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From wide eyed teenager : "Did you do THAT on purpose?"

Here's another perspective, and a (?!?)magic formula further down the thread. http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1025

1+ I would try more racing if not for having to wait around. Way too impatient for that esp. in nice weather/snow condition. I'd rather be freecarving, but that's just me.

Conversely I've been riding wide boards in the last 10yrs on the ice coast (following the EC site recommendations, at the time it was rather counter-current) without any problem. Last week I tried a smaller waist board and it took a lot of getting used to!

So we ruled out the board. Another possibility is that the Swoard (like my current VSR) is soft in the nose and does not tolerate too much pressure up front, esp. in soft condition. I learned the hard way last year on perfectly groom snow at 0C, doing a nice front flip under the chairs:eek: I'm not technical enough to discuss of the why, but wonder your dislike on moderate slope is from the width of the board, it works well for me there but I tend to push pull a lot and wider GS turns.

Are you riding a firmer model? With hero snow from the West Coast, a firmer model is generally preferred, whereas we pour East coast ice riders, the softer model is preferred. Same goes for the customs boards that have soft noses. I think Bruce has templates depending where you live:rolleyes:

Alexis, good points. I would also add that although custom board give you the exact board for your specification, you also run the risk it might not turn out to be exactly what you want/need for your program the first time around. In my case, Bruce was very helpful but had to rebuilt the boards and the third board is amazing...2 years wait, fortunately I had the swoard to ride (and still ride).

Agree, ECgasm happens in the wide, long and steep! Most Ontario resort don't have the slopes for that (makes it hard to train for smooth transitions when in 2-3 turns you're at the end of the steep section!) and the Swoard shines at 90 degree.

Shameless plug for the Swoard Dual, depending on your budget...great edge hold soft or hard boots. http://www.swoard.com/index5.html

EC involves quite a bit of rotation just prior to initiating the turns, esp. counter intuitive when doing the back side. I'm not starting some flaming of any sort here, just different ways of skinning the cat. Just posting the links since you asked the difference. Here's some links copied and paste off the EC site. RIDING TECHNIQUE Extremecarving (=EC) training : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1005 Race technique, counter-rotation, rotation, push-pull, extremecarving (=EC) technique as defined in this Web site http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3556 http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3489 push pull : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3333 stance : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1895 Weight, flex & performance : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=413 Backside vs Heel side : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2766 Icy conditions : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=667 Race technique http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2420 Responsibilities when carving : http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1387

Si ca peux t'aider: j'ai un style plutot surf, et adore l'EC. Je ne fais pas la course. J'ai la chance d'habiter pres de Bruce et d'avoir une Swoard, une vieille Coiler AM et une nouvelle VSR metal. En fait la Swoard et ma nouvelle VSR est tres similaire pour le carving et pour EC. Les differences pour moi: avec le metal, ca pardonne bien quand les conditions ne sont pas parfaites, ma VSR est une 'tight' et quand tu fais du EC, t'as moins de plaisir car la partie du virage ou t'es contre la neige ne dure pas aussi longtemps. Avec la Swoard t'as plus la sensation de flotter quand tu raze la neige. La VSR est un peu plus nerveuse si tu met un peu de pression au pied arriere en fin de virage, ca pop un peu plus. Sinon, carver paresseux ou tres fort, glace ou pas, poids, largeur, pouvoir changer la courbe en plein virage, souplesse du nez (c.a.d. faut faire gaffe dans la neige molle), etc... les 2 sont tres similaires. Swoard ca coute un peu cher pour l'avoir au canada mais tu peux l'avoir pour cette saison (et c'est semi-custom, construction super ). Coiler VSR custom, ca sera pour l'annee prochaine.

Swoard Dual since you like laying it down too. You can have both hard boots or soft boots set up on it. Works both on groom and powder. And other than booting out on softboot backside, you should be able to EC with it on hard boots.

Thanks. Did not think about home made stuff. Good to know about the angles and the link.

