An Idea for Racers coming to BOL

[Jack M]

Unfortunately sometimes people are skeptical of new members they know nothing about. This can come across negatively towards a racer who has just joined the forum. I wish everyone would take time to learn who they are dealing with, but in reality that doesn't always happen.

I think it would be helpful if racers used their forum signature to identify themselves. You can edit your signature in the user control panel - click "User CP", upper left. Perhaps you can just say something like "USSA #321" or "8th overall GS, Race to the Cup, 2006", or "FIS member since 1999" or something simple like that.

Yes?

[yyzcanuck]

Better yet... why not address this to the skeptical people.

"Don't treat new members like $hit!"

[MUD]

Better yet... why not address this to the skeptical people.

"Don't treat new members like $hit!"

He's got a good point.... I was thinking about how we could do it and I just keep coming back to this.

The way I look at it is, why should we treat racers any different?????

So that means we treat all new members bad??????

There for it all gets back to the above.:o

[Mike T]

I'm with YYZCanuck, stop treating new members like crap. This is a generalized and simplified version of what I said on the Classifieds thread that was recently removed.

Don't single out racers, pros, etc, it will alienate them. If we want them to contribute, we need to welcome them.

The way I see it, pros not announcing who they are is not the problem. The problem is we have a few individuals who could use a lesson in diplomacy, and who are intolerant of new members. If we're going to solve a problem, let's solve the right one.

[Buell]

Great responses so far!

Here is the very condensed version of a new thread I was going to start earlier today:

I just wish a few of you could understand the beauty of what we have in the hardbooting world. Don't screw it up for the rest of us! You are chasing off some good people - racers and non-racers.

[Pow]

gives me hope for the future. At least most of us recognize there's an issue here and want to fix it. I hope people learn to treat others well in the future because I feel you shouldnt have to be in the know to post gear here, constructive responses can be made without offending the seller. If you know more about the gear and think the seller might take offense to your criticism, notify them privately, or take the extra effort to think of a nice way to put it.

maybe the issue is people are being a little too nosey? why should a person be posting discussions in a classified? If my understanding is correct, the purpose of the classified is to sell and buy gear, not talk about the gear they have. If they wanted that, they would post in the "carving community". Sure, we all like looking at shiney gear and dreaming about being its next owner, but that doesnt mean we should feel obligated to post there.

[Neil Gendzwill]

One problem is the way people expect to be responded to in their posts. If they arrive here and state some opinions that are counter to the groupthink, then they are likely to get questioned. Even if the questioning is polite, it causes a problem. The racer is thinking, "what do these guys know" and the regulars are thinking "who is this guy to tell us what's what". I see it lots on martial arts boards, where very senior people simply don't have the time or patience to build up an online rep, aren't used to having their opinions questioned, and simply stop dropping by when it happens. No matter how polite the exchange, real authorities don't take kindly to being told they are wrong by keyboard warriors.

[Allee]

"The rules are the same in the virtual world as the real world. Imagine a room containing a group of people who are deep in discussion. Walking past in the corridor is someone who disagrees with what they are saying. They walk right into the room, and without having previously built any relationships or trust with the people in the room, just start spouting their opinion. That would be rude and inappropriate and the response would not be positive."

But I agree that we can br pretty hard on newbies. We all asked dumb questions once, remember?

[Mike T]

No matter how polite the exchange, real authorities don't take kindly to being told they are wrong by keyboard warriors.

IMHO, this is something we must accept as truth and modify our thinking and behavior if we want more Real Authorities to hang out here.

Steve Prokopiw pointed out on the Coiler thread how awesome it is that Bruce comes here and shares his recent thoughts. Sean Martin comes here and does the same thing. If we can treat Bruce and Sean with the respect they deserve, then is it so hard to treat others who are in the industry the same way?

The trick is, stopping to think that the next "newbie" you see might be someone who is equally respecte din the industry as Bruce and Sean are, who simply doesn't use a screen name that clues you in...

[Neil Gendzwill]

"The rules are the same in the virtual world as the real world. Imagine a room containing a group of people who are deep in discussion. Walking past in the corridor is someone who disagrees with what they are saying. They walk right into the room, and without having previously built any relationships or trust with the people in the room, just start spouting their opinion. That would be rude and inappropriate and the response would not be positive."

Yeah, but suppose we're all in a room bench-racing Ferraris when Scott Speed walks by and offers some advice. Maybe the reaction would be a little different if people a) knew it was Scott Speed and b) knew who that is. We have the additional complication on the ol' interweb that anyone can claim to be anyone else, so arguing from authority is not often all that successful.

Again, the real authorities don't take kindly to having their identities or credentials questioned. It's not a problem with an easy solution.

