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SBX Question? After watching Olympic guys today.


Flyin Hawaiian

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As an alpine guy I would say watching SBX is a close 2nd to watching PGS. I use to notice a few guys on alpine setups. Now they are pretty much non-existant. What gives? I would think a custon all-mnt with variable sidecut would work great in a SBX course. Doesn't hard boots, plate bindings, stiffer board, and long effctive edge = speed, precision, quick turns, deep carves, and less chatta. I'd like to hear some info from people in the know, thanks, just curious.

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hardboots aren't as good for recorvering from a mistake, near fall, collision, etc. although the silver medalist in Torino was a very very close second, in hardboots.

i was going to say the same thing

That Seth fellow who won gold in '06 (and today?) was saying in a interview he barely nosed out a guy in hardboots at the 2006 games

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In addition to what the others have said, the top boards are quite a bit like you explained. Longer effective edge with a variable sidecut so that the boards can still be very manuverable yet not so hooky and can glide through a larger turn. See the Kessler BX review by blueb for a bit of insight in how these boards work.

Ink

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Alpine setups would have prevailed yesterday. However. They have been driven out of sbx. They do not want them in there for many reasons. First. They dont like hardbooters mixing it up with the rest. Second. Its looks funny on tv. Third. There is an agreement amoung sbx'ers to use the same gear. Just like the agreement amoung them not to sport speed suits. Fashion plays a role in this equation.

If you observe most of the crashes that occured yesterday, you will notice that most of them happened during toeside turns. Those guys would "break at the waist", pressure the front foot too much, loose pressure on the back foot and spinout. Most mistakes were just toeside spinouts. Look at Seth's time trial. Notice Nate in the final ect. ****, I just blew a race on Sat and Sun doing the same thing on softboots! I really believe that raceboards would have kicked ass in those conditions. But they are not welcome in sbx. Yes, you can use one but not without getting **** for it. USASA doesnt want them either. They must have rounded tails in order to be "legal". Ok thats fine for saftey but what about skierX? Rounded pole tips? Either way, the best riders have the ability to rock both setups. Graham started as a racer and he can rock both. Remember Jeep King of the Mountain. They switched to soft boot format for TV quality.

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Wow sounds like the new style SBX boards would be great for all mountain riding and carving. You could ride them with plates and be ok since you're not going off 20ft jumps and 30 degree bank turns. Are the competition boards too tuned and engineered for recreational riding? I see some pop up on the classifieds every now and then. I'm always tempted to make a purcahse and try one out.

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There is an agreement amoung sbx'ers to use the same gear. Just like the agreement amoung them not to sport speed suits. Fashion plays a role in this equation.

Actually not just an agreement anymore - FIS rules specifically prohibit speed suits

2705.6 Competition Clothing.

SBX competition suits must be two piece – pants and separate top. Form

fitting speed or downhill suites are not permitted. Non protruding body protection

and padding is recommended. Protective equipment i.e. back protection

must be worn on the body. No straps, fastening devices or other

methods can be used to tighten the suit material closer to the body

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ugly BX course they've set up...ugly to watch compare to the torino race..

Anyway what is making me really happy is to see that despite all the money involved, its only two small snowboard brands that are able to make boards able to win in the olympics BX and PGS...

it points out a few things:

1. to make boards able to win races you really need to be a good shaper, and there is only a handful on the planet it seems.

2. you don't need an incredible shaper to make a board able to win the pipe event ( i personnaly hate all kind of things that are not judge by first arrived or clock...subjectivity should not be a criteria in any olympic sport so not a big deal).

3. no big sponsor thought of putting his brand name on a kessler or a oxess for the races or BX...( remember Isabelle Blanc Hot board ( tropical tube inside))..

N.

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Alpine setups would have prevailed yesterday. However. They have been driven out of sbx. They do not want them in there for many reasons. First. They dont like hardbooters mixing it up with the rest. Second. Its looks funny on tv. Third. There is an agreement amoung sbx'ers to use the same gear. Just like the agreement amoung them not to sport speed suits. Fashion plays a role in this equation.

.

Are you getting your info first hand from World Cup racers????

First there is no "agreement" about speed suits. Its a FIS rule.

Second they Hardboots would have been a disaster in those conditions. Super soft slushy snow.....Hardbooters would have been over edging everything.

Third guys don't ride hardboots, simply because they do not perform as well as soft boot in SBX. Most of the start features have tight trannys, which usually buck hardbooters in the back seat.

If hardboots were better the riders would ride them. Its that simple.

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Not claiming to be an expert by any means but I don't know if hardboots were the answer today either. When Jacobellis was DQ'd in the semis it was because she lost her balance off of a jump and over corrected on her heelside edge sending her flying through a gate. No way hardboots would have helped there.

I think that if you switched the equipment on everyone in the field you would simply see people falling on different areas of the course. As mentioned earlier in the thread, the rhythm section at the start would be a nightmare. While more people may make it through the banked turns unscathed, I think we would see more wipeouts following each of the jumps.

