Input from the community for developing a Alpine Snowboard specific Zipfit liner.

[slapos]

12 hours ago, bigwavedave said:

Hope they fit Jack. Zips are the first liner that I forgot I was wearing them. Highly recommend using a heated boot bag. Happy feet!

 

 

heated boot bag works super well with these liners - each day you have fresh fit on your feet.

I am starting a season nr 4 in my Grand Prix liners - have 100 plus on them now and they are definitely the best liners I had.

Imho they beat the foam injected liners in terms of foot hold, comfort and above all - how long they last!

[Bobby Buggs]

I have developed some medial ankle pain in my boots over the years. Nerve damage has caused atrophy in my lower right leg so theres not a ton of mass there anymore.  Any thoughts on how to resolve it. 

Where do I get the heated Boot bag?

[Jack M]

These aren’t going to work for me. I believe I have a very low volume situation and there is simply nowhere for the material to go. The liner bunches when I flex forward and I really feel it in the boot. I would need liners with a “bellows” section of thin material on the sides where this is happening:

not flexed:

flexed:

Otherwise the quality of construction is off the charts.  The inside is nice leather.  The viscous cork molding material really seems to work well.  The forefoot is stretchy neoprene with a shearling wool lining.  I can see why people rave about them, when they are a good match for the foot and shell and the room between them.

[bigwavedave]

They look too small for your lower leg. Maybe try the next size up. When laced up, the cuff on mine completely encircles my leg and almost meets over the tongue.

[slapos]

@Jack M

Would taking omfit out do any good ?

 

@Bobby Buggs

https://www.amazon.com/Rossignol-Hero-Heated-110V-Boot/dp/B07GFP3KQV/ref=sr_1_6?keywords=heated+ski+boot+bag&pd_rd_r=6b550b4c-0469-4718-b298-c63c10fbe33e&pd_rd_w=34pRz&pd_rd_wg=6zdS6&pf_rd_p=4fa0e97a-13a4-491b-a127-133a554b4da3&pf_rd_r=VCD1K5HNPCW6CEATXMVC&qid=1638209999&qsid=139-6450354-9508059&sr=8-6&sres=B07P7D6C3F%2CB07GFP3KQV%2CB0028DVU8S%2CB06XTRKHDQ%2CB09CYZ775X%2CB07X5VKFBY%2CB07GJFYT88%2CB099K4Y5BF%2CB08199V59F%2CB09GJGP8TM%2CB00WF8Y5WO%2CB08FQXB4YT%2CB099JZ7SQ1%2CB083ZR63M4%2CB081634BWF%2CB09FLCYTHW%2CB09CY8W2HS%2CB001ASHA68%2CB09CTVVJ92%2CB00289P8SA&srpt=SPORT_EQUIPMENT_BAG_CASE

Here is one, but I would look at other cheaper options from different brands 

 

In Europe they are much cheaper 

https://www.blue-tomato.com/en-PL/product/Bootdoc-BD+Heated+Ski+Boot+Bag-492725/?varid=303255445&cr=PLN&_$ja=tsid%3A46445&adword=Google%2FPL%2FPRODUKTERWEITERUNG%2FBootdoc%2F303255445

 

 

[Jack M]

3 hours ago, bigwavedave said:

They look too small for your lower leg. Maybe try the next size up. When laced up, the cuff on mine completely encircles my leg and almost meets over the tongue.

My bootfitter was certain there wouldn't be room in the shell for the 28.5.  Zipfits go in whole size increments on the half size (26.5, 27.5, 28.5, etc).  The C shells are specified for 27.0 to 28.0.  Holding these Zipfits up to the stock liner, they are the same length.  Also these are a new model, maybe they're different in this way.

2 hours ago, slapos said:

Would taking omfit out do any good ?

Not sure what you mean.  Anyway I was allowed to try them for 2 days and then I had to make a decision.  Back to Intuition for now.  I'm sure the Zips work great for others.

