bjvircks Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 back to the topic... I ski quite a bit around carvers when I make trips out west. I must admit that deep trenches can be quite the surprise if you do not expect them. I have learned to pay better attention to snow conditions right in front of me... especially when skilled trenchers are around. But I do not get thrown by the ruts... I know how to work with them. It is kind of like railroad tracks and bicycles. If you cross a track wrong it grabs you and throws you over. A skilled skier typically has no problem with our trenches. I believe it is the folks who have convinced themselves that they are skilled (when they are not) that are having the trouble. We need to face it.... there are a lot more of them than us. Resorts will protect where their big $$ comes from... and it ain't us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted March 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I'm with BlueB. Screw 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I had a patroller (yes, a patroller) say he thought we (those of us at SES) were being selfish by ruining runs for others. I couldn't think of a proper reply and said something to the effect of "hey, it's only once a year that we all get together like this." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pusbag Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I'm glad our mountain supports us carvers. I get more compliments then complaints by far. Skiing and snowboarding are hazardous sports and are part of the game. So people need to please grow up and take responsibility for there own actions. Hey bj I like the "dukes of hazard". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tilledog Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 That's great video of some ruts being produced by skiers and boarders alike. Screw this guy and others alike. Would we start measuring rut depth and appoint a governing body to decide what's too deep? Sounds like he might be a communist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big D Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 So I am not the best rider in the game and a good year for me is 15 days, however on occasion things click and I lay down some pretty deep trenches. The fact I am hauling around 280 pounds surely assists me in my winter excavation activities. Now on one occasion I saw a lady ski a bit parallel to my rut and slip into it, she lost her ski and went down. She was unharmed and I will admit I chuckled a bit. This would be the negative. The positive is that all the little kids love me as they use my ruts as half-pipes:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queequeg Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 "Anybody who can't get over a few ruts in the groom is more of a danger to himself than anything. Maybe you should consider a different sport??? like maybe television?? Either that or go back to ski school, Priss." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDogDave Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I'm glad this topic came up. I was about to venture starting a thread because of what I have been experiencing this seaon at my local hill. This is my fourth full season on alpine boards. Because of some great mentoring (Northern Montucky boys) I have some basic skills and this year have been able to leave trenchful memories most runs. I have been on Ski Patrol at this hill for 20 years now. The first 5-6 years as a skier, then mid 90's started boarding...one of the first on our patrol...and now hardboots 95% of the time. Last year the Hill manager started giving me crap about the trenches...sometimes in fun but sometimes a serious tone of "you are messing up my mountain...people are gong to hurt themselves falling on the trenches". This year he has confined me to one area of the mountain, has expressed his displeasure to the patrol director and last week told me not to encourage anyone else to do this stuff or he'll ban it from the mountain. I admit, I've handed out dozens of Bomber cards yet,,,the hill manager has ran out of his office to take pictures of me carving down to the lifts, put the pictures on their web page and has told me he really wishes he could do this. I'm treading lightly (but still carving deeply) as to not ruffle powerful feathers. I get alot of positive feedback from patrons...especially kids...who cheer as I come down under the lift and alot of the park rats who try to follw my trenches on their soft boards then ask how in the world do I do that. But ,,someone must be complaining. Maybe they dont complain to me...cause I'm wearing a patrol coat. But the pot is being stirred. We have no documented cases of injuries resulting from my trenches. Anyone else in the carving community have similar problems with management??.....Any suggestions??..I wonder if this would be happening if I had a season pass instead of a Patrol coat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik J Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 What's the point of hardbooting if I can't leave a trench? I ride Trench Diggers. I have not encountered any really negative situations of people complaining about me. If I have I've forgotten about it. You N.I.C.E. guys are obviously a bunch of hooligans. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queequeg Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I was about to venture starting a thread because of what I have been experiencing this seaon at my local hill. ... I wonder if this would be happening if I had a season pass instead of a Patrol coat? That's a bummer about the pissy management at your mountain. It's really unfortunate when whiners end up working in management. Unfortunately, it just seems so often the case that these are the guys who are so motivated to work their way up through the ranks ... the control freaks ... they want to inflict their demands upon anyone unfortunate enough to have to tolerate them. Frustrating. Anyone who would complain about an itty-bitty six inch trench has no place managing a ski resort, that's for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 On the video you will note a young skier in a colorful one piece suit... Just get him to follow you around doing the same thing!!!... Explain this is what happens when you can ride !!.. Explain its all on the level and if they are complaining they are on the wrong hill capable of staying in control..doh!!! Most even the old have loved the carving...At the loaf.. almost all who ever saw it and I was on the chair with, during ECES's have loved watching it.. Anyone who knows anything is going to commend the riding it takes to make carve trenches, the rest need to take lessons.. and stay on the greens so they don't get hurt.. if he can't handle riding through a trench Im now worried about him, hitting me in the back cause I was in his line!!!! I hear the comment on hazard about 5% who talk to me.. but all it takes is one to complain.. the ones that like it don't have time to bitch!!;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted March 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 BigDogDave, I would work that angle of demanding documented cases of people getting injured by your trenches. I would also be ready to turn in your cross if it comes to that. Agreed with Shred, at "my" mountain, Sugarloaf, attitudes are more expert biased. Carving is the goal for a lot of the skiers, so they respect what we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xy9ine Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Carving is the goal for a lot of the skiers, so they respect what we do. been noticing this more as of late. cool to see more skiers putting down clean lines. makes me *almost* want to try out some of the new twinplank hardware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Prokopiw Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 is that it has some good carving by both skiers and boarders in the same 4 minutes as the angry skier.The vid makes a very good case in favor of carving by any and all who aspire to it.The angry skier just proves that where there are people having fun, kooks like him will be there to try to kill the buzz.Of course our group buzz was alive and well despite his efforts:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loc Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Oh boy, I'd love to put this guy's whining at the beginning of the video for SNES.