(Another) Riding Advice Thread

[Beckmann AG]

Thanks for the update.

 

Note the toeside entry at :40. Pretty good. Note also your posture and relation to the board.

Set the speed at half, and run it though a number of times from there until :54. Notice how many times your posture and relationship to the board changes as you go from one edge to the other.  

As mentioned previously, you're aiming to make a very simple carved turn on relatively calm terrain. Unless there's something equipment related in the way, you should be able to roll your posture at :40 right into a heelside turn time after time to good effect.

If you're up for the thinking, ask yourself why you're making something simple so complicated.  Hint: probably not by choice.

See what you come up with, and post back.

 

 

[teach]

^^^^ Counter rotation: I may be missing it. Pat, where in the video is it?

[Pat Donnelly]

7 hours ago, teach said:

^^^^ Counter rotation: I may be missing it. Pat, where in the video is it?

Between 0:40-0:60 starts to come into focus and through to the end. Both toe and heel sides.  

Observe torso (shoulders and hips) turning in opposite direction of the turns.

[digger jr]

You are very static in your posture. Look at Ryan Knaptons How to really really carve and practice the deep knee bends he does. That little drill always helps me when I’m not feeling it. And you’ll feel more edge bite. Also when you have the space, pick up a little more speed ,quickly drop down low with knees and then really try to crank one.

[AcousticBoarder]

13 hours ago, Beckmann AG said:

Thanks for the update.

 

Note the toeside entry at :40. Pretty good. Note also your posture and relation to the board.

Set the speed at half, and run it though a number of times from there until :54. Notice how many times your posture and relationship to the board changes as you go from one edge to the other.  

As mentioned previously, you're aiming to make a very simple carved turn on relatively calm terrain. Unless there's something equipment related in the way, you should be able to roll your posture at :40 right into a heelside turn time after time to good effect.

If you're up for the thinking, ask yourself why you're making something simple so complicated.  Hint: probably not by choice.

See what you come up with, and post back.

 

 

I think I am understanding a little better what you mean here after reviewing the video more and Pat's comment about counter rotation. I thought I had gotten rid of it except when intentionally skidding to stop but aperantly not. 

As for reasoning why, I am not sure... Not that it is a good reason, but that's the way I have always done it? I definitely started out with less than ideal gear (boots that didn't fit well, old board(s), and td1s) which could have contributed early on and committed to muscle memory.

I guess now is trying to figure out what exactly to do to effectively  unlearn it. I have a feeling some of the other items will almost fall in place. 

Edited February 4, 2018 by AcousticBoarder

[Beckmann AG]

Habit certainly plays a part. But if you consider just how 'clean' you are in the :40 toe side, and how twisted you are while passing the slow sign, there's probably something else going on.

->I've seen tangled piles of barbed wire that looked more comfortable. You wouldn't stand like that unless you had to in the moment.

 

Maybe:

Stand barefoot on the floor and try to replicate your toeside stance, then fade the contact directly across the virtual board to the heelside. (A big mirror might be handy for this). You're looking for contact change on the soles of the feet, not virtual board tilt.

Then do the same thing while standing on your footbeds.

Then repeat, with your footbeds on top of your bindings.

Then again in your empty shells in bindings on footbeds.

And finally with liners assembled to boots, board, and bindings.  Somewhere along the line the process is going to feel 'blocked' uneven, or awkward.

Then remove the obstacle, and go for a glide.

 

[AcousticBoarder]

On 2/4/2018 at 5:34 AM, Beckmann AG said:

Habit certainly plays a part. But if you consider just how 'clean' you are in the :40 toe side, and how twisted you are while passing the slow sign, there's probably something else going on.

->I've seen tangled piles of barbed wire that looked more comfortable. You wouldn't stand like that unless you had to in the moment.

 

Maybe:

Stand barefoot on the floor and try to replicate your toeside stance, then fade the contact directly across the virtual board to the heelside. (A big mirror might be handy for this). You're looking for contact change on the soles of the feet, not virtual board tilt.

Then do the same thing while standing on your footbeds.

Then repeat, with your footbeds on top of your bindings.

Then again in your empty shells in bindings on footbeds.

And finally with liners assembled to boots, board, and bindings.  Somewhere along the line the process is going to feel 'blocked' uneven, or awkward.

Then remove the obstacle, and go for a glide.

