slopestar Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 I'm thinking we should all just start straight lining. This carving thing is not healthy for longevity in snowboarding for carvers. Between Sean and David getting smoked from behind in Europe and recent near hits here daily in CO, is it really worth it for the turn? Interested in your thoughts. I think painting a big bullseye on our backs is the only thing left to do. Interested in thoughts, educating the public/patrol? I think it's time that the General Public, those without passes watch a safety video before entering the slopes like if you were going to drive a go kart. I'm being a bit sarcastic/comedic here as we have all had close calls but seeing videos of good riders getting clobbered or nearly getting clobbered is getting really old. How do we stop it, spread awareness...? I don't know the answer but I'm about to clock myself on Strava doing 70mph in a beginner zone just for kicks and to raise awareness... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd Job Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) Water inject all of the groomers. Most of the general public would immediately euthanize themselves over a period of several years. Do not normalize easy to ride equipment and increase the barrier of entry into the sport financially and equipment wise. No participation trophies. Most mid-western hicks high-speed tucking with their starter jackets, shit skis, and no helmet can barely afford the sport. Just price them out. Also, the parents of local race teams are throwing so much money, that the barrier into various ski race programs is low. So you get 8 year old yahoos high speed snow-plowing because mommy/daddy have a household income of over 500K (not hard to do in CO; over 1 mil HH income is fairly normal in CA/NY). Edited February 27 by Odd Job 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keenan Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Maybe we are looking at it the wrong way. For years I've been wearing bright colored jackets, so people can see and avoid me. This doesn't seem to work. Maybe it's "target fixation theory", if you look at an object you will hit it. When riding trees, or mountain biking, look for the space, don't look at the trees. Maybe people are so in awe of us that that they fixate on our awesome skills, and hit us. Maybe wearing white, top to bottom, and blending in is the answer. I have less close calls when it's snowing so hard I can barely see. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slopestar Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 9 minutes ago, Keenan said: Maybe we are looking at it the wrong way. For years I've been wearing bright colored jackets, so people can see and avoid me. This doesn't seem to work. Maybe it's "target fixation theory", if you look at an object you will hit it. When riding trees, or mountain biking, look for the space, don't look at the trees. Maybe people are so in awe of us that that they fixate on our awesome skills, and hit us. Maybe wearing white, top to bottom, and blending in is the answer. I have less close calls when it's snowing so hard I can barely see. Certainly people pass at the wrong time. They try to pass without making a sound. And instead of passing close after the apex, they shoot across as we reach the apex of the opposite turn. As we sling shot back to the point they thought we wouldn’t be. Gapers will gape… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) There's one particular cat track on our hill that I'm terrified of. I feel unsafe even when doing smallest turns on it. However, it's slightly too steep to do it without any speed checks. Edited February 27 by BlueB 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pow4ever Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 saying goes - “NEVER ARGUE WITH STUPID PEOPLE. THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL AND BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE.” IMHO - we held ourself at higher standard. Educated when we can; but recall when i was a pimple face 15 years old... do i take advice from some old geezer yelling at me? probably not... Put ourself in other people's shoe and write a letter from their perspective - i am not making excuse for ignorance but i was also ignorant once. When growing in resources constraint - i don't get to do fancy winter sports. I would image when given the opportunity - i have something to prove: faster i go it show the world how good i am. plus speed give us a sense of flying/freedom. let those who have not sin cast the first stone.... I see some carver "buzz" ppl... accident takes 2 be safe out there. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWM Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 (edited) I was hit from behind by a straight liner just after the apex of my 3rd heel turn of the season. What a start. The collision ejected the guilty party off the run and into shallow snow, dirt and rocks. They broke some of their equipment but no bones. It was a situation entirely of their own making. Edited February 27 by TWM 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortcutToMoncton Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 There is nothing new under the sun… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladia Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 It is getting worse and I have been sliding hills over 55 years. One must be on constant watch who is above you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st_lupo Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 One thing I happened to realize recently is that while I generally pick a lane and stay in it, I really get off on carving close to the trail edge/obstacles (half a meter or less). This year there was a close call where luckily the person sneaking up approaching from behind wound up bailing before hitting me. It finally went up for me that a person behind me picks the wrong side to pass on, the gap between me and the trees can disappear really quickly. Given the choice they will pick hitting me over a tree any day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chouinard Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 It’s a lot of things. When I ride regardless of whether I am trying something new to improve or simply making turns I am processing multiple variables: forward surface conditions, proximity to fix and movable objects, projected turn radius, pitch variation, speed, center of mass position over the edge, etc., etc., etc. Those things are being processed either consciously or subconsciously but they are happening with the feeling of the carve as feedback. Being hit from behind is because the culprits are either incapable of those thoughts or simply don’t care because they own the pitch. How many times have you stopped a run to wait for traffic VS. how many times have you seen others do the same for you? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softbootsurfer Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 2 Skiers and a Boarder meeting up yesterday... 