[slapos]

10 hours ago, Jack M said:

My bootfitter was certain there wouldn't be room in the shell for the 28.5.  Zipfits go in whole size increments on the half size (26.5, 27.5, 28.5, etc).  The C shells are specified for 27.0 to 28.0.  Holding these Zipfits up to the stock liner, they are the same length.  Also these are a new model, maybe they're different in this way.

Not sure what you mean.  Anyway I was allowed to try them for 2 days and then I had to make a decision.  Back to Intuition for now.  I'm sure the Zips work great for others.

I have a 28,5 MP GP liner in C Shell - Before purchase I spoke with @MountainSlopea they told me the space inside of the C shell was enough to accommodate . Maybe this is more about the shape of your feet.

Omfit - this is the cork composite that goes in the the liner. At least in GP you can add or take out as much as you need. I would expect the same in yours.

I would not give up on Zipfit that easily knowing what sort of performance it can deliver. 

 

Maybe zipfit GARA low volume would be better for you? - Sry my bad you checked already!

Edited November 30, 2021 by slapos

[bigwavedave]

8 hours ago, slapos said:

I have a 28,5 MP GP liner in C Shell - Before purchase I spoke with @MountainSlopea they told me the space inside of the C shell was enough to accommodate . Maybe this is more about the shape of your feet.

I would not give up on Zipfit that easily knowing what sort of performance it can deliver. 

@Jack M Funny, I wrote a response yesterday suggesting you try the next size up (28.5), but it got lost. I must not have saved it.

After Slapos response I just checked my Zips, and they are also 28.5 in a C shell. My foot measures 27.5, but I use footbeds and maybe that's how I ended up with 28.5's. I don't remember exactly how I arrived at that size. I depended on advice from here and the Zip dealer and a bit of faith, as I was not able to try them first.

[Jack M]

Maybe I have weird feet.  One weird thing is one measures 28.0 and the other is 28.4.  With the Zipfit Gara Stealth 27.5, I couldn't even close the boot.  Instant NO, do not proceed.  The Corsa seemed like a good fit until flexing caused the bunching.

Out of appreciation for my bootfitter (Happy Tunes) accommodating my free demo, I purchased a pair of 28.0 Intuition Race Plugs he had in stock, which are also a tongue/lace-up style liner.  Unfortunately They're not going to work for me either as the cuff is just a bit too short (just reaches the top of the shell) and the cuff is reinforced with plastic.  In my case there's just too much material around the cuff and it squeezes my leg too much.  Next try will be the Intuition Plug Wrap.

Anyone want to buy a pair of 28.0 Intuition Plug Race?  Molded once, used 4 runs.

[hknz]

On 11/30/2021 at 12:11 AM, Jack M said:

These aren’t going to work for me. I believe I have a very low volume situation and there is simply nowhere for the material to go. The liner bunches when I flex forward and I really feel it in the boot. I would need liners with a “bellows” section of thin material on the sides where this is happening:

not flexed:

flexed:

Otherwise the quality of construction is off the charts.  The inside is nice leather.  The viscous cork molding material really seems to work well.  The forefoot is stretchy neoprene with a shearling wool lining.  I can see why people rave about them, when they are a good match for the foot and shell and the room between them.

I guess the problem comes from the leather interior. Leather is not elastic but neoprene is. I have several pairs of Zipfit liners (all neoprene) and I remember none of them bunches/deforms like yours.

Your Gara 275 should be a good fit with your 951 shell C. Don't go for 285 liner, as larger liners take up even more volume of the boots.

Your shell fit is just 1-2mm less than mine. I think I can still wear the boots if it is 1-2mm shorter. Therefore, I think if you take out some zipfit "omfit" cork-like material from your Gara 275 (using plastic tubes), there is a high possibility that it just fits.

Mind you that, you have to use "alpine racing" method to wear your liners and boots. (youtube below)

In addition, you can remove the spoiler ("the black plastic") at the rear cuff of the boots to increase the volumes.