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sultan Guy Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I was thinking. What if lots of people complained to a ski area about snowboard carvers leaving big trenches? Would they try and shut us out? Prohibit certain areas or runs? Not let us come on weekends? Remember they run a business first and foremost. As a business you need to listen to the largest group of customers and do what you must to keep their business. Schweitzer invited us to come. What if this guy gets management's attention with a letter and we don't get invited back next year? I certainly hope to never to see some of us banned from a resort but it does make you think. (back to making my ruts...for now!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 been noticing this more as of late. cool to see more skiers putting down clean lines. Yup you are right. Our friend Petter is at Cypress almost every day, laying some mean double trenches, most of the time. There are few other good ones. More and more instrctors become better at carving every year. And, we have Cypress Ski Club kids shredding on the weekends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrutton Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 Around where I board the angry skier(s) complain about snowboarders scraping the snow off the run. They'll probably always find something to whine about. Hope to be refining my trench digging ability next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted March 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 I was thinking. What if lots of people complained to a ski area about snowboard carvers leaving big trenches?Would they try and shut us out? Prohibit certain areas or runs? Not let us come on weekends? Remember they run a business first and foremost. As a business you need to listen to the largest group of customers and do what you must to keep their business. Schweitzer invited us to come. What if this guy gets management's attention with a letter and we don't get invited back next year? I certainly hope to never to see some of us banned from a resort but it does make you think. (back to making my ruts...for now!) A policy like this would be impossible to enforce at any resort of significant size. Maybe at some mom-n-pop hill where they can be more like a club. They'd have to put "rut police" all over the place and pull over anyone making a line. Skiers, good softbooters, telemarkers, snowbladers, whatever. If they were to ban hardboot alpine snowboarding, personally I would go get a metal BX board, some Flows or FR2's, stiff softies and rut the krap out of the joint right under every chair. Then I'd go get some SL skis and do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 hey Russ and Troy and Kram.. at least you have a long lasting slogan for the shirts next year and beyond.. "Creating Hazards Since 2011" RSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sultan Guy Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 "Rut Police" :lol: If I ever see that happen.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allee Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 If they were to ban hardboot alpine snowboarding, personally I would go get a metal BX board, some Flows or FR2's, stiff softies and rut the krap out of the joint right under every chair. Then I'd go get some SL skis and do the same. I managed to leave some pretty substantial ruts at Nakiska on a BX/softie setup a few weeks back. So that would be the deal, if your hill wanted to get stupid about it. It's definitely more an issue this time of year though, with the groom softening up. We can have a bunch of five or six of us at Nakiska on any given winter weekend, where there are small children and learners by the gazillion, and we trench it up and nobody cares. But there were a couple of spring days last year where four or five of us really did make a mess of the upper runs - in the end, even we had to be careful about getting caught in the trenches. I can well imagine people being annoyed. What's the answer? I guess just be respectful, point out that there are many hazards on the hill including skier created moguls and bumps, and remember that if you paid for your lift pass, you have as much right to be there as anyone else. Did we get any "hooligan" letters to the editor in Aspen this year? That was my fave part of the SES - to open up the morning paper and see which bejewelled and befurred fossil was complaining about us today ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobD Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 "Rut Police" :lol:If I ever see that happen.... "we have a rutcident under chair four. send a groomer. I'm going after him now - for riding while inclinated" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pusbag Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 Hey all, I have Schweitzer management behind my event. All I really need is a big turnout next year since they have given me two years to host my event,then they will down evaluation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonzo Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 I'm glad this topic came up. I have been on Ski Patrol at this hill for 20 years now. The first 5-6 years as a skier, then mid 90's started boarding...one of the first on our patrol...and now hardboots 95% of the time. Last year the Hill manager started giving me crap about the trenches...sometimes in fun but sometimes a serious tone of "you are messing up my mountain...people are gong to hurt themselves falling on the trenches". This year he has confined me to one area of the mountain, has expressed his displeasure to the patrol director and last week told me not to encourage anyone else to do this stuff or he'll ban it from the mountain. But ,,someone must be complaining. Maybe they dont complain to me...cause I'm wearing a patrol coat. But the pot is being stirred. We have no documented cases of injuries resulting from my trenches. Anyone else in the carving community have similar problems with management??.....Any suggestions??..I wonder if this would be happening if I had a season pass instead of a Patrol coat? The experience on my patrol is quite different than yours. The general manager is also a member of our patrol. He has told me that Alpine boarding is the next thing he wants to take up (and I have offered to teach or better yet, hook him up with a really good PSIA instructor that knows what he is teaching). I mainly get ribbed by my fellow patrollers for spending too many days on a board and not enough on skis. My patrol director would like me to work on senior, and apparently, you can't earn that on a board. I never get any grief over trenches, because the capable skiers can lay them down as well. One of the questions on the accident form that we ask the injured guests is for them to describe what happened in their own words. I don't ever recall a guest saying that they were injured by hitting a rut. As it says (paraphrasing) on the back of every lift ticket: Skiing and boarding are inherently dangerous sports....natural and man-made obstacles may exist... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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