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1+ EC is really not about which style is better than which. It just happen to be really fun style to do and watch. I ride almost every time with a bunch of racers, and they out carve me all the time. However I like to have my head below my board in the turns (and my kids have a ball watching me do it, bonus to be a cool dad)

The truth is somewhere in the middle as usual. I think 'bomber/racing' style is definitely better for really icy/hard condition as far as not skidding etc...on the other hand I think EC has been put down over the years as not possible in hard/icy conditions and so some of us are rather sensitive on the topic. And the topic is about EC, not about which style is better in this thread. It can be done, esp. by talented guys like Patrice on a consistent basis, and I think actually easier when very steep. However for mortals like myself, it's definitely not 100% success ( I would say 50%, better on heelside for me) and I either pass or go into huge chatter (and it would hurt on icy conditions).

That's a big presumption. In fact Patrice carves the same on hard icy snow, as witnessed by my brother who used to live and carve in Montreal.

Not sure I'd agree. The videos looks great. It's more stylish to have the shoulder facing forward, but Jacques heelside looks like Corey's style.

Love your smooth style. I would say there is nothing wrong with your technique but probably more with the timing of the push. As Rob mentioned, the turn initiation onto the edge should be done while you're almost going uphill, ie. in your first picture, the stage you're at should have been about 90 degree earlier (going across the hill) so by the time you're in that stage of the turn in your pic, you should've been fully laid out already. The VSR has a very similar feel to the Swoard, but with both board, if you put a bit too much weight at the front, esp. in hero snow, the nose will bend like crazy (much shorter radius and less floating sensation over the snow), and slow you down. Today I was learning the opposite and firm/fast snow, I was trying to look like Jack Michaud's heelside and it felt sweet! PS. Post the same query on the EC forum, as you're get the more dedicated EC coaches hang out there to answer your queries.

http://www.extremecarving.com/photos/0405html/j6_0405.html http://www.extremecarving.com/photos/03html/p13_03.html http://www.extremecarving.com/photos/swoarders/s01.html http://www.extremecarving.com/photos/swoarders/s19.html In most cases you won't be at 90 degrees, however for EC, it's not unusual to be at some point close to 90 degrees, and esp. if you digging trenches in soft snow, you'll be below the actual snow level so it would not take much to boot out.

Regardless of rules and people's ego and hurt, I think any posts or threads is part of shaping up our sport (our any topics on any forum) over time. Deleting threads is like forgetting history and having to do it all over again, mistakes and all. History is full of mistakes not to be repeated and lessons to be learned. Forget your ego for a minute and work on shaping up ideas, good or bad.

Boot overhanged=boot out

Swoard demo tours, not in Austria though: http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7979

Going by feel, this is what I feel the push is happening depending whether you are carving regularly (any style) on blues (tracing 2) or EC ideally on steeper (tracing 3). The actual pressure is probably similar if you look at picture of snow spray, however since you are all stretched out in section 3 and 4, you actually don't feel much in the legs pressure wise. For EC, I feel that section 0, you should be ideally] going up hill, section 1 you are on the carving edge still going up hill. By the time you fully push in section 2, you end up like Istvan in his last picture. Other can chime as I am not in your boots! On a side note, my favorite EC is actually at the local hill, where there is a bank on the left side going up about 30 degree steepness. I go straight up the bank front side then EC heelside, so that by the time I'm in position 3, my head is below me at 30 degree. It feels even better than on steep. It's right under the lift so I can watch my track, and in nice snow, it's a nice and sharp track, and I can bend the radius of the VSR (11/14/13 approx.) to a radius of about 2m! Feels just amazing, like a radical off the lip. Same feeling as this: Going up the hill, setting up the backside EC: http://lh6.ggpht.com/_fTREUsYT-f0/S6far_wjGWI/AAAAAAAAC1w/YT0TQJSnK9I/Keith02[2].jpg At position 3, backside instead: http://sports.webshots.com/photo/1222591951013829486voIJiX

Others can chime in. 1+ On the pic, Patrice is compact, loaded, ready to fully extend in the turn. He is bent at the waist, but everything is line up in one line, shoulder/hip/knee/board edge. I think when people criticize bending at the hip, they mean reaching for the snow before your frontside turn like the pic #1 Vahur posted. By the way that's a great shot of Patrice, everything is bent, including the springs in those boots. On another note, that movie Carve is amazing. I finally got it to run on HD TV and wow, the chase scene down the hill is freaking amazing. The camera almost touching the back of Patrice's board.

I think we must have the same conditions, except mine was hard cord and not chopped up. A bit dangerous for the shoulders to try EC in chopped up conditions or really soft snow (where the hand can be caught and dragged behind). Not pleasant to do on hard cord but it forces you to be perfect on your game. As for the directing organs on hard snow, we asian have a reputation for smaller organs, so it's not a worry:eek: I usually don't wash out/skids when do it properly but when I wipe out it's sudden huge chatter when the snow is really hard like this week. And there is usually no warning (or at least none that I'm sensitive enough to feel). Much easier and more pleasant to practice on hero snow. You could upload a video of yourself to the EC forum, and have your technique criticized there.

I like this thread to explain it (the conclusion for me of the whole thread is that as long as you point your penis where you're going you'll do fine) http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3556 There are other on here: http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2701 As you get better, I think most EC guys will tell you that the backside is actually much stronger edge hold than frontside, esp. noticeable on hardpack. I'm not a very technical guy, but the analogy would be ice skaters turning hard on ice and yet not skidding, so it's how ever you manage to get maximal pressure on the edge at the board level. Definitely practice, timing and not bending at the waist. Yesterday was -10C after thaw and rain the day before and not skidding with EC was hard, do-able but definitely not 100% success.

I put my boots in my carry on suitcase. They just fit and stuff them with undies and socks to save room. I can afford to lose on the board, but not on the boots (Northwave .900).

that's pretty cool. He needs better boots though, can't see him swimming in that at Jaws:eek:

I think you mean soft longitudinally, but not too soft, and very stiff torsionally so it does not twist funny when high on edge like many freeride noodles. Rob is a 200lbs guy on hardboots on them without problem (I'm too lightweight to weigh in , no pun intended, on gear durability) His review is here: http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6380&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15

Brimacombe always have a few carvers around during weekday mornings and more on weekend mornings. I think YYZCANUCK also have demo gear at the ski shop to try out, boots and F2 boards.

Mind you I only ever saw him fall once and ...he broke his ankle. So I'd rather not see him fall again, cause when he does, he does it good.

I was following Bruce for part of 8:30-4:30 last week. I don't think he fell once, and that's not from lack of carving hard. I think he was riding some kind of magic Coiler 'no-fall' board designs.

VERY nice. Thanks for sharing. Can you show your attachement when the camera is in front of your feet and rotates with gravity? Nice job!

Did not answer the poll. Depends what I do: - if I take it easy, say riding with the kids/wife, never ? - if I practice EC, every 2nd turn? Also depends what you consider as falling: - falling and actually hurting - if I skid, most time I consider that a 'fall'

Uku: Should not be a problem, dropping off at Yonge/Sheppard subway ok? Gabe and I will more than likely stay for the after boarding get together at the lodge.

I'm told France and Switzerland have less snow than usual this year, eg 70cm or so base at Zinal.

I usually consider that a blessing: guilt free skiing/snowboarding with the kids without having to pull them out of school.

Slightly off topic, but I'll have my Ibex bindings if anyone are interested in buying them. And UKU, did you find a ride yet?