Da ultimate challenge: 360 carve on snowboard

[D-Sub]

Thus I propose challenge: post video of carving 360, on snowboard, without tail spin. Who's up to this? :rolleyes:

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[FTA2R]

is the only one i've ever seen, "cheating or not," so if i see anyone pull off even a "cheat 360," i'll be impressed....

listen up people, i can do a 160!!!!

i refuse to try this on a weekend in the mid atlantic...entirely too dangerous...if i can go to mac this year, i'll take video (unless someone has an actual video cam, which would work better)

[Buell]

I tried some last year on different terrain. Not even really close. As FTA2R says though, be sure the run is clear. The look on peoples faces when you have made it 180 and are heading straight at them is pretty interesting, even when they are still far away.

[quest4powder]

After reading the 'can U do a 36o' threads the last few years (all w/o video) I was stoked to give it a try. I found I could get a carved 360 around if I did it on a gully trail, carving up a steep, high wall (w/ packed snow) on the side of the trail. What worked for me was to come in fast on one trail and carve a hard heelside up the steep wall. This provides enough speed to ride the up the intersecting wall and to accelerate back down to complete the circle-arc.

There's probably other ways, but this is one way that has worked for me.

________

Granny live

[Guest Jamar]

Almost made it last year, or at least it felt that way:o...noticed the inside circle for EC arm, and the confused skier:). The mess at the top was going back and trying to make a smilie out of it. Lots of fun, feels similar to a 360 carving on a fully laid down in windsurfing.

[P06781]

It is accualy very easy if you find right terrain, steep hill that flattens and then turn up. kind of natural, moderate "half pipe" if you try in the right place it is piece of cake, anybody can do this.

MHM has a couple of spots like this and its not too hard with the right snow. Think of carving a slight bowl like feature similiar to skateboarding and not digging too hard to transfer the energy through the turn with minimum drag. I have done it before but going very slowly at the end . Perhaps we need a "360" contest with some way to document it (video).

Jim

[Mike T]

MHM has a couple of spots like this and its not too hard with the right snow. Think of carving a slight bowl like feature similiar to skateboarding and not digging too hard to transfer the energy through the turn with minimum drag. I have done it before but going very slowly at the end . Perhaps we need a "360" contest with some way to document it (video).

Jim

That would be a blast at OES - as long as nobody minds a little skating, the bottom of the steeper pitch on I5 would work.

[P06781]

That would be a blast at OES - as long as nobody minds a little skating, the bottom of the steeper pitch on I5 would work.

Good idea Mike! You need to scout out some spots at Bachelor that would work . I know with the group of riders you had last year that one of us would be able to pull it off with the video running.

Jim

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

MHM has a couple of spots like this and its not too hard with the right snow. Think of carving a slight bowl like feature similiar to skateboarding and not digging too hard to transfer the energy through the turn with minimum drag. I have done it before but going very slowly at the end . Perhaps we need a "360" contest with some way to document it (video).

Jim

Exactly, it is about the terrain. Haven't bothered doing it for a few years, old hat really. When it stops dumping in a week or so and groomers firm up we will get some video Jim.

Key, everyone tries to do them too tight. Too fast. It is about terrain and staying on board radius. The way most folks TRY to do it, is not the way to get it done.

But hey, no video, last time I did it I was still the guy with the camera/ video. Not much has changed. Why don't you cheap 6astards buy a 100$ camera with video??

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

It is accualy very easy if you find right terrain, steep hill that flattens and then turn up. kind of natural, moderate "half pipe" if you try in the right place it is piece of cake, anybody can do this.

Exactly, this is a fact. Bingo!!!

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

I'm still seeing a lot of talk about it "I did it a long time ago...", "my friend did it", "some other story of a Bigfoot sighting." ;)

Now I'm not trying to censor anyone by discouraging them from posting their empty claims... but this thread is asking for a VIDEO of it because they are already dozens of posts talking about it... just no video... and that's what I, Vahur, Carvedog, and others want. So please, if you don't have a video to back up your talk, please consider not posting until you do

Get the honey out son, it will make it easier to eat your words.

[lonerider]

Get the honey out son, it will make it easier to eat your words.

I know you are a lazy person and too lazy to bother to actually read all the post in the thread (like last time you completely were something wrong because you posted before reading the entire thread - remember? you admitted it)... so here.

I totally think it's possible... like Vahur... all I keep seeing people post "I saw someone do it once." That's not what this post is for... either post a video of it... or go out and keep practicing.

Again... Vahur (original poster) specifically asked for VIDEO... not talk as he's seen loads of it talk, but no videos. I totally believe some of you have done it... but we want to SEE IT, else you are wasting bandwidth. Do-you-understand-the-words-coming-out-my-mouth?

[pokkis]

One thing, to ride proper 360 degrees, groove track should be bout circle and start and end bout same place. Otherwise it is more or less tailspin 360.

[Vahur]

One thing, to ride proper 360 degrees, groove track should be bout circle and start and end bout same place. Otherwise it is more or less tailspin 360.

I don't mind if track is circle, ellipse or rectangular, as long as it's carved ;)

[D-Sub]

I don't mind if track is circle, ellipse or rectangular, as long as it's carved ;)

If I ever learn how to carve a rectangle I'll quit.

[jtslalom]

I don't mind if track is circle, ellipse or rectangular, as long as it's carved ;)

I would love to see a rectangle but I was thinking more on the line of polar coordinates and coming up with a cardioid.

[philw]

[...]Vahur (original poster) specifically asked for VIDEO...

Tough.

I nailed my first one in Utah last season. I don't have a video, but I do have a GPS log which clearly shows the circles!. That's a day at Brighton, so there are a few tracks but the loops are in there.

