michael.a Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 So word's abound that Bruce's NSR is better than Kessler's GS stick. I'm guessing this was for a freecarving and not racing application. Can anyone chime in (hopefully corey or alpine2012 as they brought it up)? I was set on a Kessler 180 as my next go-to all-rounder powerhouse (demoed the 185, bit too much hence the step down) and this cast a lot of doubt on my next purchase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 I hesitate to use the word 'better'. There's a reason that the racers that win are on Kesslers. My concern is that it's not a difference that's worth the money difference to a freecarver. I test rode an SG 185 and fell in love, but took a step back when I found out the price. Then I chatted with Bruce a bit and he suggested I try an NSR. For a little over 1/2 the SG price he made a board to my specs. (Minor tweak on his typical NSR) I rode my NSR back-to-back with a Kessler 185 a couple years ago. They did ride differently, but one didn't clearly feel better. If I were racing for a paycheck or wanted to have 'the best', I'd buy the Kessler. Comparing the NSR to other Coilers and even a Donek Proteus, the NSR quietly slices through the snow instead of 'tearing' it. You can actually hear the difference as well as feel it in your feet. I can't put my finger on exactly what that's about, but it feels efficient at turning. The tip/tail areas are impossibly thin on the NSR, I assume to conform to the snow better. Donek's Rev series is awesome too. I like them less for free carving as they're quite a bit more damp and don't give as much pop back at the end of the turn. Sean has biased the Rev for true race performance though. However, both Coiler and Donek are constantly improving their products, so I need to ride some more! A 185 in anything needs some speed or energy (steep) to turn though. I don't even take my NSR to one ski hill near me as there are no runs steep enough to decamber it and get it turning. It may as well be a 250cm plank with no sidecut on those runs. Terrifying. Go to something steeper, it's playful and willing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 In addition to what Corey said... the NSR sidecut is somewhat turnier than the typical Kessler sidecut, especially in the tail end... it doesn't shoot you as straight and fast as a Kessler in a similar size would when you get your weight back. Tail isn't quite as stiff on the NSR either from what I recall from a NSR vs Kessler test a few years ago. Dunno if Kessler has changed their flex profile over the past say 3 years. The NSR has evolved, subtly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calle Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) A bit OT : For europe you could also look at Oxess. My off the shelf RG was cheaper than an SG, Kessler or Donek. Maybe a bit more than a Coiler. The swiss currency might have gone bananas though? Edited January 15, 2015 by Calle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokkis Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 Saying what is best board for normal carver is pretty much same as saying who is best wife for same guy. It all depends how much you have to spend and what you relly like. Mission impossible (MI). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2012Alpine1 Posted January 15, 2015 Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 First off I would like to say( I) like the NCR better not so much that it is better, just for me it is. I have both and not getting rid of either one. The NCR just seems smoother it eats everything up makes me better than I am. If riding aggressive is not up your alley I would not recommend it. No racing here just fast as tight as I can make em carves lots of hootin and grunting. The more boards You try the more you learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Saying what is best board for normal carver is pretty much same as saying who is best wife for same guy. It all depends how much you have to spend and what you relly like. Well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Tat Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 My NSR (185/14-17m/20cm) instantly made me a better carver. I put a Donek AF plate on it to see what the fuss was and notched a couple of levels up again. It's my go to board when I want to rip cord on wide open steep runs. It loves it when you jump on it's nose and tell it to rail. Like Corey said somewhere else, it doesn't like skidding around, but when I ask it to carve, it tears into groom at much higher speeds than I'm comfortable riding. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael.a Posted January 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 Thank you all for the feedback, much appreciated as I'm looking for replace my F2 183 (btw demoed quite a bit of stuff to narrow down my choice to 'Kessler' including the Proteus and Rev, newer F2s, Rabenser, but no Coilers!) I used the word 'better' knowing full well it is very subjective especially for something as individual-specific as an alpine snowboard, but I think it is entirely appropriate when comparing boards used for a similar purpose and by competent riders and includes factors like price :) You guys know what 'feels' better and what is a better deal, and what I read above confirmed it for me. The NSR is 'better' :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ursle Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Actually not that it would make any difference to the op Kesslers have square tails and coilers have round tails, night and day difference in release,imho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokkis Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Tail shape of Coiler is what one wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger jr Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) Have not ridden a Kessler, but rode Geoff V's NSR that's in the classifieds. That board won't be leaving Utah quite yet. I was a little