Treated my son to a Loaded Dervish for his birthday. I'm now interested in longboarding too! So smooth!! What would you recommend for sliding gloves? (will need eventually sliding wheels, right now just really soft grippy stuff for the flats we have in front of the house). What angles are your feet when you're riding this ? Can you ride it at high angles like hardboots or do you ride it more softboots stance?

The VSR is very versatile as above. The Swoard 2D although an EC board, is also just as versatile and works very well in icy conditions and is a very easy ride. Where the VSR is better is in choppy conditions in my opinion. I can't comment on the Virus since never ridden one. My 2 cents.

If I were 63...I'd feel young but stiff (and I not talking Viagra stiff) and if I had the budget and can't wait, well I'd order a set of BTS from Bomber with softish springs and a Swoard (for 2 reasons: first is that I don't have to wait a few months to have a EC board semi customized to weight/height under my feet, and second, is that it is garanteed to work for EC). Don't get me wrong, I my VSR (for me, Bruce's third time is the charm and customer support is out of this world). Have fun shopping and laying it out! Life is too short.

Not sure how old you are. I'm 45 and it's easier on the body than regular style in my opinion (except for the +++ sliding and eating snow , wearing out your gloves/jacket while learning)...mainly because it's does not require as much quads strength mid/end turns and you don't have to go at Mach speed even on steep, when you fall, you're already against the snow. It is a work out though with all the flexion/extension. You ideally want really flexy boots so you can really compress before the turn and fully extend during the turn. As for the boards, I think your Coiler AM will do, although as you progress or if you can afford, a Swoard makes learning and EC easier and more enjoyable. My new metal Coiler tongue depressor is very much equivalent but still need to watch my weight distribution a bit more early/mid EC curves vs the Swoard. The metal is great for icy/bumpy we get here though. It took me for ever (and still) to learn around here (ontario) since we don't have steep wide slopes and it's harder to learn on hard snow. The guys from Tahoe are very lucky in that respect. Once learned, snow conditions does not matter so much, you can do it on pretty much any surface except bumpy.

Hence replacing the tongue with the old Raichle tongue which stays soft even at very low temp. The springs are not affected by 10 to -20C temp. (at least not perceivable to me).

Personal preference for me, as softer feels more surfy, so take my ideas with a grain of salt. I like my boots flexy fore and aft and rigid sideways. I use the Swoard forum/site recommendations for spring set up with the Northwave boots, and adapted it to my 130lbs, ie small original soft spring cut up (1/3) and very soft spring (bought separately) for the remaining 2/3. I also had to put a pair of old Raichle tongues in (bought from Bomberonline) because below -10C, the Northwaves tongues were very rigid and I could not bend the boots. This way, my boots flex is temperature independent and relies only on spring characteristics.

That is absolutely awesome ! and so smooth at mixing it all together.

The Swoard Dual was designed with exactly that in mind. In fact, from the EC forum, seems like most guys are on the Dual on hardboots rather than soft boots.

For me, it cuts through bumps very well (better than regular shape IMHO) and stuffing the nose has more to do with the softer flex up front and how much weight you put toward the front foot in soft snow (the first very stiff version Bruce made was great through slush, but then I struggled in hard snow, this new softer flex version works wonderful on hard snow but did a forward flip on soft snow...) both cuts through cruds really nice. Funny when Swoard came out, I remember people making fun of the squarish nose. Now the Swoard nose is actually tame...:rolleyes:

? this, anyone tried. Will look weird on the slope ?dangerous in a fall, but might reduce rear blind spot http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442281137&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302693017&bmUID=1268057558813

Yesterday after 10cm fresh snow groomed, and +3C. Was picking up speed, then on the first carve, wanted to be very aggressive (watched too much of JJ racing) on the flat, pushed on the new coiler tongue depressor. The nose folded, stopped in the groomed soft snow. I went over the handle bar (first time ever). Front flip under the chair. After all the 'Are you OK?' from the chairs, came a " I give you a 9 out of 10". It is the Olympics after all.

Coming back from a 0.76sec deficit. Wow. Congrats to JJ.