[Guest kitekitten]

You can take this for what it is worth, as I am a "newbie" to your forum. I would hope I don't have to supply my credentials to "earn" a response from your members. While I am not new to snowboard racing, I hope, for the sake of the sport, that you would welcome new racers and want to help them, regardless of credentials. I would love to see the popularity of snowboard racing grow, as I love the sport! I joined a kiteboarding forum in New Jersey, prior to relocating from Chicago, and no one ever questioned my ability...rather they welcomed me to their community and became some of my closest friends on the East Coast. And their open arms, helped me to excel at yet another amazing sport! And now, I find myself in a similar position...moving to Seattle and looking for someplace to snowboard race...I don't need to prove myself on a forum...that will happen on the race course!

[Buell]

the real authorities don't take kindly to having their identities or credentials questioned. It's not a problem with an easy solution.

Yes it is. We just need understand that this is an open forum with a lot of connections to the outside world of hardbooting and we will often get people stopping in who know a hell of a lot more than we do.

BOL is not hardbooting. BOL is also not a club where new members need to be approved before being treated well. BOL is a place where SOME of the people who hardboot post online, exchange ideas, and make friends.

There is wrong advice dispensed here on a daily basis by members that get loads of respect and have high post counts. Do we really lose that much by being open to new posters? Do we really deserve to immediately question their credentials?

There are some amazing boarders, racers, and instructors out there that do not post here because of that mentality. We are all missing out on some great information with our silly protectionism.

[MUD]

"The rules are the same in the virtual world as the real world. Imagine a room containing a group of people who are deep in discussion. Walking past in the corridor is someone who disagrees with what they are saying. They walk right into the room, and without having previously built any relationships or trust with the people in the room, just start spouting their opinion. That would be rude and inappropriate and the response would not be positive."

But I agree that we can br pretty hard on newbies. We all asked dumb questions once, remember?

So by that argument, one can not express ones opinion until, what, 500 posts, 1000 posts?????

Or you have to tell who you are????

[noschoolrider]

"<b>Don't treat new members like $hit!</b>"

The quote above says it all and it is sad that you should have to even consider telling people to behave this way!

[Pow]

I think YYZ's quote should somehow be attached to the start of every thread, so nobody can forget

actually, ive got a fairly high post count now... YYZ, do you mind?

[zoom]

Hi kitekitten! Welcome to BOL and the NW! I'll see if anyone in the Bachelor crew has leads on races near Seattle and get back with you. If you'll come to OES in March, I'll buy you a beverage of your choice AND you can have fun carving circles around some (but not all) of us.

O.k. The room analogy - seriously?

I wish we'd see more racers/pros/full time riders jumping into actual Carving Community discussions on BOL. Post count ain't everything. On technique or gear threads, riding experience trumps hours on BOL - no doubt.

On the FS thread, it can be hard to tell how much a person knows/rides from the pictures and descriptions of their gear. But what if we were to assume that the person offering their boots might have something more to offer the forum than gear? We might gain a great new member of our community rather than alienating yet another coach, racer, or non-pro rider just like the rest of us.

And, if someone walks into the room carrying a KESSLER, I don't think they need to prove themselves. :rolleyes:

[tex1230]

And, if someone walks into the room carrying a KESSLER, I don't think they need to prove themselves. :rolleyes:

If someone walks into a room carrying picture of a Kessler that they don't describe properly and then ask 10% more than what you can buy the same (as far as you know) board from a respectable dealer, wouldn't you question them a little?

I agree with yyz - don't treat newbies like $hit

I also say (as I did before) Respect gets Respect. If you walk into a room and join a conversation, no matter who you are, you should show a minimum of respect to those that were there before, as you may have missed an earlier relevant part of the conversation. If you can't handle a few questions with some amount of politeness, maybe you should deal with whatever issues you have in your own life before trying to correct others.

[zoom]

Hey Tex,

When I saw the Kessler thread, I thought the OP sounded like they knew their way around a race course and assumed it was a custom. If I hadn't made that assumption and I was interested in the board, I might have asked, "Hey, is this a custom board, if so, what's your weight? Could you give us any additional specs?" Pretty much same question, but asked more... ahem... respectfully.

IMO, you joined his conversation. Respect gets respect.

[gdboytyler]

And, if someone walks into the room carrying a KESSLER, I don't think they need to prove themselves. :rolleyes:

Total disagreement here. Now that CATEK carries Kessler, anybody can get one.

Compared to the SurferMag forum, BOL is a gentlemen's club (the kind with manners, not topless women).

I must have missed the posts where BOL oldtimer's have been dissing racers or pros.

I would definitely be more comfortable buying equipment from the weekend warrior with 5000 posts instead of the racer with 5 posts. I don’t know either one, but at least I would have read about any bad dealings with the post whore.

When it comes to reading about technique, I pretty much ignore whatever’s been written, UNLESS, I’ve seen some photos or videos of the poster in action.

So I like Jack’s idea about including your race background in your signature. You’ll get a more attentive audience.

[tex1230]

you were obviously more observant than me. ;)

Both he and I escalated that little encounter. Of course it got worse with all of the "me too" types and the "racers should be treated like gods" types jumping in. I guess it could have been handled better on both ends.

Jack's original suggestion is valid, though. If you're new here, introduce yourself before you ask someone to send you thousands of dollars.