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slopestar Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 3 hours ago, softbootsurfer said: 2 Skiers and a Boarder meeting up yesterday... so much truth right here 3 hours ago, Chouinard said: It’s a lot of things. When I ride regardless of whether I am trying something new to improve or simply making turns I am processing multiple variables: forward surface conditions, proximity to fix and movable objects, projected turn radius, pitch variation, speed, center of mass position over the edge, etc., etc., etc. Those things are being processed either consciously or subconsciously but they are happening with the feeling of the carve as feedback. Being hit from behind is because the culprits are either incapable of those thoughts or simply don’t care because they own the pitch. How many times have you stopped a run to wait for traffic VS. how many times have you seen others do the same for you? NPC (Non Player Character) "NPC" stands for "Non-Player Character" and is used as a metaphor to describe someone who is perceived as lacking independent thought or blindly following trends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pow4ever Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 hahaha. Everyone is the main character of their adventure. Subjective reality vs objective one. everyone else is a NPC. What happen to Ladia/Barry really give me the dread/hibbie jibbies. I don't want that to happen to anyone. we also don't want to hit other - if they got hurt - it doesn't matter who is at fault that is unnecessary burden we don't want to carry. I mentioned it a few time in the past on similar topic - we can't let fear paralysis us and we can't not just be ignorant of the risk. Finding the best way to minimized risk my pet peeve are: i tend to let ppl go first; but many ppl tend to stop when they see you stop. Once you start going; they start going. <enter jackie chan meme here> people who just follow you because it look so cool. road to hell is build on good intention. They meant well but please give me space. i am not always in control all the time lol... i might end up kill us both. survivorship bias - by luck that we advance enough to be able to make turn taking up less real estate and much more predictable in our turn, and have extra cognitive capacity to be aware of the surrounding - chance of getting hit become lower but not zero. Burden of knowledge is a heavy one. Much easier to just sit in front of TV and zombie out lol... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st_lupo Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 6 hours ago, softbootsurfer said: 2 Skiers and a Boarder meeting up yesterday... Warren Miller's Human Cen... Never mind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slopestar Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 Anyone have thoughts on how to educate the public/ raise awareness? Resorts spend tons of money building terrain parks with all kinds of rules and signage along with park staff to support and maintain. Some resorts are dedicated to skiing only. Why not dedicate a no passing run like our friends at Turner (during Montucky event) or perhaps a straightliner only space. I mean these are extreme examples but food for thought. Thanks all for your input. I too nearly got creamed by someone this past Sunday from behind of course 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neanderthal Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 A few years ago I was a victim of a 60y M straight-line skiier. Mid week nearly empty resort and a run I only saw one person other than my family on the whole day. Metronomic carving taking only 1/4 the width of the hill. Hit from behind and lights out - tobagan ride down and they wanted to transfer me to local hospital. The skier broke bones and took the 1st ambulance and I elected to go to my local hospital 1h away where I knew some people to get checked out which meant CT and for my protection a drug test just so I could disprove any claims that may be made against me as the other guy was certainly going to surgery. All said thousands of dollars lost including a trip the next weekend which was my Dad's last time on skiis. I am now more often in the trees than groomers because of this occurrence - I has totally changed my riding style pushing me to sidecountry. Sure the skier code assigns blame to the uphill skier but rules are defined by consequences and I have (other than perhaps Paltrow) never heard of real legal/financial pain imposed on offenders. So what can we do? I propose a croudfunded legal fund to aggressively litigate when this battery occurs. While my event did not occur at an Ikon or Epic resort with the consolidation perhaps a class action. This sort of insurance would easily be worth a full price day ticket each year for me. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carvin' Marvin Posted February 27 Report Share Posted February 27 Seems like y'all aren't riding fast enough. But in all seriousness, I started checking my 6 on every single turn instead of every other. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slopestar Posted February 27 Author Report Share Posted February 27 5 minutes ago, Carvin' Marvin said: Seems like y'all aren't riding fast enough Truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWM Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 (edited) 1 hour ago, slopestar said: Why not dedicate a no passing run like our friends at Turner (during Montucky event). A no passing dedicated carving run is an idea I’ve had. I’ve also recently seen pictures of huge orange signs at ski areas that say “no straight lining.” It’s now become a broader problem that carvers have been acutely aware of for some time. I think a general crack down is good. It’s so bad where I ride, with both congestion and out of control beginners, that it often takes minutes of waiting for traffic gaps. Edited February 28 by TWM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 (edited) At Mt Bachelor, there are signs around the lift lines with a photo of a snow angel that say something like “You were going 50, she was 5”. As a parent, it hits me all in the feels, not sure how the typical <insert stereotype> sees it… Seems like other well-designed on-slope visual campaigns would be worth a go. Edited February 28 by Alan 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortcutToMoncton Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 4 hours ago, neanderthal said: So what can we do? I propose a croudfunded legal fund to aggressively litigate when this battery occurs. While my event did not occur at an Ikon or Epic resort with the consolidation perhaps a class action. Yeah, that’s the solution — litigation and legal fees is really gonna fix this problem. Good lord, America. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 Head on a swivel ALL the time. Ride early in the morning or late in the day. Ride steeper terrain - no one straightlines serious pitch. Never be going across the hill below a knoll or drop off - you're invisible. Ride REALLY aggressively rather than defensively - big deep carves at the highest speeds you're comfortable with - my experience (I'm kind of large) has been that people stay away for the most part. Riding in a nice, contained, predictable rhythm really should work but doesn't - there's always some fool trying to fit where there's no room. Random aggression and a sense of ownership works better in my experience 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Utah Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 Yo @Keenan I purchased exactly what you need. But I keep losing the anorak every time I take it off… 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted February 28 Report Share Posted February 28 52 minutes ago, Jonny said: Never be going across the hill below a knoll or drop off - you're invisible. The number of skiers and boarders who don't ride in a way that they are able to stop within the terrain they can see! So many people come over knolls and drop offs at speeds where if there is something there they have no chance of avoiding a collision. You wouldn't drive your car that way, so why ride that way? It's all part of a mindset of "I enjoy going fast, get out of my way!" 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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