Also as has been mentioned over and over again, softboot technology has improved a lot over the last few years. I can carve pretty well on a 4 year old Atomic freeride board with some stiff Ride bindings and good boots. Of course it doesn't match up to a hardboots setup in carving at speed, but I'd be a lot more comfortable airing 20 foot gaps in softies.

Just my 2 cents. I'd love to hear from BX riders who have competed in both that can give some more detailed pros and cons

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I am a hard boot rider of 22 years, and now retired racer and current coach...

I ride Kessler race boards, and this year one of my athletes got a 163 Kesssler SBX board..

It is the most stable ride I have ever set foot on. More solid than my GS or SL sticks.

As Phil stated, a race oreinted board would have been a disaster in SBX.. The snow conditions are perfectly suited for what these guys are riding on--

custom made Oxess and Kessler sticks designed for SBX. Hard boots- while they remain my livelyhood, simply do not have a place in the SBX course 99% of the time.

Go ride a current SBX setup, then realize what you've been missing!

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One thing that bugged me about the Torino SBX race was that the guy that got second in hardboots was clearly faster and was killing speed to keep from running over Wescot. Whenever he tried to pass, Wescot seemed to seemed to make erratic manuevers to block him or make it risky to pass. Are there any rules regarding passing/blocking, right-of-way?

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Love to watch SBX, but with the ladies it is much like watching womens hockey, there are only a few maybe five world class boarders. Hopfully with Mielle's Gold, we in Canada get start producing world class SBXers on the womens side. I believe we have good ones coming up in the mens but not sure about the girls

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I have a question for philfell or other insiders. Is metal a big issue in BX at the moment?

Oxess seem to build boards with metal as well as without. Many BX riders seem to be on boards without metal or am I mistaken?

The 2011 SG (Force Pro Team) is a non-metal construction and according to Sigi many riders prefer this setup.

Is it just personal taste? What´s the difference?

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hey Neil where you been??

I am a hard boot rider of 22 years, and now retired racer and current coach...

I ride Kessler race boards, and this year one of my athletes got a 163 Kesssler SBX board..

It is the most stable ride I have ever set foot on. More solid than my GS or SL sticks.

As Phil stated, a race oreinted board would have been a disaster in SBX.. The snow conditions are perfectly suited for what these guys are riding on--

custom made Oxess and Kessler sticks designed for SBX. Hard boots- while they remain my livelyhood, simply do not have a place in the SBX course 99% of the time.

Go ride a current SBX setup, then realize what you've been missing!

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One thing that bugged me about the Torino SBX race was that the guy that got second in hardboots was clearly faster and was killing speed to keep from running over Wescot. Whenever he tried to pass, Wescot seemed to seemed to make erratic manuevers to block him or make it risky to pass. Are there any rules regarding passing/blocking, right-of-way?

As I understand it the ever famous "downhill rider has the right of way" applies but the important thing to remember is, it's called "Boarder CROSS...like motocross block passes, riding defensively and all manner of aggressive riding is part and parcel of the game hence the reason so many of the good riders are big dudes. On the Plus side most people know that if you can't make a clean pass you might go down and not finish so looking for the hole is still an art

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One thing that bugged me about the Torino SBX race was that the guy that got second in hardboots was clearly faster and was killing speed to keep from running over Wescot. Whenever he tried to pass, Wescot seemed to seemed to make erratic manuevers to block him or make it risky to pass. Are there any rules regarding passing/blocking, right-of-way?

If Zidek was "clearly" faster in Torino, then how did Wescott pass him in the first place?

It's the job of the person in the back to make the pass. Not the job of the person in the front to let the guy by.

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I have a question for philfell or other insiders. Is metal a big issue in BX at the moment?

Oxess seem to build boards with metal as well as without. Many BX riders seem to be on boards without metal or am I mistaken?

The 2011 SG (Force Pro Team) is a non-metal construction and according to Sigi many riders prefer this setup.

Is it just personal taste? What´s the difference?

There are pros and cons with Metal in SBX. Some perfer it others don't.

Last summer we were lucky enogh to have demo SBX boards from Oxess, SG, and Kessler. Some of our riders liked the Kessler's better, others liked the Oxess, and yet others perfered the SG.

So far this year our riders on the Oxess boards have had better placings then the other boards, followed by the Kessler crew. Hard to tell if it's the boards though, the guys are so damn good they could probably ride a board from either company and finish just as well.

I'd suggest trying to find a way to demo a board from each company. They all ride a bit differently, and you have to find the best fit for you.

I got to look at a few Apex boards when I was in South America this summer, and they look pretty good also. I'd love to get a few of those to try out.

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If Zidek was "clearly" faster in Torino, then how did Wescott pass him in the first place?

It's the job of the person in the back to make the pass. Not the job of the person in the front to let the guy by.

Well if you watch Wescotts interview, he says quote :"zidek was clearly on a faster board"

zidek made some mistakes,another wescott quote: "he was ahead but then he left the door open"

if the finishline was another 10 yards ahead zidek would have passed him back.

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