[SpeedracerJVB]

I think that I will chime in now...

First, for those of you who have and will continue to offer positive, constructive and at least mildly productive input regardless of the subject, thank you.

Second, I am not new here, I simply choose not to participate because of what I and most of my fellow competitors view to be a highly volitale and slightly disrespectful crowd that tends to gather here. Unfortunately a reality that I was reminded of once again when I placed my Kessler SL board on here for sale thinking that it would somehow be recieved in a positive manner.

Third, those of you who sit behind your computer screens and tough talk other people are really not so tough. You are lame and you are in a very real way hindering the sport that you claim to love by creating an environment that is elitest and unfriendly. You make claims that the "racers" are too kool for school but that's not it at all. "Racers" such as myself don't want to be involved with your disrespectful banter, honestly, we have better things to do with our lives, you should consider doing the same. On top of the fact that we don't like to participate because of a handful of dooshbags on here you're also discouraging new people from entering our sport which is something I find offensive and inexcusable. It is challenging enough to learn about alpine snowboarding much less get good advice and when people come to a forum such as this and recieve harrassment from people like tough guy Text it simply pushes people away and leaves a bad taste in thier mouth.

As for the "racers" being asked to post their resume so that someone out there in cyber space can decide whether or not their opinion is of value or not i'm at a loss and again this is what makes this forum for lack of a better word, yucky. I read so many baseless opinions on here from people that I am certain should do more reading than typing and yet the people who are out there doing it and not talking about it have to somehow provide credentials to appease an online audience. The racers of the world owe you nothing of the sort, racers, freeriders, people interested in the sport, it doesn't matter, they should all be welcome here with open arms and everyone here should be thankful for anyone who is willing to offer positive or productive information regardless of their back ground. Some of you should get over yourselves, seriously, and if a high profile racer comes on here to contribute, instead of asking them for their last ten results perhaps you should just say thank you for taking the time to share.

Text, I almost hate to respond to your last posting but since i'm typing... I am fairly certain that I did nothing to escalate the issue. I responded to someone who was being fairly ignorant. That's all. You should at least try to get all the information necessary to behave like a doosh before you go out on a limb and make yourself look stupid. Regardless, I was happy to drop my price a little if it helps someone get on a good board, just the type of guy I am.

[SpeedracerJVB]

I almost forgot, Text, I didn't ask anyone to blindly send me any money, I simply posted a snowboard for sale. You continue to amaze me with your overwhelming ignorance, do you think that their might be an introduction and maybe some detailed correspondence if a sale were to occur? My friend, you represent all that I was talking about above, please, think before you speak/type.

[wavechaser]

Well Jack...you tried! Good effort.

I think what would help a lot of people here, racers, newbies, regulars and the rest - is if we learn to just ignore the BS. It took me a while but I'm getting better at it, and it works. Take what you need, correspond with the people you dig, shine the rest. Recreate, don't escalate. If you really need to get ugly with someone, take it to PM or email. Otherwise it's like having a public white trash fight, like you're on Jerry Springer but without the bouncers.

DISCLAIMER: Before anyone jumps on me about my recent battle with skeezrule...it was a joke. I know who this person is and was just stirring the pot for fun to see who bit...probably not the best idea as any new BOL members would read that and get turned off...so...sorry about that...and skeez, you still suck eggs!! ;):)

[Bordy]

When are half of you knuckleheads going to figure it out.

Same veiw I've been pimping since day one.

The BOL boys club....we can type it so we think we can do it

Its bull**** that anyone should have to post a resume or race referance.

I remember being so fed up years ago, I had enough and posted my ful snowboard resume hoping to "back my stuff up" becuase I was sick of being told by half the board I could not possibly know what I was talking about.

Only to recive more crap for posting my resume. Now you think racers should have to?

Why to get into the Boys Club????

BOL is not alpine snowboarding its just a forum to talk about it.

Funny when Lexa post every one get all ohh and ahhh. whyh cant you treat everyone like that?

I can't count the number of olympians who have posted stuff here and been hassled.

I'm with Morgan. Most of you need to be alot nicer period.

[wavechaser]

When are half of you knuckleheads going to figure it out.

Bordy - just to clarify...I wasn't agreeing with Jack when I said "you tried"...I was more referring to the fact that he started a thread with the idea of ending some of the BS - albeit an idea I also feel is not the right way to go about it - and then Speed and Tex turned it into a "you suck, no you suck" fest again. Hence my comments about just shining the BS. I can see why Speed got upset, but if he just let it go right off the bat in that Kessler thread, and made his response something like "Kessler for sale - great board, PM me for details"...that hopefully would have been the end of it. As you well know, trying to defend yourself on internet forums is next to impossible, so why waste the time and stress yourself out? The cream will rise to the top, the good stuff will sell to those who have the knowledge of the product, or the interest and intelligence to ask the right people about it...the rest is, well, just hot air. That's my 2 cents for tonight anyway...pow day tomorrow...time to rack :sleep: :sleep: