bjvircks Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 the absolute least he could have done is have the decency to speak english! :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Jasey-Jay Andersen Plate System Described in Detailhttp://www.radio-canada.ca/emissions/decouverte/2009-2010/Reportage.asp?idDoc=104372&autoPlay=http://www.radio-canada.ca/Medianet/2010/CBFT/Decouverte201002211830_2.asx boy, that video does show the advantage of a plate, watching how little was being transmitted back to his legs when the board was all over the place. so, anyone want to translate that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Vist Plate in excellent condition , used , including shipping to all lower 48 States for 450$ delivered. Save 100$ or so off new. lol, that's a good translation..... any more details you can share on the new tinkler ones? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyser Soze Posted February 25, 2010 Report Share Posted February 25, 2010 Someone may be able to tidy up the tech sections a little, but here's the translation: His kingdom is the mountain. His universe is snow. His life is alpine snowboarding. At 34, Jasey-Jay is a snowboarding veteran in this country. A four time World Champion, the Quebec rider is only missing an Olympic medal. His dream might materialize thanks to a little piece of equipment, his plate. "I've always had equipment trouble, and now the little problems are simply adjustments, not actual problems" Surrounded by snowboards and technology, he has completely invested himself in the development of a special plate that you see here strapped to his board. This is the result of months of design and testing with his colleagues. This board could make all the difference in Alpine Snowboarding for the Canadian team. "The plate looks a lot like the plates you see on skis, but but we've developed a mechanism that adapts better to a snowboard. The idea is to build up torsional energy in the board, and for the board to have a more natural movement" IN PGS, the athlete's talent is alternating and accelerating through turns, kind of a weight transfer game. In competition, along the curves and terrain of the track, the board is subjected to serious torsion and flexing. These powers sometimes work against the pressure applied by the rider, forcing him to lose control. That's what the plate attempts to correct "The energy built up is better controlled with a plate, Much less jerky (he literally said "jerky"), less counter-forces are created." ***ANIMATION*** On a traditional board, the feet mounted directly to the board create pressure points and limit the flex. "So you're working against the board, because the board tries to flex towards you through the turn, and you're trying to flex against the board. The plate disassociates the two movements." With the long, stiff carbon-fibre plate fixed to the board, the pressure exerted by the rider is applied to a wider surface. ***ANIMATION*** When fixed to the board, pivots and anchors are going to move in plate's runners. The board will thus be able to act freely to the torsion and flexing movements as they go down (Jasey bending the board) "Making noise, that's beautiful music." "A natural curve equals speed. I mean, as soon as you have a distrotion in the natural curve, it creates friction which reduces speed. The plate lets the board take it's more natural curve". The plate gives the rider better control of the board through the turns as well as absorb the vibrations of the track. Jasey-Jay tried his new plate last fall. Since then, Canadian athletes have been accumulating podiums finishes in the World Cup, as they did here; in Telluride, USA. Of course, Canada isn't the only country with a plate system, but JJA believes this plate could be more effective than the others. That's why they've been trying to disguise the plate from any preying eyes. "Here you can see; it's pure carbon-fiber, which is very nice, so we've made it ugly and less attractive to discourage other people from wanting to copy it, and for it look more simple. We used "vélo trip" (something to do with a bicycle) to camouflage the side, because it had to be flexible, and for the mechanism to still be able to work. Also, it's really ugly. Same with our faux-wood sticker, it was just there for camouflaging purposes." Will the plate make the difference between his 5th place in Turin and a podium in 2010? Jasey-Jay hopes so. "It's going to make a difference in Vancouver for sure, it's what we've been working so hard for. The idea is good, the concept is good. We've already seen results with plates that are far less advanced. So... This is a winning recipe." For Jasey-Jay it would be the accolade of accolades before his olympic retirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjvircks Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 OK... Olympics have come and gone... can we see the Apex system now? Please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Front of plate slides relative to the board, now to see the rear. SunSurfer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Hey, he's got something white under those F2s! Extra damping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarvingScooby Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Hey, he's got something white under those F2s! Extra damping? Yeah, it looks like it's a raiser/cushion, the plate isn't giving enough dampening I guess:rolleyes: Found underneath Nicolien F2 binding, is it same? RT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarvingScooby Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Found these pics of Nicolien after the game. Anyone can help? Thanks RT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Now its time to work on getting affordable for the rest of us.. Will we see the plates be usable with a standard 4 hole pattern or are we seeing the beginnings of different hole patterns for different plates.. which would shuck! Just need Bruce V to make a plate.. at least we know it will be affordable..!!!:rolleyes: If you leave it up to Europe all your going to get is way overpriced stuff and then half goes to shipping!! At least we get to look forward to lighter plates instead of draggin around a Boat Anchor!! not to mention the chair lift torture ride on the knee.. I believe the old F2 conshox had an actual wood core and constructed with glass.. Not sure.. but I had one.. but did not cut it apart.. seems there should be away to make it less expensive.. I can't believe the Vist is so much.. if you look at the material.. two aluminum plates an plastic side rails....$500 bucks?? whaaaaaa:smashfrea RSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowrider Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 I think the results prove the next level in boarding will come with a well matched plate and board system. Agree or Disagree ??? The fact that not ever winner in every race rides one but the fact you can charge harder and not suffer the pounding that can throw you around will eventually convince most to embrace them. Challenge to all tinkerers "create an open source link to design and build the next generation plate for the masses". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 I'm still wondering what's with the big long "diving board" part of the plate that sticks out in front of the front binding. I saw yesterday during the race that there is nothing underneath it, no bumpers or anything. So is it supposed to contact the board when the board bends up a lot? Or is it a tuned mass damper? Shred, remember my email? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 All these boards with all these inserts are looking like swiss cheese!!:) Im sure the revolution has started.. Im sure if you get an economical damper plate board system, it will fly.. I think I saw on Tylers system it had bumpers in the front of the plate.. Man 3 sets of TD3's and 3 plates.. thats gonna cost me.. I think if its priced around $150 they will sell...hint...:rolleyes: Ok $250 but thats as high as I go.. ... maybe....;) RSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 from what I saw at the game the white things under jasey's Bindings is cutting board. And also I heard the apex plate will be sold for 1000$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjvircks Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Bingo! pretty much as I expected. The 2nd photo in post 107 best shows the front attach of the apex plate. Jack, I think that when the front of the board gets to a certain amount of flex the front of the apex plate contacts the board. this causes the apex plate to flex, creating increased force into the board at the attach point. This in turn causes more flex in the center section of the board, in a sense offloading the front of the board. Or maybe not... it all depends on a combination of the location of the binding, the location of the board attach, the length and stiffness of the diving board out front and the stiffness distribution along the length of the board. All of these are obviously custom tailored to the rider through trial and error. However, I see a very modestly priced adaptable version of this system being available to the recreational rider very soon ! What this system does is allow the rider's stance to be what the rider needs and the board's loading points to be what the board needs. In this way both can be optimzied to work with each other rather than conflict. EDIT: Also... and perhaps most important... plate stays essentially flat most of the time yet board has natural flex (and torsion?) along full length (no dead spots). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjvircks Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 I really want to get a close look at the slots and pins underneath the bindings! The teaser photos we've seen so far only whet the desire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maciek Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 The hits to the board and rider come from the front of the board, so the front should be floating. This is how WC racers set up their Vist plates. Fixing the front and floating the rear will do something, but it won't be as effective. Consider mountain bikes. If you couldn't afford a full-suspension bike, would you rather have only the front or rear suspension?user error? Well as far as I remember that is hit during turn entry phase that's so important if I am correct. that explains. I thought of more when rider sits more to the rear to accelerate and when "rear" foot gets more load then... perhaps it does not matter as much as driving tip precisely with no hits, but I thought it could give some less stress to legs. This is especially when someone has line that crosses others going through ruts ;) Anyway perhaps riding technique has changed a lot over time of my absence :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maciek Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Some of the boards with combination systems of TNT Boards + Plates and Snow Stix = Sweet ride. It reminds me 3D finite element designed developed Nitro board that was not flat on top. It was around '98/99. Many said it was chattering anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xy9ine Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 I'm still wondering what's with the big long "diving board" part of the plate that sticks out in front of the front binding. I saw yesterday during the race that there is nothing underneath it, no bumpers or anything. So is it supposed to contact the board when the board bends up a lot? Or is it a tuned mass damper? random guess from a neophyte - maybe provides a leafspringesque two stages of board stiffness. ie, when the board is front loaded, the plate prevents the board from excessive flex / folding, while allowing a softer board flex (that might track rough snow better than a stiffer deck) than you could conventionally get away with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjvircks Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 from an Apex video Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjvircks Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 - maybe provides a leafspringesque two stages of board stiffness. simply put, yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 seems there should be away to make it less expensive.. I can't believe the Vist is so much.. if you look at the material.. two aluminum plates an plastic side rails....$500 bucks?? whaaaaaa:smashfreaRSS maybe Vist is the same price as a hangl due to knowing people would pay as much? from what I can tell the hangl system is more complicated for a outcome that's not any better than Vist. although, a set of Vist plates for skis runs you pay $200 or more and with the snowboard version you're basically getting 2 sets. so, Judging by that you're getting the same deal. http://www.coloradodiscountskis.com/store/product817.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maciek Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 from an Apex video That looks like almost complete loss of edge feedback. Do you really want this? Just a raw impression of me is that some compressing material like plastic along edge would still allow for more gradual flex while giving some minimum feedback to riders feet about what happens with edge. Maybe it is just my personal bias, but it feels like driving progressive powersteering car where you do not get traction feedback almost at all vs. driving race car steering. Simlarily with suspension when you can have smooth transitions, but no traction feel due to car body roll. That seems like requiring some super sensitivity from a rider. Forgive me, but that's what I remember from long time ago... and you may consider this irrelevant today. Have good runs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 There are shots of JJA's plate with a big rubber/foam dampener under. Look at that video that someone posted. I'll do a crop later, after hockey. Maybe it's up to rider, if he wanted the dampener or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.oldsnowboards.com Posted February 28, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Wait till you see some of the videos of these plates in action, close up. Amazing movement. There are a number of parties looking at production options. Keep in mind the market is relatively small. Much like the high end bindings we all enjoy. If they were mass produced in China, the price would come down. I am sure the concepts and designs will see allot of change over the next year or two. PS. SNOW STIX !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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