What are the pros & cons to a rounded tail...

[Jeffrey Day]

...on an alpine board? I've been carving for about 6 years now and I consider myself, reluctantly, an aggressive, dare I say, expert level carver. I am about to get myself a new, much longer board for me. I am looking at a Prior Metal 187 or a Coiler Pure Race GS 181.

To me, a rounded tail doesn't make sense because you'd lose a bit of effective edge, right? As an example, the Prior Metal 187 has an effective edge of 161cm where as the Coiler Pure Race GS 181 has an effective edge of 163cm. Why would I want a longer board with a shorter effective edge?

Help the un-informed!

[tex1230]

you can't race BX with a square tail...just sayin'

[Jeffrey Day]

Ahh, there's a good point! I wouldn't have thought about that. Not much into racing, although I've thought about racing next year, but probably not BX.

[jnshapiro]

This is a good question. I'm interested in the responses. Also, no interest in racing for me.

[willywhit]

a guy asked me on sunday , at sunday river, what kind of a board is that ? "the fast kind" I replied. Why isn't the tail turned up ? "Because I'm only going one way" I replied. I would've played alpine ambassador but we had just heard about the free burgers for passholders and were afraid it was almost over at 1:15. Bumrush the free burgers. Don't overthink it, Jeff, my Coiler BARELY has a nose.

[Jack M]

In my experience with my Metal 177, the tail makes the biggest impact while not carving, where it really does make the board easier to ride. Mine serves double duty as my all-mtn board.

While carving, it releases a little easier, and is more forgiving on uneven terrain (slush, chop, piles, etc). Does it make me pine for a rounded tail on my other carving boards? No.

Comparing the Metal 187 to that Coiler isn't really apples to apples. The Coiler is also going to have a much shorter nose, which is a different issue altogether. The running length of the Metal Priors is the same as the corresponding WCRs. The Metals are just 2cm longer overall. The benefit of the shape is significant, the penalty of the extra weight is not.

This doesn't apply to you Jeff, but I've taught my father how to carve, my wife how to snowboard (in hardboots from day one), and helped my sister make the transition to hardboots. For all of them, a round tail made a world of difference. My dad started on an FP, my sister on an Alp, and my wife on a Stat. Switching them all to E-decks opened the door to the next level.

ps - no dare needed.

[Mike T]

In addition to everything Jack said, I find that rounded-tailed boards are more well behaved when pumping them for speed from the back seat when carving on a flat section. No more tail catches when I get too far back and don't shift into the next turn properly.

Here in the Pacific NW you get lots of slush and chop and it's definitely less pone to grabby-tail in those conditions.

Right now I have half square tails and half round tails. If round tail is an option on any new board I am going to get it from now on.

[Buell]

Hey Jeff,

Round tails really help with fakie EC!

Your are really going big with a 187 Metal. I find my 183 rides slightly smaller than the Donek 175 GS Olympic. That said, I ordered a 187 to go with my 183 for next year.

After riding my Prior Metal with a round tail, I don't expect I will return to square tails.

Take care, Buell

[Jeffrey Day]

Hey Buell,

What are you saying, that I'm getting ahead of myself by wanting to get a 187? You're probably right...I am just a wee little man whose a hack of a carver! :)

[Sinecure]

Rounded tails fall over more easily when you lean them against the wall.

Otherwise not much diff. That's a very sweet board. I test rode one during the demo days this year. Very fun, smooth and fast. I want one too.

[Kirk]

One of the main features that made me decide to look at the Prior for my next deck. For all the reasons stated above.

To be honest, I noticed VERY little difference between the 183 and 187 in terms of overall stability at speed with similar turn shape.

[willywhit]

Hey Buell,

What are you saying, that I'm getting ahead of myself by wanting to get a 187? You're probably right...I am just a wee little man whose a hack of a carver! :)

jday, don't sell yourself...short

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[Jack M]

Jeff, if you can, go custom with a narrower waist on that 187 for your boot size. Stock is 19.5cm. I'd be very surprised if a 18cm template didn't already exist.

ps - unfortunately Sinecure speaks the truth.

[Fleaman]

The curved tail on my Am and Rc coiler sure have saved my bacon. Especially when you get turned around after hitting a twig or something.

I think the turned up tail expands the usefullness of your board. Unless you are a diehard squaretail lover, I think it should be an option on all boards.

New school boards with wide and turned up tails make sense to me. It makes the tools of our sport more versatile, which in my opinion is why we lost so many members in the late 90's when boards were getting too specific and narrow. The lure of wide, soft boards was too great.

Little do they know Alpine boards are superior in every way.

[bobdea]

...on an alpine board? I've been carving for about 6 years now and I consider myself, reluctantly, an aggressive, dare I say, expert level carver. I am about to get myself a new, much longer board for me. I am looking at a Prior Metal 187 or a Coiler Pure Race GS 181.

To me, a rounded tail doesn't make sense because you'd lose a bit of effective edge, right? As an example, the Prior Metal 187 has an effective edge of 161cm where as the Coiler Pure Race GS 181 has an effective edge of 163cm. Why would I want a longer board with a shorter effective edge?

