and know that it will be the same build as any other used one. 

There seem to be a number of custom K162s on the used market that are built for women (smaller) racers, and they feel like they have a tighter sidecut and softer flex. A telltale sign might be if they have a narrower waist than the  stock 20cm....But, you asked about "not Kessler"...

For a new custom build, that costs less than a new stock SG, the Thirst SF 162 is easily as good or better than the 162SG I had. The first time I rode a Thirst (a Superconductor) the feel of the carve reminded me of the feel of a Kessler carve (I've owned a few Ks). One difference that I liked was it was easier to complete turns compared to the typical racecourse sidecut. And you won't want to put those Hangles on it, even if it had the inserts. 

I think one of you stick-in-the-mud Yankee skeptics has to be the first to get on a Thirst. And I say this with all due affection, having grown up in RI,  lived in VT and spent time sailing the coast of Maine. I know,  you're thinking how can some hillbilly from Montucky come out of nowhere and make boards comparable with the best boards out there? And where is Montucky exactly? It doesn't even sound like a real place...

I haven't ridden an Angrry . Only rode an MK and 163 REV once on rough ice. Not the best conditions to form an opinion. But they all might be contenders.

 

Ahh, the small kesslers for me finish really well. It’s the 185, that one, yeah I hear you on not finishing the turn. It might be that my current 162 was built for a racer that wasn’t chris Klug so he was probably around 150-170, softish flex. 

The wide SG looks enticing! 

[bigwavedave]

15 hours ago, bobdea said:

The wide SG looks enticing! 

I would venture to guess the wide is significantly stiffer than the 20.3cm width, but I don't see a suggested rider wt range posted anywhere, so just a guess. The 20.3 is quite robust and many would consider it stiff. At 185lbs it worked well for me and it really liked to be driven hard. 

[daveo]

1 hour ago, bigwavedave said:

I would venture to guess the wide is significantly stiffer than the 20.3cm width, but I don't see a suggested rider wt range posted anywhere, so just a guess. The 20.3 is quite robust and many would consider it stiff. At 185lbs it worked well for me and it really liked to be driven hard. 

Mmm I was actually gonna buy one because I found a demo with 3 days on it for EUR600. But didn't. Spoke to Elizabeth and some dude called Sigi Grabner or something about it over email. Apparently it makes for a really good casual-carve-the-whole-mountain board. I haven't ridden it so can't confirm, plus I'm a lousy rider so my opinion means nada.

Not available with inserts except 4x4 so my take from this was that it was not intended to be raced on. May or may not be correct.

[bigwavedave]

18 minutes ago, daveo said:

Mmm I was actually gonna buy one because I found a demo with 3 days on it for EUR600. But didn't. Spoke to Elizabeth and some dude called Sigi Grabner or something about it over email. Apparently it makes for a really good casual-carve-the-whole-mountain board. I haven't ridden it so can't confirm, plus I'm a lousy rider so my opinion means nada.

Not available with inserts except 4x4 so my take from this was that it was not intended to be raced on. May or may not be correct.

...So...it's stiffer, softer the same flex as the reg width? Not meant for a bigger rider with big feet? Just curious, 'cause the reg width 163 is also a good all around the mountain board, like most SL boards are; very versatile turn shape.

[daveo]

Just checked. It is simply made for riders with what he described as 'tall' feet. Sorry no mention of stiffness. My guess is it's the same.