I use Shell A with zipfit 245. Feet average lengths are 251.4 & 252.9. (maximum measurement is about 254.4)

 

Edited December 2, 2021 by hknz

[bigwavedave]

On 11/30/2021 at 12:50 PM, Jack M said:

Maybe I have weird feet.  One weird thing is one measures 28.0 and the other is 28.4.  With the Zipfit Gara Stealth 27.5, I couldn't even close the boot.  Instant NO, do not proceed.  The Corsa seemed like a good fit until flexing caused the bunching.

Out of appreciation for my bootfitter (Happy Tunes) accommodating my free demo, I purchased a pair of 28.0 Intuition Race Plugs he had in stock, which are also a tongue/lace-up style liner.  Unfortunately They're not going to work for me either as the cuff is just a bit too short (just reaches the top of the shell) and the cuff is reinforced with plastic.  In my case there's just too much material around the cuff and it squeezes my leg too much.  Next try will be the Intuition Plug Wrap.

Anyone want to buy a pair of 28.0 Intuition Plug Race?  Molded once, used 4 runs.

Can't you get another pair of the stock liners that worked so well for you? @MountainSlope?

[Jack M]

11 minutes ago, bigwavedave said:

Can't you get another pair of the stock liners that worked so well for you? @MountainSlope?

Yeah but I want to try the Intuition Plug Wrap.  I think it might be even better than the MS, and I think I like a wrap better than a tongue.  But I did enjoy the MS liners for over 100 days.

9 hours ago, hknz said:

I guess the problem comes from the leather interior. Leather is not elastic but neoprene is. I have several pairs of Zipfit liners (all neoprene) and I remember none of them bunches/deforms like yours

That could be it.  I get the impression maybe the Corsa is for hella stiff ski boots that don't hinge much.

9 hours ago, hknz said:

Your Gara 275 should be a good fit with your 951 shell C. Don't go for 285 liner, as larger liners take up even more volume of the boots.

We didn't go with the Gara Stealth because the boot wouldn't even close during the test fitting before molding.  Maybe removing some of the cork would have solved that, but the bootfitter didn't think so.  While our feet might be a similar length, maybe I have a higher arch or just a bigger volume foot, I dunno.

[TLN]

Is there a consensus on recommended zip fit? Grand Prix? Would like to check em out in person, but would prefer to know what to look for?

Also, size up or down? 

[bigwavedave]

I'm using the Grand Prix/Freeride ZipFits in MountainSlope  .951 boots. My feet measure 27.5 (one is slightly larger), and I went with the 28.5 to allow room for footbeds. I even modified the liner to allow for more flex. I have an old knee injury that prefers a softer, easier flex. 

There's a sidewinder version of the Freeride that is stiffer and is likely prefered by more aggressive riders. 

There's a new model coming out in December called the GFT designed for AT boots, in other words more forward flex. I'd be interested in those myself. I wouldn't be surprised if they were partly the result of input from this thread which was started by ZIPFIT asking for input for a carve specific liner. One of the features requested was more forward flex compared to a ski boot specific liner. Zips already had excellent heel hold.

If you're able to try the different models in person, then get the one that fits best and allows the flex you desire. Can't go wrong that way.

[pokkis]

I have GrandPrix and i use exact size ie closest to my feet size

[pow4ever]

17 hours ago, hknz said:

I use Shell A with zipfit 245. Feet average lengths are 251.4 & 252.9. (maximum measurement is about 254.4)

interesting!  you are using a smaller size liner so it take up less volume but have not issue with the length.
Do you still preferred Zipfit Tour/Diva for alpine snowboarding?

speculation - 

MS shell shell size range are wider(one shell size cover 3 mondo ranges instead of 2)? compare to other boots and combined that with liner variation that cause mis-match in impedance? 

on top of that different weird shape of foot... for those in between-er it's a crap shoot.  maybe i need to go up in shell size and go for higher volume liner...

 

 

[hknz]

Re: pow4ever,

• A bit shorter length of zipfit is not a problem because the toe part of the liner is elastic. Also, I think zipfit 255 have be a little too large for Shell A. For people with BMI under ~25, I suggest down one size for boots and liner. But I cant tell which size to choose for heavier people.
• I only have tried Tour/Diva (same model actually) which are very good! I cant comment on other models. My skier friend has Gara which I think is too stiff for my taste for alpine snowboard. (I am just 135lbs best shape, 155 worst shape) I have previously requested Zipfit to offer liner with more flex and there will be a new model "GFT".
• MS shell is in 15mm interval/increment.

