What's your favorite mass produced softboot carving board

[Neil Gendzwill]

36 minutes ago, Atom Ant said:

Regarding the "Cat Butt" comments... guys, come on.

Believe it or not, but many soft-booters consider our style to be ugly as sin.

[Jack M]

I would say if your boot size is significantly bigger than the waist width of all mass production boards then there is no mass production board for you.  (and me!)

[JRAZZ]

I've seen a lot of 27cm wide boards around. Unless you're rocking size 13's do you really need wider boards?

[Jack M]

I'm in US size 10 Burton Driver X.  My mondopoint size is 28.  That's a 28cm bare foot length, so it seems obvious to me that a 26cm waist like on so many "wide" boards is a dealbreaker.  My Winterstick Custom RS 166 (recommended) has a 27.5cm waist, same as a K2 Fat Bob.  I wouldn't want it any narrower.  I'd like a set of Gecko Stealths for even more insurance against boot-out.  I ride 30/15 angles.

[Atom Ant]

4 hours ago, Jack M said:

That exists in every activity

Indeed.  But bears warning here as not "every activity" is dying out.

[Jack M]

1 hour ago, Atom Ant said:

Indeed.  But bears warning here as not "every activity" is dying out.

Neither is this one. 

[lordmetroland]

6 hours ago, Atom Ant said:

Regarding the "Cat Butt" comments... guys, come on.  

I have been smote and repent of my wretchedness. Henceforth, i will not cast aspersions on this noble, coiled style as "silly looking." In feline solidarity, I will raise my bottom to the skies, my brothers. Not only on softer, surf-style Japanese boards where it is sometimes necessary, but on ALL boards, regardless of tail length or stiffness! As a show of good faith, here are some other things I no longer consider silly looking:

• Synchronized swimming
• Rhythmic gymnastics
• Cup stacking
• Jazzercise

Oh god, the boredom...

[JRAZZ]

27 minutes ago, lordmetroland said:

Oh god, the boredom...

FOCUS!

Have you gotten through the softboot carving worth watching thread? There's more work to do! Do not give up now!

 

Here's a picture of a cat butt to keep you in line.

 

 

Now back to the topic at hand! What other boards are good carvers? 

[Atom Ant]

1 hour ago, Jack M said:

Neither is this one

Disagree.  Replacement rate doesn't appear to me to be even 1-1.  I deeply love hard booting, Jack, to be clear, but I respectfully disagree.

 

32 minutes ago, lordmetroland said:

• Synchronized swimming
• Rhythmic gymnastics
• Cup stacking
• Jazzercise

Respectfully agree.

 

 

[softbootsurfer]

yea, always felt fortunate... 3 straps at 45 angles both feet size 10 US 27.5 mondo equals toe on rail heel on rail with no boot out on all the Burton Sticks for all the models through all the years...

A lot of the Images we see here, are at different points in Transition...knowing when to pull the trigger and from which angle can make Carving in SB look just as Wonderful as Carving in HB...I simply borrowed this Image from one of West Vids. on that thread...I personally think Style, shows up quite well in this Frame,.... of a Woman SB rider...no doubt the Alpine influence in these Sticks has helped bring that about as well...

 

[Jack M]

19 hours ago, Atom Ant said:

Disagree.  Replacement rate doesn't appear to me to be even 1-1.  I deeply love hard booting, Jack, to be clear, but I respectfully disagree.

People have been saying this sport is dying for 30 years, but here we are.  The gear keeps getting better.  WC racing is very healthy.  Fin used to tell me how he would sell slightly more bindings each year than the previous.  I'm confident I will never have a problem finding awesome new gear to buy, ever in my lifetime.

Sorry, tangent alert.  Back to mass produced boards...

[Dusty Bottle]

On 3/23/2020 at 8:15 PM, JRAZZ said:

I got to thinking that my quiver now has Coilers, a Donek, an Alloy, and a Never Summer in it. I guess you could say the Alloy DO is mass produced but it just doesn't feel mainstream like the NS Swift is. This season I tried a couple of K2s, Burtons, Sims, and Never Summers and came away thoroughly unimpressed. I mean yes, a good rider (which I am not) can carve anything but none of them had the pop, energy and fun of the Alloy DO. 

Tired of domestic projects, so....... okay, I'll play...

