Reconsider the name of this forum?

[Jack M]

Since 1999, this forum used to be called the "Carving Community".  Just recently it was renamed to the "Hardbooting Community".  I know the intentions were good - to suggest that hardboots can be fun for more than just carving, but the bottom line is it reads as exclusive.  I have talked to a few softbooters who have been put off by this.  Also, softboot carving content continues to be posted here, without being moved to Off Topic, which IMO is totally fine.  I think this has to do with a renewed interest in carving among softbooters - carving is now seen as soul surfing, a respectable skill, and is no longer stigmatized.  Carving is carving, and there is a lot of crossover of technique between carving in softboots vs hardboots.  I think we should embrace the new popularity of carving with softbooters, and be waiting with open arms when Google sends them here.

Edit - I think there should either be one "Carving Community" forum, or two separate forums - named something like "Hardboot Carving and Freeriding" and "Softboot Carving".  But as it is now, we're kind of in limbo here with a forum that is functioning as a catch-all, but is named very specifically.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Jack Michaud
another option

[lonbordin]

Agreed Jack.  We're such a small community... plus SB carving can be a gateway drug. 

[softbootsurfer]

Let's change it to Cold Surf 

[neanderthal]

" you carve, you carve, you carve - no slide"

I have spent many years chasing that feeling on hardboots and soft, in powder or hardpack its all about the "no slide."  That and those tasty threads :)

 

[rjnakata]

I'm not much of a soft boot carver, but it's about how you ride, not what shoes you wear.

[west carven]

 howdy

well, carving is carving, but it is so much harder to carve in softboots than in hardboots. hardboots for

me has become too easy and I need something more fun and challenging. I have become obsessed

with  softboot carving. the Japanese softboot carvers have become my hero's, I really like yuko nakamoto's

style, such a beautiful solid, quite upper body, yet ripping solid clean carves. I have yet to see any dude here

in the states come close with hardboots come close to the way she rides. hopefully my softboot riding will

increase my hardboot skills and vise-a -versa. softboot carving is the future, hardboots is too easy...

[Jack M]

West Carven obviously hasn't seen ErikJ or PaulK then... 

[terekhov]

alpine snowboarding community it is

[kiteparsons]

We wouldn't want to assume anyone's boot style for fear they might get TRIGGERED.  Some believe boot style is a born trait, not learned.

[philw]

In my world any competent rider carves, so I was surprised when "carving" became a sport in the late 1990s. Skateboarders in snow parks should have found themselves a new name, not those of us who ride mountains. Why isn't there a sport called  "being crap", or "side slipping"? But such is the way of the world.

I do take your point about capturing competent soft boot riders. But I would be unhappy to have my own hard boot powder carving relegated once more to the long grass to be replaced with soft boot "maybe I'll put the edge in a bit". I'm not hugely attracted to the word "community", which sounds somewhat archaic here in the UK; my girlfriend laughed when she saw me with that on my web page.

I guess if it was my company I'd be doing what you're doing - trying to work out how to capitalize on the swing back from aerial ballet to competent riding. How about just a section called "riding"? I ride with people on all sorts of gear... what we have in common is an ability to ride all the mountain pretty well.

Mostly I think it works itself out without any intervention.

Edited December 16, 2016 by philw

[xy9ine]

i prefer the inclusivity of carving community. hardware is secondary, imo.  

[lordmetroland]

50 minutes ago, philw said:

Why isn't there a sport called  "being crap", or "side slipping"? But such is the way of the world.

Fantastic idea. I agree that changing the thread name to "Being Crap" would lower the intimidation threshold. I'm also in favor of "Looking Stupid," "Stiff-armed Butt Thrusting," and "Droopy Pants." And "Yay, Flannel!"

[lonbordin]

1 hour ago, philw said:

I'm not hugely attracted to the word "community", which sounds somewhat archaic here in the UK; my girlfriend laughed when she saw me with that on my web page.

So when there's a like-minded group of folk in the UK what newfangled word do you use instead of community?

[Mig]

1 hour ago, philw said:

the word "community", which sounds somewhat archaic here in the UK

as in United KINGDOM, right? Doesn't kings, queens, princes and princesses sound kind of Middle Age and archaic too? ;)

[rjnakata]

2 minutes ago, Mig said:

as in United KINGDOM, right? Doesn't kings, queens, princes and princesses sound kind of Middle Age and archaic too? ;)

"The Carving Kingdom" has a ring to it...

[jtslalom]

Jack,

Does it really matter? Since going back to softboots over 10 years ago I still visit this site time to time. It doesn't matter what name it is under or how it is titled. When l;ooking for advice or simply perusing the forum I listen to the people I think know what they are talking about and ignore the rest. If a person is to uptight not to look on a site that is notorious for its "Carving" talk just because a heading says hardbooting community and not carving community, maybe they shouldn't be on any snowboarding site. I really wouldn't worry about it.

 

Jt

[philw]

On 16/12/2016 at 4:22 PM, Mig said:

as in United KINGDOM, right? Doesn't kings, queens, princes and princesses sound kind of Middle Age and archaic too? ;)

We usually refer to it as the UK - perhaps that's a clue? We certainly have history and a casual attitude to it. The building I'm typing in is over a thousand years old. I'm not.  The as I said the word sounds old, like the "community chest" phrase in Monopoly, and probably for the same reason.   