Help the un-informed!

effective edge is a useless number, running length is what counts

all my recent coilers have had round tails, they ride better switch and are more durable in my experience, no reason not to have one

about getting a narrower WCR, I'd hesitate on that, I've been told most people are going wider with the metal decks from sources other than prior, for more info maybe talk to bordy and a couple others that race or coach they'd know for sure, again, this is just what a couple people have said to me but it seems to be true in that I've seen a few boards with 20cm waists and wider

Unless you have really tiny feet like smaller than a mens 8 I'd not worry about it but if you're a lightweight maybe have it built softer.

[Mike T]

about getting a narrower WCR, I'd hesitate on that, I've been told most people are going wider with the metal decks from sources other than prior, for more info

-snip-

but if you're a lightweight maybe have it built softer.

I've got a new Prior Metal 177 and went with the default 19.5 waist. I'm small-footed - size 25 boots - and it's just fine. It feels just as quick edge to edge as my 18 cm waisted Doneks.

Stiffness wise... I weight 190 and Dean @ Prior pretty much wouldn't sell me one unless it was stiffened. Even so it's still my softest alpine deck. It's still soft enough to get the full-on metal experience but I don't find my carves going terminal the way they did when I tried a stock 183. If you are REALLY light you might want it softened...

[Buell]

I consider myself, reluctantly, an aggressive, dare I say, expert level carver.

I am just a wee little man whose a hack of a carver! :)

So which one is it? :lol: Nice to see you finally owning up to your abilities!

I'm sure the 187 will be just as friendly as my 183. When you bring that thing out west next season, we can have people again asking us "was there a special on that board, why do you both have the same one?" :rolleyes:

Regarding the round tail, I am fully in agreement with Fleaman about it saving my butt when I get spun around.

Buell

[pokkis]

Round tail is way to go with these new boards, release from turn is so smooth plus it is so fun to ride fakie without fear to edge catch :D

What comes to width, my wife rides Pen BJ 721 very happy on her 23 mondo boots. So i would not go more narrow than standard Prior Metal WCR except if some really wants skinny Titanal board

[Jeffrey Day]

I'm sure the 187 will be just as friendly as my 183. When you bring that thing out west next season, we can have people again asking us "was there a special on that board, why do you both have the same one?" :rolleyes:

Buell

One of my favorite saying when I see people with matching gear is: " Hey, did you get a free bowl of soup with those boards!?!"

And if it matters, I do have key fobs for boots, size 24mp! AND I'm a light-weight rider at 149 pounds nude...so what, about 160 with gear on. I don't think that I'd want to soften up the board at all, but I do like the idea of getting the board narrowed to 18cm.

[Guest sandarapark]

between a rounded tain and a upturned tail?

are they just the same

[willywhit]

Good point about the square tail being less forgiving.Last run monday we were taking pics and I dove into a fast heelside, ended up sliding on my keister doing the sit and spin and the tail dug in HARD....Boink !

I felt the jolt in my ankle and my pelvis. My buddy with the camera said it looked "kinda ugly" and I guess it could've been worse. A rounded,upturned tail probably wouldn't have "stuck" so hard.

Be careful out there ...boys & girls Noah just emailed me that he's done for the season with bruised ribs. Great snow at KMArt tho, he sez.

I'm really liking the 23 wide board these days,much less margin for.....ohhhhh shizer, hook , over the bars....BAM !

[BlueB]

What's the difference

You bet. Variations are endless:

Square, flat

Square, rounded corners, flat

Square, rounded corners, upturned

Square, tapered corners, flat

Square, tapered corners, upturned

Square, chamfered corners, flat

Square, chmfered corners, upturned.

Then apply all of the variations above to rounded or elliptical tail.

Then apply the split, swallow or fish tail variations to both of the above groups.

Then consider asym variations to all of the above...

:D :D :D

[willywhit]

You bet. Variations are endless:

Square, flat

Square, rounded corners, flat

Square, rounded corners, upturned

Square, tapered corners, flat

Square, tapered corners, upturned

Square, chamfered corners, flat

Square, chmfered corners, upturned.

Then apply all of the variations above to rounded or elliptical tail.

Then apply the split, swallow or fish tail variations to both of the above groups.

Then consider asym variations to all of the above...

:D :D :D

Bubba: Anyway, like I was sayin', shrimp is the fruit of the sea.

You can barbecue it, boil it, broil it, bake it, saute it.

Dey's uh,

shrimp-kabobs, shrimp creole, shrimp gumbo. Pan fried, deep fried, stir-fried. There's pineapple shrimp, lemon shrimp, coconut shrimp, pepper shrimp, shrimp soup, shrimp stew, shrimp salad, shrimp and potatoes, shrimp burger, shrimp sandwich. That- that's about it.

Bubba: Have you ever been on a shrimp boat?

Forrest Gump: No, but I've been on a real big boat. :D :D :D

[skategoat]

If I'm coming out of a turn and I'm in the back seat, the square tail gives me a bit more hold and allows me to recover to a balanced position. With the rounded tail on my Prior, I skid out more.

I think effective edge does has some benefit. It's a useless number only if you are riding balanced and centred at all times. I'm not that good.

[Dave ESPI]

I have a flat tail that is both rounded at the edges and slightly upturned on my Airwalk 157. It really does make for a smooth transitioning ride. I've only been on that, and my wide rossignol 163 dirrectional powderboard with the hardboots, and they both are nice with the rear up-turned tail.