I too, have been thinking I have enough excellent high speed carving blades, so thoughts have turned to a SB carving tool to upgrade from the somewhat soft 163 Donek Twin (bunny hill ripper). I spoke with the Never Summer rep in December at one of the swaps, whose familiar with the LCI and highly recommended I demo the Swift 162, claiming it to be THE powder-to-chum-to-groom quiver killer. The following weekend, I demo'd a 157 at Lovey and check back throughout the day, but the 162 never come back in. Initial impression of the 157 on the catwalk was anything but stellar. The funky camber made it hunt around like an old pickup truck, with a worn out front end, but was pleasantly surprising on the run. When tipped up, it struck lines and ripped some impressive low-mid sized turns.  As speed increased however, it got busy and the short tail pushed out noticeably, which made we wonder if the increased length of the 162 (only 5cm?) might be more stable and hold a better line at speed. The demo tent guys suggested in absence of the 162 Swift, I try the 162 East, but it had an odd flex pattern and we didn't get along. Between teaching 3 grandkids (and their friends) to snowboard, busy life in general and now the resort season shutdown, I couldn't catch up to the NS demo crew, so just wondering your impressions... Everyone says get a D.O., but they forget I'm a 160# senior finesse carver and like boards built for my weight. Maybe a short D.O. vs Swift shootout, since you own both?

Ball's in your court and I'm bored... 

[Lurch]

17 minutes ago, Dusty Bottle said:

impression of the 157 on the catwalk was anything but stellar. The funky camber made it hunt around like an old pickup truck, with a worn out front end, but was pleasantly surprising on the run. When tipped up, it struck lines and ripped some impressive low-mid sized turns.  As speed increased however, it got busy and the short tail pushed out noticeably, which made we wonder if the increased length of the 162 (only 5cm?) might be more stable and hold a better line at speed.

Agree on those points & can't help but think how much better it would be in a full camber, even if it was micro. I was keen to try it in the split 167.

Loved it in deep snow, but think it would be better with a little bit more shovel rather than the pointy nose. Would lose some sex appeal though...

 

[JRAZZ]

I am uniquely qualified for this one! (I own or have owned all of these, except the East. Never the East)

1 hour ago, Dusty Bottle said:

 somewhat soft 163 Donek Twin

I am somewhat familiar with that board

If I was to compare the East to this board there is no comparison! The Donek is much more fun and stable at speed!

 

1 hour ago, Dusty Bottle said:

which made we wonder if the increased length of the 162 (only 5cm?) might be more stable and hold a better line at speed

No. It floats amazingly well in powder and is really maneuverable in trees. Mine was a demo unit (162) that I picked up for cheap so I really love it but it's not stable, oh no! The pickup truck comparison is very very apt. You are more than welcome to try it out next year but it rides almost exactly like the 157.

 

1 hour ago, Dusty Bottle said:

Maybe a short D.O. vs Swift shootout, since you own both?

Absolutely!

The DO (sword in Korean I believe) is by far the superior board in terms of stability, edge hold, and speed. The Swift is wonderful in tight area and can hold an edge very well but is not good at speed. What will surprise you about the DO is how not stiff it is. It's not a death plank (not sure about @slopestar's 165...) and the torsional flex is really nice! I was able to ride it all around Winter Park and even survive some mild moguls! The only downside of the DO is soft snow. It submarines way to readily, I don't use it in pow, that's about it. 

The bottom line is that the DO is just fun. I've had more than one offer to sell it but every time I ride it I fall in love with it again. 

 

So, if you're looking for the best carver the short answer is get a DO, especially if you feel the Donek is soft. Another option which you might like is the Jones flagship or Hovercraft.  If you are looking for a short-fat board (which can be fun) look at the Yes Optimistic and the K2 Simple Pleasures. They're cheap, fun and also somewhat softer.

[Atom Ant]

10 hours ago, Jack M said:

People have been saying this sport is dying for 30 years, but here we are.  The gear keeps getting better.  WC racing is very healthy.  Fin used to tell me how he would sell slightly more bindings each year than the previous.  I'm confident I will never have a problem finding awesome new gear to buy, ever in my lifetime.

Sorry, tangent alert.  Back to mass produced boards...

Totally fair, sir.  I have heard other things from other manufacturers that admit that without the SB sales, they would expect to slowly go out of business over the course of a decade or so.  Suppose it does indeed depend who you ask.