---

Whilst walking along the beach today I thought some more. I seem to remember that this is an American hard boot binding manufacturer who is kindly hosting us. So whilst there's a possible up sell from soft to hard boots, it would seem perhaps slightly odd to shy away from what this site is actually about, which is pretty hard, no?

[softbootsurfer]

the HB community is NOT the SB Community, that was a choice made when the HB Community took the term Alpine to be about themselves and plastered wiki with the We do the Purest Carves...when Carving is actually done by the metal edge and has absolutely nothing to do with your Boots...when this Forum was Carving Community that was Inclusive as SB can Carve a Pure Track as well...now that it is the HB Community, there should not be any SB threads here period...they are Excluded by the very title of the Forum...maybe simply put a SB Community somewhere on the Forum to let them have a place to play without upsetting or mingling  info from both types of equipment or upsetting the people who believe the original intent by Fin was just for HB...just another suggestion 

[Jack M]

On 12/16/2016 at 1:26 PM, jtslalom said:

Jack,

Does it really matter?

To you and me, no.  But see softbootsailor's post above.  I have heard from other softbooters that feel similarly.  Words have meaning.

[Neil Gendzwill]

On 2016-12-17 at 11:26 AM, philw said:

I seem to remember that this is an American hard boot binding manufacturer who is kindly hosting us. So whilst there's a possible up sell from soft to hard boots, it would seem perhaps slightly odd to shy away from what this site is actually about, which is pretty hard, no?

This. There are many, many sites and forums devoted to soft boot snowboarding, where I can assure you hard booters are not exactly welcomed with good grace.  Is it so bad to have one that is primarily about hard boots where soft booters are welcome?

Edited December 19, 2016 by Neil Gendzwill

[Jack M]

4 hours ago, Neil Gendzwill said:

This. There are many, many sites and forums devoted to soft boot snowboarding, where I can assure you hard booters are not exactly welcomed with good grace.  Is it so bad to have one that is primarily about hard boots where soft booters are welcome?

I also agree with this, but the problem is, the forum you're talking about doesn't exist yet.  There is so much softboot content in this forum now and it does not get moved to off-topic.  That would be fine if this were the "Carving Community".  I think there should either be one "Carving Community" forum, or two - named something like "Hardboot Carving and Freeriding" and "Softboot Carving".  But as it is now, we're kind of in limbo here with a forum that is functioning as a catch-all, but is named very specifically.

[softbootsurfer]

really the Moderators are not doing their Job...there its no excuse to have ANY SB content on the Forum as it isTitled !!!!!

It was bad enough when it was called the Carving Forum, you would post SB content and get bashed, now as the HB Forum there is no excuse to have ANY SB CONTENT !!!!!

Edited December 19, 2016 by softbootsailer

[Beckmann AG]

On December 18, 2016 at 8:49 AM, softbootsailer said:

the HB community is NOT the SB Community, that was a choice made when the HB Community took the term Alpine to be about themselves and plastered wiki with the We do the Purest Carves...when Carving is actually done by the metal edge and has absolutely nothing to do with your Boots...

 

 

On December 18, 2016 at 8:49 AM, softbootsailer said:

...upsetting the people who believe the original intent by Fin was just for HB...

In his original post, Jack offered a paraphrase of "It's not personal, it's business".  

Odds are good that Fin intended to drive commerce by offering enthusiasts a place to be enthusiastic. If you have a little vision, you realize that trends change; so you configure the playground with enough flexibility for future needs. 

'Carving' has been co-opted to mean 'turning' in any form whatsoever. So, if wisdom prevails and the name reverts to 'carving community', a search done by a novice in search of information on how to simply turn or otherwise control their wretched rockersonic platform may well lead them to Bomber. And that might lead to a change in focus ("Hey, that looks Neat-O®!"), and that, in turn, might lead to more commerce @ BASO. 

Could be mistaken, but that's probably a 'win'.

Ergo, 'carving' is dynamic, whereas 'hardbooting' remains static.

Given that de facto 'carving' on softboots can, and often does serve as a gateway to 'carving' on hardboots, there's little commercial value in discouraging active discussion. The boots and the binding angles may be different, but the principles are the same. When that softbooter gets tired of squelching through the vast cow pasture of 'snowboarding how-to', and wants solid information on how to ride better, do you want them to come here, or would you prefer to haughtily route them back to the duck pond?

Identity crises aside, if you offer a little help and advice to the lost and wandering, you might have the start of something productive. And if you're too good to speak to those of a 'lesser' caste, simply abstract your fingers from the keyboard.

1 hour ago, softbootsailer said:

really the Moderators are not doing their Job...there its no excuse to have ANY SB content on the Forum as it isTitled !!!!!

It was bad enough when it was called the Carving Forum, you would post SB content and get bashed, now as the HB Forum there is no excuse to have ANY SB CONTENT !!!!!

Consult your physician before mixing Hyperbolax with Sildenafil. 

Edited December 20, 2016 by Beckmann AG

[softbootsurfer]

I know what Fins intent was, he told me what it was...it was called Carving Community and he accepted that SB Carvers would and could post there and encouraged me and others to do that...It Is now called HB Community and should pertain to HB as the title implies...you never see Boogie borders in Surfer because while they both ride waves, what they are using is different, regardless the principles involved...what is wrong with having a separate SB section...would Google not send the SB folks to Bomber?

[Jack M]

I like it.  Carving Central and All Mountain Hardbooting.  Let the HB and SB carvers mingle, and the HB freeriders have a home of their own.

Now to make Bomber SB bindings... ;)