 

Re: Jack M,

• When I first tried my shell A with MS stock liner, it was hell difficult to close the boots. It was hardly closed with the help of the the store staff, using widest slots. Imagine my feet expanded the shells. I just bought it trusting my shell- fit (hardly one finger) and having a good discount offered by the store (I guess they though there was not much people can fit into that shell)
• I think your shell-fit (space behind heel and above instep) can tell whether the shell is ok for you.

Edited December 3, 2021 by hknz

[bigwavedave]

If you haven't checked their website recently, models have changed.

https://www.zipfit.com/

[Bobby Buggs]

hknz

How did you get that black stuff off. Im about to try. I dont think I need the plastic under the black stuff either. Can that be removed ?

 

Edited December 5, 2021 by Bobby Buggs

[hknz]

Bobby Buggs

I dont quite get what you describe. There is only one black stuff, which is official named "spoiler" (a piece of plastic screwed to the boot cuff). And there is no plastic under the black stuff.

What you need to do is to unscrew it. remember to keep the black stuff and other little stuff in place in case you want it back afterwards.

This is what it looks like after the remove of the black stuff. Hope it helps.

[Bobby Buggs]

I dont think we have the same design. There is nothing to unscrew. Mine is the same as the video of the guy taking the shell off and on. 

Edited December 5, 2021 by Bobby Buggs

[pow4ever]

Buggs:  hknz is talking the spoiler that's part of the MS 951 boots. 

that black plastic on the top right of the boot - for ppl with normal size calf to take up some room.

the video might be just talking about power strap and other plastic that's stitched on to the bladder?

 

[Bobby Buggs]

Yes Im not the smartest one on the board 

[pow4ever]

8 minutes ago, Bobby Buggs said:

Yes Im not the smartest one on the board 

smarter than me my friend
 

On other note:  Did we ever get confirmation from Zipfit that GFT is designed for alpine snowboard?
seems taller and designed for touring (for optimal forward flex and ROM(range of motion).

At one point Zipfit had the diva/tour liner but can't find much info on them now.
From various video/internet -

From Sven:  (maybe it have since evolved)

"The basic design of the liners is pretty consistent across the line, and some models differ only in the amount of omfit present when you buy them. However, there are other minor differences that are worth attending to - the leather lining takes up slightly less space than the usual neoprene lining, and the 'stealth' cuff covering seems to take up a little more space than the leather coating, and quite a bit more than the plain plastic of the 'classic' model. The tour and diva models have slits cut into the plastic at the back of the cuff to provide space for larger calf muscles, or to enable a more upright stance. These may not seem like big differences, but, IMO, they can have a significant impact on comfort and performance depending on your particular shell and personal preferences."

TOUR & DIVA

The TOUR and DIVA models have a unique, elastic and comfortable neoprene spoiler and snow-collar for easy walking and climbing in all AT and Telemark boot models. The DIVA is tailored specifically for women's smaller sizes.

Both models have also proven very effective for fitting short legs and large calf muscles.

Zipfit DIVA and TOUR work well in high-performance ski boots, which can have excessive forward lean ankle angles and quad stress. This Zipfit model is designed to allow skiers to stand up straighter, reducing stress on the knees and the quads.

TOUR & DIVA have the same prepacked OMFit volume as the GRAND PRIX and are available with both Neoprene and leather inner lining.

[slapos]

1 hour ago, pow4ever said:

Buggs:  hknz is talking the spoiler that's part of the MS 951 boots. 

that black plastic on the top right of the boot - for ppl with normal size calf to take up some room.

the video might be just talking about power strap and other plastic that's stitched on to the bladder?

 

Who is sharing my foot pics without proper credits ?

 

Why would you take out the spoiler? I personally like it but got chicken legs so...

Edited December 5, 2021 by slapos