Fat Old Bastard Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Hello expert carvers, What do you think about these Bateleon boards ? Yes they are freeride/freestyle boards but what do you think about the triple base idea ? See: http://www.bataleon.com/site/technology/triple_base_geometry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeW Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Sounds similar theory with spatula skis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfell Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Where did they get those deflection numbers????? Each board is going to twist differently due to it's torsional stiffness. You'll never be able to get this thing ground. If I'm understanding this right, it would be similar to riding a railed board, which isn't all that great of a feeling. There is a reason why people detune boards, especially freestyle sticks. There are easier ways to get the job done, in my opinion, that board builders already do. But I have never seen one of these in real life, let alone ridden one so I could be way off. But honestly I don't see the advantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Old Bastard Posted July 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Lee: I didn't know about the Spatulas but after googling they look a bit different. Reverse sidecut. Phil: I haven't seen one myself yet but I'm trying to figure out whether their claims make sense. I can see the appeal for freestyle riders - it would be harder to catch an edge when spinning or landing. But I find it hard to believe that you wouldn't be sacrificing too much edge grip the rest of the time. Like you say it's like the ultimate edge detune. I imagine it would be very forgiving on hacked up heavy snow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Old Bastard Posted July 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 http://www.bataleon.com/site/technology/triple_base_technology Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinecure Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Spatulas have reverse sidecut and reverse camber. I haven't skied them, but I'd like to try, especially on a powder day. I imagine they'd be pretty squirrelly underfoot on the groomers at any speed. Next year they're bringing out a ski called the Pontoon. Its bigger and has a differnet, but similar concept sidecut and reverse camber. I'm amazed at how wide skis have gotten. They have a sqwal on each foot now. I just got some powder skis that are 99mm underfoot and those are looking narrow already in comparison to the new powder skis. Re: that triple base board. That would be a biatch to get tuned. I have an O-Sin 4807 with the boat nose and they screwed that up. I can't imagine them being able to machine tune a base that bevels like that. Even hand-tuning would be a bear. If it sells boards for them, all the better I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex1230 Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 looks like the guy who designed this thing forgot what edges are for... correct me if I'm wrong but is he saying the base cross section would look like \_/ ? how are you going to turn the thing? Tilt every turn to 90 degrees? and I think the core (if it is shaped the same) would break down rather quickly. Morrow had a board back in '90 or '91 - the spoon - had a nose that looked kinda like that. pain in the a$$ to tune - but it was a halfpipe - specific board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Old Bastard Posted July 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 looks like the guy who designed this thing forgot what edges are for...correct me if I'm wrong but is he saying the base cross section would look like \_/ ? how are you going to turn the thing? Tilt every turn to 90 degrees? and I think the core (if it is shaped the same) would break down rather quickly. Morrow had a board back in '90 or '91 - the spoon - had a nose that looked kinda like that. pain in the a$$ to tune - but it was a halfpipe - specific board. I vaguely remember that Morrow but never rode one. But yeah the Bataleon is going to be a real problem to stonegrind. If I understand the design it's only the nose and tail where the edges are raised above the snow. The mid section is flat like a normal board. I'm not rushing out to buy one, but it's good to see a company with the courage to experiment with something different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 If I'm understanding this right, it would be similar to riding a railed board, which isn't all that great of a feeling. no, it's the other way. this page has a better picture: http://www.bataleon.com/site/technology/triple_base_technology I'd have to ride it to know, but it doesn't make sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikerdad Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Skidders should love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex1230 Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 no, it's the other way. this page has a better picture:http://www.bataleon.com/site/technology/triple_base_technology I'd have to ride it to know, but it doesn't make sense to me. Not an engineer - but it seems with those sharp beraks in base angle you'd stress the board only along the edge of the center section and it would create a weak point there...you think snapping a board across the waist is bad, I'd hate to have the board crack lengthwise while in a turn... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgang Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Kinda looks like the original burton boards...the ones with the fins and the rubber binders.....more like a u shape than a - shape Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philw Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Spatulas have reverse sidecut and reverse camber. I haven't skied them, but I'd like to try, especially on a powder day. I imagine they'd be pretty squirrelly underfoot on the groomers at any speed. Here's a pair of Spats in use: They ride fine according to Dave (in the shot), but he's pretty nifty and doesn't see a lot of piste, which they'd be crap in IMHO. I don't ride skis these days so I can't comment directly. They haven't exactly taken the heli world by storm. As far as the Batt* stuff, I looked at their site when they launched and the pseudo-technical stuff was garbage. You could probably ride powder on a board like that, but I've seen a lot of powder boards but none of those... go figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 ... a couple of summers ago at Timberline. He tought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread, but he was not riding any better than his buddies, they were all pretty freestyle oriented riders, all competent riders but none were really trying to carve... just trying to get down to the pip eas fast as they could. My cynical impression was that such a design was a great crutch for someone who can't get rid of that las bit of skid from their turns... keeps 'em fgrom catching edges when they ride hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted July 13, 2006 Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 As a matter of interest, current World Cup GS boards use similar design ideas to create running surface that is less prone to catching the edge (in flat sections). The tail edges are made 'high' (0.6mm?) and with large amounts of taper (8-10mm?)to achieve this. I've got a Generics IQ170 which has tail adges a bit high... So, it might be the tune not the warp? I was reluctant to retune it as it has a killer structure in the base. Anyhow, the tail feels nice in powder, groomed softer stuff and slush, but squirrely on icy or really hard packed snow. Back to Bateleon guys, it sounds as they are trying to create an ultimate board for swing turn - opposite to what we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Old Bastard Posted July 13, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2006 Kinda looks like the original burton boards...the ones with the fins and the rubber binders.....more like a u shape than a - shape If I remember correctly my old Burton Cruzer had that kind of shape in the tail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pow Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 eliminates suction i guess, but it doesnt seem very good for balance or carving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 ... a couple of summers ago at Timberline. He tought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread, but he was not riding any better than his buddies, they were all pretty freestyle oriented riders, all competent riders but none were really trying to carve... just trying to get down to the pip eas fast as they could. My cynical impression was that such a design was a great crutch for someone who can't get rid of that las bit of skid from their turns... keeps 'em fgrom catching edges when they ride hard. I saw a guy carrying one around Kirkwood while I was doing my Backcountry awareness training (which basically taught me that I know nothing about backcountry snowboarding), I wanted to run over and talk to him about it but couldn't leave the class. I read from the website (I was amused by the "on snow" and off snow photos) that there is a local rep in Portland, OR (USA_info@bataleon.com )that a bunch of people in PacNW have these boards and I would be interested in trying them out for myself, although I agree with Mike that is sounds like a crutch. I mean I'm not a great rail rider, but I can do basic stuff like 50/50 to boardslides on kinked rail and I'm never caught my edge on a rail. Maybe it's a little helpful for sketchy landings but again if I'm somewhat over my board when I come out of the air (which is not always the case when I spin) I usually land it. Currrently my favorite freestyle/freeride board is a Madd TT158 as usually I'm more concerned with freestyle board being able to carve than them being able to do freestyle. Nevertheless I'm always interested in checking stuff out and would like to try one out. It's probably worthless, but I like to find out for real. Anyways, even it it did work, it still wouldn't be very useful to most people on this community because it's still a freestyle board and this is an alpine community. Reduced edge catches and softer landings aren't very useful if you are mainly carving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 I rode a few days with a buddy of mine on spats who is a sick skier. We were doing some clif hucking on a crazy pow day, and he jumped onto a buried rock and killed the skis. On the 4th day of using them. Watching him ski pow with them was awesome, and I can't wait to see him ski them again this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terekhov Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 there are many bataleons around me here in siberia. I have possibility to test ride BX model bataleon, but cannot urge myself to do it after my friend, best russian/eurocup BXer - testridden it vs. f2 eliminator.ltd (his usual BX deck), and found that bataleon is not his cup of tea, but in all other aspects is very sturdy and dependable deck. I have it in my hands for some days too (not fs/jib decks, I mean BX deck only). when layed on floor - there are some near 1mm under cants. convexines by design, but with flat central part - so straightlining is dependable, and carving possibility is some bit degraded IMHO. and yes - when I saw it for the 1st time - emotions was "skidders paradise board for sure" :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
www.oldsnowboards.com Posted July 14, 2006 Report Share Posted July 14, 2006 Checked them out at the Portland Show last fall. Looked like very high quality production. I liked the story behind the designer and his hands on approach. I wish they made a board longer than 168cm. However, I will definitely ride one given the chance. I love innovation, if it really works, I ride it , if it doesn't I add it to the collection of interesting concept boards. Win, Win! Spoke with several of their "Pro" riders on the mountain and they were genuinely jazzed. Never got a chance to see one "Get it On" though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateW Posted July 15, 2006 Report Share Posted July 15, 2006 It looks like the same idea as a base (edge) bevel, only much more so. I really like the feel of a 1 degree bevel, it makes the board feel much more neutral when going straight. It's subtle but I have all my boards tuned that way now, and there is no loss of carveability. I'm guessing the Bataleon version is much less subtle. It might affect carving in theory, but still, I would not be surprised if they carve just fine. There's a couple of claims at the web site that I take issue with, though. "World's fastest snowboard," my ass. And something about how the tip and tail of a regular board dig in too much when the board is on edge. Someone needs to read Jack's physics article. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slopetool Posted July 23, 2006 Report Share Posted July 23, 2006 I talked to the ex-NW rep. here in Portland a few weeks ago. He said that the older models from a year ago (or before) are far better than now. And he has dropped representation and would'nt do business with the company anymore. The owner's are not snowboarders and have cut costs and quality to save $$$ and earn more profits. Shipping and communication were terrible last year. Its a Swedish company, right? I would have expected better since their bikini team is pretty hot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeW Posted July 23, 2006 Report Share Posted July 23, 2006 I talked to the ex-NW rep. here in Portland a few weeks ago. He said that the older models from a year ago (or before) are far better than now. And he has dropped representation and would'nt do business with the company anymore. The owner's are not snowboarders and have cut costs and quality to save $$$ and earn more profits. Shipping and communication were terrible last year. Its a Swedish company, right? I would have expected better since their bikini team is pretty hot. I wonder if this is what happened to Husqvarna motorcycles division at Sweden before the merge with Cagiva in Italy during 1986. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_x Posted July 24, 2006 Report Share Posted July 24, 2006 lol... check out their website while they remodel: http://bataleon.circus.fm/ They have their '07 models on there too. (what is that, a 50-foot snow drift on the cover of the catalogue? ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.