Best mass produced boards in my opinion are the Burton Custom X wide (I know I mentioned I am selling mine as it is not 100% for me, but in terms of mass produced off the shelf boards it is damn good).  Ride Timeless is another one, as others have mentioned.  

If you put carving aside for a minute, the old Rome Hammerhead was a ton of fun for me despite being painfully slow.  They put a special base on it that basically held no wax at all so felt like sandpaper on the snow, but it was bullet proof (designed for drops off street rails to concrete) to encourage the rider to ride like an absolute hooligan--see a rock that looks like fun to stall off of, or just ride across?  Go for it!  Bonus: the board looked so damn odd it I swear you could be next to a WC GS set up and no one would notice the racer--everyone would be staring at the Hammerhead.  Can't say I hated it.

[Neil Gendzwill]

49 minutes ago, JRAZZ said:

Another option which you might like is the Jones flagship or Hovercraft.

One thing about the Jones boards is that they aren't overly wide.  My 162W flagship has a 26.3 cm waist, you can get a 27 cm waist if you go for the 169W.  The Hovercraft doesn't have a wide size but its regular size is 26.4 in a 160, 26.8 for the 164.

I find with my stance of +12/+27 that I don't have much overhang at all with my size 10 Ions.  Currently lacking the skill to get the board over enough to boot out, but as I've said in other threads I didn't buy it specifically to carve, I just want it to carve well along with all the other things I want to do with it.

[JRAZZ]

11 minutes ago, Neil Gendzwill said:

One thing about the Jones boards is that they aren't overly wide.

That's exactly why I like them! I am not a fan of the short wide in general. The Yes and K2 are fun but aren't as stable as the Jones FS.

[JRAZZ]

btw, anybody have an opinion on GNU/Lib-tech or on Korua?

[pmorita]

Lib Tech - The Litigator and Grocer were my go to boards for years.  When magnatraction started showing up I bought old boards from Ebay until I finally switched to Donek Inclines.  Really miss the Libs for all mountain riding as I can't find anything similar.  Tried the Hot Knife and some Family Trees, but not the same confidence inspiring ride.  I would keep one around if the old ones weren't so damn expensive.  I see the Litigator and Doughboy were re-issued, but with the C3 camber and magnetraction.  Not for me.

Why not just get a Flux or Incline and be done with it?

[BlueB]

No Arbor lovers? All my A-frames and predecessors, D sereis, carved really well. A bit stiff in the nose, though... 

[TVR]

Lib-Tech has the big brother of the Hot Knife, the Dark Knife. Personally, when on softboots, I like this board. It can do carves and it's edge hold is very nice, especially where as I am in NE and we have ice. My kid (who is bigger than me now) rides it like a maniac, and has a blast. Seems they added a little material between the feet as well, which makes it feel stable at speed while the tip and toe is very poppy for pressing. Then again, who am I to do anything special to really see what it can do.

CONS: It isn't the best at any one thing. Good at everything, but doesn't excel at any one thing.

But if you're looking for a mass-produced board, it really isn't bad.

[boardguru]

I used to love riding my Rossignol Levitation 170 with hard boots.  Awesome at making trenches on hardpack, and 'float like a butterfly and sting like a bee in powder' board. Rossi doesn't make them any longer though. But my grandson is riding a 165 Levitation, NOS, now in softs and is loving it.

[Jack M]

F2 Eliminator anyone?  Bueller?

[Atom Ant]

20 minutes ago, Jack M said:

F2 Eliminator anyone?  Bueller?

I feel like an ass.  I have ridden it, and it rules.  In fact, I think anyone thinking of "getting into" BX would do well to just pick up one of these (or a used one)--great board to introduce someone to to SB carving and BX racing and the fact (I believe) there are two options--metal and non-metal--is great for those on a budget.  

[Rob Stevens]

I go back and forth between my 61 Optimistic and my Donek Sasquatch. 
the chatter I’ve had with Carl from Exegi is to build an inflated Optimistic, which would basically be my Sasquatch with a slightly shorter tail, longer and wider nose, with decamber up front in a 170. 
Essentially, if I use the Donek’s 28 waist as the starting point, I’d establish Optimistic dimensions off that, and go longer. 
 To Jack’s point, if your bare foot is a 28, you pretty much need to be at least close to 30 underfoot if you want to get high edge angles with low binding angles. 
To the cat butt talk, if you stand those riders up straight, they’re performing a proper hip hinge squat, modified to be slightly open to the direction of travel (depending on binding angles).