 

So I have tried this and honestly some of it has to be muscle memory. Even barefoot on the floor I often find myself wanting to rotate as I go to heel

Insoles: no change. 

Insoles on bindings: maybe even a little easier/better. 

Footbeds in shells: more blocked again. I want to more than ever to rotate. I think in part due to my front calf pressuring my shell before the rear... Then checked and my forward lean on my front boot somehow was locked all the way forward. This helped to fix this one. Back to feeling OK. I did notice my front toes want to push past the boot angle. 

Liners: didn't feel much different either. Maybe again a little feeling weird as in the upright lock the front leg still pressures my cuff on heel side before my rear leg does... Almost feels like rear cuff is looser even though it is about the same. I also am starting to notice weight shifting forwards and back to varying degrees makes me want to do it more or less with fore/ aft weight, and if I tilt the board, I want to do it more as the board tilts/more pressure on the boot cuffs. Front foot still wants to go a little past binding angle as I am focusing on this. 

 

So, my thoughts are boot cuff adjustment or even more canting on the front? Possibly more binding splay too? 

 

So I have adjusted the boot cuff and it is already feeling better, even just when I put my boots on... Some pressure areas I didn't realize I was having seem to be gone too. Contact is more equal when pressuring for heel side and I don't feel like I have to compensate by pressuring the back more. I debated adjusting the back as well but I am going to just start with the front. I think and see how it feels on the mountain tomorrow

Edited February 19, 2018 by AcousticBoarder

[Beckmann AG]

3 hours ago, AcousticBoarder said:

Even barefoot on the floor I often find myself wanting to rotate as I go to heel

That's both interesting, and good to know. Habits born of need tend to stick around until you replace them with something simpler/more effective. And even then, they linger.

When you have the time, practice moving 'around' the soles of your bare feet, paying attention to how the movements across one foot affect the other. Then focus on directing the area of contact diagonally across the sole of each foot, both independently, and together. E.g., on the front foot, move the contact from the ball of your left foot, across the arch, to the outside of your heel. On the rear foot, go from the base of the 5th toe (or 6th, if you have one) diagonally across the arch to the inside of that heel. You'll notice that this will involve some articulation at the ankle joint, and may be easier standing on your insoles.

This is not necessarily an easy thing to do, as we're not programmed to pay attention to the mechanisms of ambulation. Stick with it, though, and it will pay dividends.

 

4 hours ago, AcousticBoarder said:

Footbeds in shells: more blocked again. I want to more than ever to rotate. I think in part due to my front calf pressuring my shell before the rear... Then checked and my forward lean on my front boot somehow was locked all the way forward. This helped to fix this one. Back to feeling OK. I did notice my front toes want to push past the boot angle. 

Good note on the cuff interference. You may also find, that if it was easier to move around on the 'empty' bindings, but harder in the shells, the combined boot ramp should be altered to reflect something closer what you have with the bindings alone. Bear in mind that a significant part of riding well is determined by how you direct pressure to the top of the board, not so much to the edge itself.

If I understand correctly, it does appear you might want a slightly broader splay angle as well. This could be due to being slightly under-posted on your insoles, or possibly a minor canting issue. Either way, you should feel like you're standing firmly on the soles of both feet.

You can further evaluate forefoot posting with playing cards. Fairly sure I wrote that up earlier this winter, but I can repeat the procedure if necessary.

So if you feel relatively solid on your feet, pursue the cuff thing to the limits of available adjustment.  It may help to work the front boot first (using the empty shell on the rear foot) and then go to the rear foot once the front feels closer to 'right'. 

The boot shells should support, but not dictate your posture.

 

Thanks for the follow-through and persistence.

 

 

 

 

[AcousticBoarder]

1 hour ago, Beckmann AG said:

That's both interesting, and good to know. Habits born of need tend to stick around until you replace them with something simpler/more effective. And even then, they linger.

When you have the time, practice moving 'around' the soles of your bare feet, paying attention to how the movements across one foot affect the other. Then focus on directing the area of contact diagonally across the sole of each foot, both independently, and together. E.g., on the front foot, move the contact from the ball of your left foot, across the arch, to the outside of your heel. On the rear foot, go from the base of the 5th toe (or 6th, if you have one) diagonally across the arch to the inside of that heel. You'll notice that this will involve some articulation at the ankle joint, and may be easier standing on your insoles.

This is not necessarily an easy thing to do, as we're not programmed to pay attention to the mechanisms of ambulation. Stick with it, though, and it will pay dividends.

 

Good note on the cuff interference. You may also find, that if it was easier to move around on the 'empty' bindings, but harder in the shells, the combined boot ramp should be altered to reflect something closer what you have with the bindings alone. Bear in mind that a significant part of riding well is determined by how you direct pressure to the top of the board, not so much to the edge itself.

If I understand correctly, it does appear you might want a slightly broader splay angle as well. This could be due to being slightly under-posted on your insoles, or possibly a minor canting issue. Either way, you should feel like you're standing firmly on the soles of both feet.

You can further evaluate forefoot posting with playing cards. Fairly sure I wrote that up earlier this winter, but I can repeat the procedure if necessary.

So if you feel relatively solid on your feet, pursue the cuff thing to the limits of available adjustment.  It may help to work the front boot first (using the empty shell on the rear foot) and then go to the rear foot once the front feels closer to 'right'. 

The boot shells should support, but not dictate your posture.

 

Thanks for the follow-through and persistence.

 

 

 

 

Thank you for your help! Glad I am finally getting to the root of the issue 

I have adjusted the front cuff and did find it much better, so I plan on taking some runs tomorrow and see how it does before adjusting mroe. After that I think I will try a bit more binding splay if I still detect that side pressure, and then finally move on to the rear foot after that. 

I did a search for playing cards and the most recent post I found was from Teach in 2014, so no luck finding it yet at least.

[Beckmann AG]

Keep at it, and you'll get there.

The 'card trick' was originally posted to the ersatz Bomber forum after the Great Crash of 2017, then carried over to the resurrected BOL by the OP.

 

[AcousticBoarder]

Wow what a difference! Thanks Beckmann!

Today I went out and probably had the best day of carving for me yet! I am sure part of it was conditions, it snowed 3-6" yesterday evening/ last night and then was groomed, so really nice hero cord. I don't think it got above 26* F either so it stayed all day. I could definitely feel a huge difference this time, and noted it was much easier to ensure I was not rotating. Almost wondering if I went too far, but I think I am going to work with this until I get some less than perfect snow, and same before I mess with the rear boot.  No pics or video today of my riding unfortunately, but I did get a couple of Gunsmoke after I destroyed it, almost all carves are mine at the time of the pictures haha. Overall it was a great day, stuck to this run mostly. Usually I have to stop on it even if just a few seconds to shave speed and regain composure, but I really never did today.

[Pat Donnelly]

Good job!

[Beckmann AG]

You're welcome. Odd how we gradually come to accept certain things as normal, when in truth they stand in our way.

Thanks for the effort.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Beckmann AG

[AcousticBoarder]

So I had my first day of the season a couple days ago and I feel like I reverted again. I am sure parts of it are that it's the first day so I need to get back into it/ breaking muscle memory again, and I'm not in as good of shape as I would like right now, but I was honestly put off a bit by how frustrating it was at times. I ended up switching to softboots in the afternoon (mostly because I was with friends who were in lessons in the morning so I could ride with them) and had fun, played with trying to ride switch.

I am definitely reviewing this thread again in more detail, but is there a chance anyone knows of a hardboot instructor in southern California I could work with or would anyone be willing to meet up and work with me? I really want my goal this year to be breaking the bad habits and get fundamental form down.

 

 

[Jack M]

I think most people lose some technique over the summer, and then we work to get it back for the first part of the season.  All part of the fun.  Some great advice in this thread.  There are some articles here that may be helpful: http://alpinesnowboarder.com/tech-articles/

You're past The Norm obviously, but it could be good to try it on an easy slope just to eliminate all other factors and concentrate on what you feel happening with the board.  Then add joints back in to the equation one by one.  Good luck.

[Beckmann AG]

Treat the first few days of the season like a social gathering where you know very few attendees. Wander around the room casually, listen carefully for familiar topics, and when it feels appropriate, join the conversation without becoming the conversation.

 

[AcousticBoarder]

New update. I've gotten a couple days on the snow this season now, and the last time I was out I focused on some of the advice on the relaxed carving thread. I also found my canting was a bit outward which was not helping me any. 

Here is a video of a bit later in the day on a decently pitched green run. I feel I am doing less twisting than before on heel side. 

