Allee Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 So I can carve OK, in a racing GS type of style - low to the board and all crouched up. Effective, but not really that pretty. What I really want to learn to do is do those big fluid laid out carves that make people on the chairlift's eyes pop out ... I've done a bit of work following the advice on the Bomber site but don't seem to have made that much progress. Perhaps I'm just too much of a wimp. I suspect what would really help is somebody who knows what they're doing to point out what I'm doing wrong (and some better gear would help too, but maybe we'll get into that later ...) Snowboard school, as many of you have pointed out, is useless for an alpine setup unless you get an instructor who knows what they' re talking about. So - can anyone recommend somebody in the Banff area (Louise, Nakiska, Sunshine, or even out to Panorama/Kicking Horse) that could help? If anyone wants to volunteer to teach me, then I'll be happy to buy your day pass for you so you can spend some time fanging around the mountain afterwards. Or if you know a ski schooler that could help, please let me know! A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt D Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Allee, Since all Level 4 Instructors in Canada have to ride a carving board, any of them in that area (and there are a few) should be able to help you out. I will be working in Banff next year, and would love to help you out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 www.snowperformance.com The camp has gotten some good reviews on this forum... search for "Sun Peaks" and you should find it mentioned in a few threads. I'm going in March. I haven't attended a session yet but I did meet up with the gang last summer at Mt Hood and was pretty impreessed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 I was at the same level as you not very long ago. I received a lot of great info and tips in this thread. What worked best for me to really lay out carves was: 1. Slow down. Work on the technique first, then build speed. I had been riding fast for years. To start carving tight turns I had to slow down quite a bit. After I mastered the technique I could bump up the speed slowly. 2. Aggressive forward weight shift. More than you think you should. The tip to try to put my rear shoulder on my front knee revolutionized my heelside carve. 3. Angulate the board first, then your body. If you reach for the snow, you'll never attain a tight turn. Once you angulate your lower body enough, you'll become low by default. It doesn't work the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokkis Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Goto www.extremecarving.com and read how to make eyes pop-out. There are some videos too as reference :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zone Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Hi Allee, Not sure of the style you are looking for. But if you are referring to 'extremecarving'/Swiss/Euro/Californian/surfer/non-racing/what-ever-you-want-to-call-it-laying-down style, check out www.extremecarving.com, they also have lots of pointers on how to do it. A woman is always welcomed on any carving site.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdboytyler Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 The extremecarving.com site has the easiest to understand "how to" instructions that I've read, plus video clips to go with the text. Since I surf, I started out carving with the shoulders parallel to the board style. I rode that way for over a decade, but I could never pull off a laid-out Eurocarve. I then took a carving lesson from a coach on hard boots. He taught me the shoulders facing the nose style. At the time, I was riding a Burton Alp 157. My carving did get better from the lesson, but I still couldn't do the Eurocarve. My coach could carve lower than me, but he couldn't do Eurocarves either. Last season, after reading the tips at extremecarving.com, I went back to the shoulders parallel to the board style. My carving improved and felt more natural. But I still couldn't Eurocarve. I then bought a Donek Incline. The first day on the board, I pulled off a completely laid-out frontside Eurocarve and linked it into a deep backside carve (but not laid out). It seems the instructors that post at Bomber don't advocate the techniques at extremecarving.com. So my guess is you'll have a hard time finding an instructor that will teach the Eurocarving style. The only videos I've seen of people linking completely laid-out Eurocarves are at extremecarving.com or riders who use the same technique. In short, get a board that can hold a really good edge and follow the instruction at extremecarving.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Originally posted by Matt D Since all Level 4 Instructors in Canada have to ride a carving board, any of them in that area (and there are a few) should be able to help you out. No such thing as a level 4 snowboard instructor in Canada that I've heard of, and only a dozen or so level 3s. I think the director at Sunshine is level 3, but all the other guys are ones and twos. I'd be surprised if there is anyone at Sunshine or Louise equipped to help her. My experience with enquiring about the level of lessons I'd need has been negative. I even got some attitude when I suggested that their regular "advanced" instructors might not have what it takes. Most of the local carving crew hangs out at Norquay and Nakiska, according to a couple of guys I talked to last weekend. Might be worth your while to head out there for a day and see who you can hook up with. I know they used to even rent carving gear at Norquay a few years ago, not sure if they still do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Allee, Try out the Snowperformance Sun Peaks camp - you won't be disappointed. The dates are March 28th thru 31st. Not only do you get to ride with a great group of carvers but you also get some very personalized training from highly qualified coaches. The camp includes lift tickets and lodging, demos, digital video and a private race course. Complete details can be found at http://www.snowperformance.com -Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allee Posted February 5, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Thanks Neil. I thought that might be the case with snow school at Louise and Sunshine, but I had planned on heading off to Nakiska this Sat to practice. I'll keep an eye out and see who's there. Perhaps if I flounder down a green slope executing practice carves and falling on my face toeside, someone might take pity and help me out ...:) Never been to Norquay, might be worth heading up there sometime as well. Thanks for the tip! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allee Posted February 5, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 And thanks to Sean and Mike, the Sun Peaks thing sounds like just the go, but unfortunately I'm going to be at home in New Zealand late March, sunning myself and drinking decent wine. Maybe next year:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleaman Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 last year around xmas, I went to the ski school at sunshine and asked for an advanced lesson on Hard Boots and they offered a rider named Ricky, He rides hard boots sometimes and he improved my riding 10 fold. I would highly recomend him, he carved the mountain up like no tommorow. He rides with the Japanese team when they train in Canada. Call the school and find out if he is still there. Also you will have to pay for a private lesson, its not cheap but its worth the 2 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Randy S. Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 I'll echo the props to the snowperformance camp. We didn't really work on Eurocarves because most of us wanted to work on racing. However, I'm certain Mark, Sean, Lisa and any other coaches there could help a lot. Another good person to see, if you can get there is Doug Dryer at Mt. Bachelor in Bend, OR. Corey's comments are interesting. Part of the reason I don't carve really low is because I can't stand going that slow. That plus my knees are shot and I kind of suck at the eurocarve thing in general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt D Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Neil... There is such thing as a Level 4 Instructor. Please know your facts before you say someone else is mistaken. There are approximately 50 Level 4 Instructors in Canada, and most of them are in the West. I could give you the names of 3 I know for sure in the Banff area. Brian Baker works for Club Snowboard in Banff. Charlos is the head instructor at Sunshine Village. Rob Stevens is the CASI Regional Coordinator in Alberta. Kevin Eaton is the CASI TEC member in Alberta. All are Level 4's and all ride hard boots. Thats just who I can think of off the top of my head. I am currently a Level 3, working towards my 4 and riding hard boots a lot. Allee. There will be someone proficient in Hard Boot instruction at Sunshine and Norquay most likely. Your best bet is probably Nakiska though, because thats where the Alberta race team trains I believe. So there is probably a higher density of hard booters there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt D Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 I do not have the time to write a tyraid atm, so ultracarve... it is obvious to me that you never have taken the CAIS alpine race module. If you had, you would realize that CASI actually teaches about 3 or 4 Alpine riding techniques. These are not focused on in the level 1 and 2 courses since Alpine riding is a minority. Please spare me the walk like a duck analogy. I know several very good riders who rank well in CASI. They all have individual style, to the point that I can tell who is who by simply watching them from a good distance. Eurocarves being frowned upon!!! Please! Eurocarves are actually demostrated in the new promotional video we produced for this year. It honestly sounds to me like you've made you decisions about CASI and now have a closed mind. All I can say is I've been a CASI member for 4 years and I'm a much better rider for it, and my skill progress has happend so much faster then it would have without CASI. I think what I dislike the most about your post is that it will probably sour someone on this forum from taking their level 1 and finding out what CASI might have to offer them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt D Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Here is a link to the Course Agenda, as well as a description of what is required of a CASI Level 4. http://www.casi-acms.com/pdfs/Level4_Agenda_Descrip_03.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 FWIW, Here is a perspective from a full cert US guy who also ventured northward last spring to pick up a CASI level II race coach cert. Ultracarve: you make some good points, and while I don't know the circumstances surrounding your experiences with CASI ultracarve, I can say from personal experience that I thought the examiners I rode with were quite open minded. I have also been very pleasantly suprised with the local level 4 guy we brought on as a coach at our last carve camp in Sun Peaks. We briefed him on the format for the week and focus points each day and he took care of the the rest. His name is Justin Garey and he rips. I know one rigid examiner can leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth and things can get very doctrinaire at the higher cert levels, but in all fairness I have found the CASI system to far more open than our AASI programs in the US. I am also very jazzed with the fact that CASI at least has a race coach program developed for and taught by alpine enthusiasts. We have nothing of the sort in the states. -Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jagger Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Allee I think this will settle all ? burtons video "scream of consiousness" I'll copy and mail you one, Peter Bauer & Jean Nerva Circa 1991 just wtching you can learn alot True euro carving, reading bomber I have tried some new stuff but for the under the lift nothing beats the true EURO! Mike;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 I'm happy to stand corrected on the level 4 issue, my statements were based on the way things were last I checked into lessons, which was 2 or 3 years ago. My fault, who knew so many level fours would spring up in so little time? Maybe I'm just a little bitter about the whole process. I have twice signed up for an "advanced" lesson, got stuck with a bunch of people who were lucky to skid their way down a blue run. Look at the programs posted on the wall, there's 9 levels of progression for skiing and only 4? I think for riding. It basically stops after you can stay on edge on a blue run. When I was skiing, I could take a group lesson and guaranteed the instructor could kick my ass and teach me something. For riding it appears I need to sign up for a private and hope it's good. Do they give you a refund if you can ride better than your instructor? That's what happened last time I was at an "advanced" lesson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Allee, short boards like 157s can be ridden beyond their carvable speed envelope. It takes a lot of G's to be able to lay out, and doing so on a short board can be more difficult for some people. -Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Allee, We had 6 carvers in Banff last week, too bad you didn't catch us, anyhow, Norquay.... yea its small but for carving dang! ultra fast! Theres a reason by the National team trains there! Nakiska is a good mountain, unless you can get to Panarama another fine carving mountain. Silver Star ain't bad either! Maybe next time! Probabley heading to Sun Peaks finnally next year! Good luck! watch the trees, the bark isn't fully ripe yet! since its been so cold tasted terrible last week, but should taste fine now! Right said Shred:o time to take a nap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allee Posted February 6, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 Shred, you're a nutcase. I try to avoid trees like the plague, I've always found that bark in your teeth is a really bad look. Jack, the board is a 156 Hot Blast (blue stripe, not sure if that's the GS one or not). Yes, it's a baby, but I'm only 5 ft 9 and 148 lb, so I wouldn't think I'm overpowering it by any means! I also currently ride in ski boots, but Ihave a pair of used Raichle 223's arriving today. I'm about to take possession of a 159 Rossi freecarve board that I bought off the Bomber site, to try something a bit more mellow as the Blast is the only carver I've ever ridden. Might be interesting to see if that makes a difference... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest exdreamgirl Posted February 6, 2004 Report Share Posted February 6, 2004 hey there allee, just to let you know we don't have any carving instructors at the moment at norquay, but it is an awesome place to learn and get fast! There are a couple guys who work through unlimited snowboard shop, pete jensen and mark tanguay who are awesome at teaching people how to carve hard and fast, just give the shop a ring and leave a message for them. As well if you go out to Kicking Horse, get in touch with a guy named Trevor at the Snowboard School, he is incredible and really knows his stuff (he's an exquebec-er) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Matt D Posted February 7, 2004 Report Share Posted February 7, 2004 Ultracarve, I appologize for the "its obvious... Alpine Race" comment. I think maybe you should do a PDP session or audit a Race 1 course so you can see just how much has changed in CASI. I myself have had a very positive experiance with CASI thus far, and hope my good relationship with them will continue. As an Examiner I try to promote a positive image of CASI to the public, because there are so many people who still don't know about CASI and what we have to offer. It seems to me that you feel you should have been grandfathered to your Level 3, and I'm curious as to why. I know a few level 2's who were grandfathered, and to be honest... some of them deserved to be 3's, and some didn't. There is a whole lot of Pedagogy and Advanced-Expert level stuff that most Grandfathered 3's don't know, or ever had to be evaluated on. I can understand that you didn't want to take the freestyle course. It was HARD! I was scared... totally scared to do a frontside and backside 360 over the 25' table, but it was the only table we had, and it was in the standard... so I got the balls to do it. After 19 dislocated shoulders it wasn't easy either, but I wanted it. And after it was all said and done, I'm a stronger rider for it, and it makes me feel like I earned it. CASI didn't make 4 levels because of the money. We had 3 levels, with a huge jump between level's 2 and 3. So, it was decided to add more pedagogy & expert riding content, and turn it into 4 courses. Just my opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allee Posted February 7, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2004 to exdreamgirl - thanks for the tips! Will certainly follow up on those, and the next time I hit the hills by myself I might take a trip to Norquay, I've never been there. Hopefully will get out to KHMR before the end of the season as well - I loved that hill last year, even with no snow! A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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