scared of it at first but after I started pushing on it really came alive. Very smooth and could go fast or fast slower. It surprised me how tight you could get it to turn. I'm on pretty wide open terrain so I can let it run. I'm just blown away how much fun it is to ride. Did what I wanted it to do and no surprises. Has some pop to it also. Sucks when you ride a board then have to have it :). Edited January 28, 2015 by digger jr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zone Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 (edited) The top sheet is way better on a Coiler [emoji12] Edited January 27, 2015 by Zone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoffV Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 I do miss that board, it was awesome while I had it, but I got so few days on it here in New England that I could not justify keeping it. You need some room to let her stretch her legs, but once she gets up to speed she does NOT disappoint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael.a Posted January 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Actually not that it would make any difference to the op Kesslers have square tails and coilers have round tails, night and day difference in release,imho Hey this stuff also plays a role, though I thought they would be similar as I saw both the NCR and Kessler have similar taper. And I'm guessing you mean the Coiler has easier release as the Kessler was the most 'locked in' board I ever rode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted January 27, 2015 Report Share Posted January 27, 2015 Kesslers have square tails and coilers have round tails, night and day difference in release,imho My Coiler NSR has a square tail. I bet Bruce would make a square nose and a long floppy powder nose for a tail if you wanted. He'd tell you you're foolish, but would do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 (edited) When comparing these boards, make sure to compare apples to apples! If you rode an NSR with no plate (or, say with a Donek AF plate or Vist plate) and a Kessler with a Hangl plate, the difference is going to be huge and the plate will make up most of that difference. I've ridden a couple of Kesslers with Hangl plates and man were they "locked in" and I've ridden one without a plate and I could skid it around trivially. All square-tailed GS's, 180 and 185. FWIW I have no problem skidding my NSR 183 with the Coiler Magic Carpet plate around at will... in fact it skids around easier than pretty much any other alpine board I've owned. It's camber profile is in fact designed to allow it. I had a 185 that was one of the first dozen or so NSRs made... that one didn't transition from skid to carve and back as easily as my newer 183 but I could certainly skid and slarve it at will. I'm of the opinion that the square tail vs round tail makes almost no difference when riding forward on groomed, at least on boards where the effective edge ends before you get to the tail. I've yet to see a square-tailed Coiler race deck where the effective edge went to the tail. If memory serves the older EX decks had edge length go to the tail maybe? IMHO the difference is aesthetic and psychological only, unless you asked Bruce for something unusual when ordering. In any case the newer NSR's with V-Cam (Variable camber... a tailored camber that higher in the middle but flattens partway out before it decambers at the ends) are really great for edge grip when you want it and skidability when you want skid ability. My 183 has a 170 effective edge but but if you run it flat on its base on firm snow there is noticeably less than 170cm of base on snow due to the camber profile, hence the skid-friendliness. I never notice it when carving... even weighted down with a plate it makes quick, nimble, solid edge changes and the entire edge feels engaged from the get-go. No idea if Kessler is doing anything similar... Edited January 28, 2015 by Mike T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger jr Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 I understand Geoff. Glad you had her built. The guy who has it now explained the motorcycle/ topsheet connection to me, pretty cool. I also agree with Mike T that it will skid no problem and is a pretty easy ride for me at 205 lbs I think I'm heavier than Geoff though. It looks like it has quite a bit of decamber in the nose too. Good stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Guy... Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 Have not ridden a Kessler, If you have any desire to, I have two different 185s and a 168 you're welcome to ride if you ever make it up to Powder Mountain; I always have a screw driver and tape measure with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger jr Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 Thanks man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoffV Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 (edited) I understand Geoff. Glad you had her built. The guy who has it now explained the motorcycle/ topsheet connection to me, pretty cool. I also agree with Mike T that it will skid no problem and is a pretty easy ride for me at 205 lbs I think I'm heavier than Geoff though. It looks like it has quite a bit of decamber in the nose too. Good stuff. Digger I am at 185lbs, agreed you'll have no problem flexing that thing. Edited January 28, 2015 by GeoffV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ursle Posted January 28, 2015 Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 My Coiler NSR has a square tail. I bet Bruce would make a square nose and a long floppy powder nose for a tail if you wanted. He'd tell you you're foolish, but would do it. Interesting, I tried to get a square tail on my NSR, it came round, I shipped it to Japan and got another square tail Kessler. I prefer the control of a square tail to the squiggly let go of a round tail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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