My gf and her friend did an all day lesson (softboots) and one of the things the instructor had them do was to take their forward arm and grab their opposite shoulder, and rear arm to the small of their back. I found doing this the opposite way for a directional hardboot stance helped with the counter rotation and to keep me facing the nose of the board. 

[dredman]

Awesome! Nice and smooth! Looks like you are having fun too! That is the most important part!

[billyt.]

Looks like you are putting it together.  Nobody on that trail too!  Beautiful day.

[AcousticBoarder]

Just now, billyt. said:

Looks like you are putting it together.  Nobody on that trail too!  Beautiful day.

Yeah, that's June for ya, we were the only car there at lift open, and these videos were taken shortly after lunch at 1:30 or 2, and there's still groomers lol. Was definitely a great day on the mountain. 

[barryj]

Sticky snow?  What's that??  Always Bring  Some Sex Wax for the Glide!!     Rub it on and your off to the races....at least for 3-5 runs before you got to reapply if spring condition corn snow.  It Will Save Your Day!

Any f4 labeled paste would help but .....

The Best IMO - http://bomberonline.3dcartstores.com/Dominator-Hyperzoom-Paste_p_208.html

How Dominator dominates-  http://www.dominatorwax.com/products/hyperzoom

As to your turns......  what's the splay/distance between your bindings?  Your stance looks wide  ??

As to bias..... are you marking your bias from the center mark on the side/base of your boots? If I remember  correctly (I use positive bias)....Front boot center mark is ahead of binding center mark and Rear boot center mark is behind binding center.  Did you start there??  

Also it looks like  your throwing your rear knee out on heel side...when ya really want to pull/push your knees  towards the turn..... more.   More speed will help with this - see below 

Lastly- Speed!   You need more speed.  Yes I see it was a Sticky Day....  The board needs/wants more speed to do it's designed (at speed) job and more speed will get you and the board into a unified flow.  I'm not talking ludicrous speed....just more speed......everything happens quicker and smoother....or with time will get smoother!   .....with speed.

Keep at it and enjoy the OMG moments when it all comes together for the Carve!

 

 

 

 

[Beckmann AG]

Nice day for it.

Looks like progress. Presumably feels a little more solid/nimble?

 

However.

Toeside looks respectable for the time being, so just go for consistency on that edge.

Heelside 'weight' still looks biased to the front heel (though less so than previously), and appears there remains a tendency to tilt the board with hip action, rather than foot action.

Find the edge with your feet. Specifically under your rear heel slightly before your front heel.

Then reinforce what you find with the heavier parts as the turn develops.

[lonbordin]

10 hours ago, AcousticBoarder said:

New update. I've gotten a couple days on the snow this season now, and the last time I was out I focused on some of the advice on the relaxed carving thread.  

First I'm totally jelly of those conditions and that crowd... rough!

You've had great advice from people who are far better than me (I'm not talking about you @barryj you still on those meds? Stance width... next you'll be talking about your stance angles...)

That said, I'd like to see you fall further into those carves.  No really go over until you fall... it feels like you're really concerned with falling but until you've found that line between falling and low carving it's tough.  You might find you won't fall when you think you will... that's the sweet spot.

You look really smooth, kudos.

[daveo]

Might not even be worth considering but I find having my arms out a little more for balance is good, in addition to this, it also helps me get my shoulders parallel to the slope.

But hey you're better than me so could always just ignore my advice. 

[AcousticBoarder]

Thanks for the tips and words of encouragement! 

3 hours ago, Beckmann AG said:

Nice day for it.

Looks like progress. Presumably feels a little more solid/nimble?

 

However.

Toeside looks respectable for the time being, so just go for consistency on that edge.

Heelside 'weight' still looks biased to the front heel (though less so than previously), and appears there remains a tendency to tilt the board with hip action, rather than foot action.

Find the edge with your feet. Specifically under your rear heel slightly before your front heel.

Then reinforce what you find with the heavier parts as the turn develops.

Yeah,things feel better, and I don't feel as strained as I did on the first day this season.

So right now I have a 6 degree can't front foot that is mostly toe lift with some inward cant. I felt like I wanted to try using a 3 degree instead, but didn't want to change too many variables at once. If I am thinking right then switching to the 3 might help to move the "weight" away from the heel and in turn help to even it out?

Don't think I'm going to get a chance to get on the hill before MCC so I will bring a 3 with me and see.