I had tried this off and on piste for a good few years. The difference between failure and success was simply the board. Last year I switched piste boards to a F2 SL 163, and it carved a 360 the first time I tried it on the first day with the new board.

I picked a fast shallow on-piste "bowl" section where two pistes joined - there was enough camber on the sides of that to give me some assistance on the way around. I need to polish it now: get the loop size down; increase the exit speed; make it on different terrain.

[Peter Vu]

Just curious, isn't Jamar's picture show a fully carved circle?

His last bit of trench was pointing downhill before his (her?) snowboard got off the edge.

It is not a video but one can imagine the carving process involved.

I like the smiley face in the process with his/her hand down the snow in the middle of the turn. :)

[Steve Prokopiw]

I do the tail spin all the time to show off for people on the lifts,but like everyone else I am striving to achieve the holy grail of a clean and complete circle.I have a much easier time on my freestyle board with it's wide waist and shallower angles,but the Oxygen proton 168 I have been riding lately feels like it can get me there.I am also going to try it soon on a Nidecker Proto 154.

[b0ardski]

There's a couple good spots for this at schwietzer & I've managed some ellipses on hero snow, but that's not purely carve. the nidecker 165 might be the tool to get me there this year,but since I don't have video I won't post until I find a camera man on a hero day:D

[P06781]

One thing, to ride proper 360 degrees, groove track should be bout circle and start and end bout same place. Otherwise it is more or less tailspin 360.

I think they are easier if you start wide and then hook the last 1/4 with a tighter but clean carve (no spinning).

Jim

[Guest 4000]

Sorry. . . this is another "I used to do it all the time" post. . . but I did. It's really not that hard. Unfortunately, it will be difficult for any of you to do this using your current set-up.

Stiff carving boards are designed to bomb down hill at high speed and hold an edge at high speed. The tight tails are designed to kick you into your next turn. Ever try carving tight turns on your carving boards while going ultra slow on relatively flat beginner's trail? It just doesn't work. You need to get going to push an alpine board to flex. To accomplish this challenge, you don't need more speed, the trick is figuring out how to hold an edge when you're going ultra slow.

Not sure if this challenge alone warrants going out to look for a board like this but what you need is . . .gulp . . .a freestyle board that's softer longitude wise but still has a great deal of torsional stiffness. Then you'll need to mount your hard boot bindings on that board. It'll take just a bit to get used to but yup, you can carve damn hard with this set up. Edge to edge will obviously be slower and you won't be able to hold an edge at high speed when compared to an alpine board but what you gain is slow speed carvability. - this is what you'll need once your nose faces up the mountain. If you remember the good ol' days, I think you'll recall that many people used the hardboot/fresstyle board set-up.

Then all you need to do is build up some speed when approaching the flat area next to the chairlift lines and make sure you have a decent crowd watching. It's the way I used to end all my runs when I was a little show off long, long ago.

Any of you who are coming "close" with alpine boards can absolutely do this with ease with the above mentioned set-up.

[Guest Jamar]

400, you guessed my set up, almost.

That pics was done on hard boots on a wide Coiler AM, bombing down toward a big flat area, trying to keep constant radius and more importantly trying to keep my speed up.

No one watching, and esp. no one coming toward me!!!

[EnisiWaya]

Full loops Not full circles are not that hard given the right slope and snow conditions.

If you think of a real nice laid turn set of Christmas ribbon candy turns, You need to keep the edge pressure constant through the changes in gravity speed and centripital force.

Now take it to the next level for a full loop. As you come back up the mountain, you need to keep your speed up to maintain your centripital force. That is what will carry you through the top. This is done by gradually decreasing the radius of the turn. When you first start practicing as I think QueeQueg said, buttonhole turns. I call it a button hook turn. Take the board back up the mountain from a nice long trail wide carve and as you near the top use your legs and knees to bend the board and tighten the turn up as tight as you can while swinging your legs around yourself like extended rotation ( think of the tip of a helicopter rotor blade). That will get you started wqith going through the top.

Now add more speed and control. Change the turn shape to a lesser decreasing radius more like the begining of a French curve. When you come through the top at speed you will experince dis-orientation from the changing view of the mountain. My youngest brother a past stunt pilot, fighter pilot, instuctor had a trick that works. As you come up to the top don't look at what you are seeing but hold a vision frame in your mind of what you will see when you come out of the top back into the fall line, like maybe the base lodge! When the vison frarme clicks into place then you are back in control of your gravity and centripital forces and can open the turn up for the next trail wide sweeper on the new edge. They, fighter pilots , use this for learning outside loops.

Grandfather Wolf

[Guest 4000]

I didn't really realize that I was doing this myself until I had a video of my self carving at slower speeds long ago so some of you may not even realize that you're doing this already. The faster you're riding, the "quieter" you're upper body tends to be. You basically let your board, speed, and minute adjustments do the work. When you're attempting to carve at slower speeds however, you really need to do some work to pull off a clean turn.

I really can't seem to come up with a way to describe the whole thing with words but I think I can explain the easiest-to-explain aspect of the "slow carve". . . the arms.

When figure skaters or dancers attempt a spin, they use their arms to create momentum. What I've learned is that when I'm carving super fast, my arms are fairly quiet. When I carve slow, my arms help me create momentum. So in the beginning phase of a front side turn, my right hand is actually behind my right knee but by the time I finish the turn, it's already swept across my body and up and over to the left side of my face. (I've essentially drawn a mini arc with my hand) On the back side, I basically draw a mini arc with my left hand in the direction of the turn. The trick when pulling the 360 would be to make the hands feel like big, heavy pendulums and slow its motion down so that they don't draw the quick arc but help you guide you through the entire circle.

I don't know . . . at least that's the way I do it. Maybe I'll bring that mp4 phone with me on my next outing . . .