Alpine Snowboarders Hand Armour

[SunSurfer]

Used the hand armour for real at SES 2015.

Comments & questions from almost everyone I rode the chair with. The "jugs" caused quite a stir!

 

Thanks to Steve Recsky for the photos of them in use, for my riding style was transformed by a combination of Joergs' Pureboarding clinic and Richard's Steeps Clinic. I now happily "touch down" especially when it's steep. The photos were taken on the last day of the session, on Javelin & Ruthies, runs that intimidated me in the past.

 

 

 

These photos show the second pair I made, no protuding pole tip at the bottom, and a GoPro mount on top of the right hand.

The best way I found to use them is shown clearly in the toeside turn, hand in front of the body with the long axis of the hand armour across the direction of movement. Using the long axis in the line of travel makes it more likely to catch a little and push the hand/arm back.

The little protusions are best heat welded smoothly to blend into the contour of the end of the HDPE pressure vessel the hand armour is made from.

 

Thanks to OhD for the video @ Buttermilk

 

Just being worn near the beginning, then around 3:10 shows version 2 getting a harder workout. Some of the video was shot from the GoPro mount on my right hand armour.

Edited June 14, 2016 by SunSurfer

[SunSurfer]

1st to 3rd iteration photos - left to right

 

 

 

The profile of the third iteration is much more like a ski tip than the relatively sharp curve of 1 & 2.

 

Construction details for 3

 

 

 

 

The original HDPE garden spray pot diameter was 125mm, anything in the range 120-130mm is big enough to take a gloved hand holding the ski pole handle. I've a size 7 & 1/2 hand when it comes to medical gloves, kind of average male size.

 

The ski poles were a standard adult sized Gipron model with alloy poles.

 

The thread on the top of the pot was cut off and a flat piece of HDPE welded to cover the gap using my soldering iron.

 

Exterior plywood inserts were made for the top and bottom. The top one had the shape of the ski pole handle inset to hold the pole firmly. The bottom was drilled to take the alloy pole stub. Then the ply was coated in epoxy resin and allowed to dry.

The whole unit was then assembled and checked, before a masking tape dam was applied and epoxy resin was poured around the top insert to set it firmly in place. The dam allowed the resin to be higher than the HDPE cut edge as can be seen in the photos.

 

Note that they are different for R & L hands as were the previous versions.

 

My riding has continued to progress. I now use them primarily as armour, and only touch down rarely. However, when I do touch down they slide beautifully and there is no strain on the arm or shoulder. No longer is there any need to turn them side on to avoid the catch.

 

I've been using one version or another for the last 2 years and had many falls during that time. My hands and arms and shoulders are much less stressed by the impacts than when I was wearing wrist guards. I don't worry about touching the snow any more, nor do I wear out expensive gloves. Reaction from others has been varied. Most people "get it" as soon as I explain. Some thing it's brilliant, some of the young ones think it's cool.

The reaction from other carvers has been interesting. Most behave as if they're too cool to try them. I had just one person at SES 2015 ask to give them a trial and had a Japanese snowboard instructor in NZ ask to try the 1st version.

Edited June 14, 2016 by SunSurfer

[nextcarve]

Pretty useless for Extremecarving.

 

   

[SunSurfer]

Pretty useless for Extremecarving.

 

   

Nice bike, nextcarve. Yours? You're clearly "too cool", just as I said.

My hands and brain are my livelihood. I cannot afford another hand injury that would have me off some aspects of my work for 3+ months

Edited June 15, 2016 by SunSurfer

[nextcarve]

Wow, this construction even protects your brain. How does this work.  

I use a helmet for that (my brain wouldn't fit). 

 

I can see your goal and getting hurt is not what you want. But with your construction I would be afraid to cut my wrists while EC'ing.

And using your hands as support wheels is bad technic and dangerous at the same time (even with your brain protector  ). Sooner or later your whole arm will get slogged back and your shoulder joint is dislocated.

 

Try not to touch the snow, as long as you ride like shown in your videos (lift your hands). If your getting lower in your turns, touch the snow with your forearm (like rails in front of you), while lifting up your hands at the same time. This technic will protect your hands and your shoulders at the same time 

 

To protect the forearm you might use some of these. I'm not against protectors, but yours look dangerous to me. 

 

 

PS: My bike is this one, but I use it without support wheels ;-)

Edited June 15, 2016 by nextcarve

[SunSurfer]

Hi Nextcarve, Thanks for your thoughts. :)

 

In previous posts I've noted that I try not to touch the snow, and that these are primarily hand "helmets".

In 2 years of use, and crashes, I've not had the problems you anticipate.

I've not tried to EC with them, and have no plans to do so. At 57, I ride to carve but stay intact, and I've read too many tales of people's shoulder and arm injuries from attempts at EC.

[nextcarve]

I'm still not convinced of your hand helmets. One of the most common injuries in snowboarding are wrist fractures and your "protection" may lead to an even higher risk.

 

The best way to prevent yourself from injuries is not to fall    or to practice correct falling as shown in this video.

https://youtu.be/PPQMRLl14cM?t=18s

 

Second best is a good protection (like this) which does not involve other risk.

 

Anyway; I hope you have a save season in NZ.

 

Edited June 15, 2016 by nextcarve

[SunSurfer]

 

To embed as above , just remove the s from the https.

Edited June 15, 2016 by SunSurfer

[Neil Gendzwill]

They weren't seriously suggesting a cup there, were they?  I was watching with the sound off.

 

Anyways, I've been riding for 30 years and never hurt my wrists or really anything else snowboarding.  I credit judo with teaching me how to fall loose and safe.

[lowrider]

I embrace any device or technology that makes riding more enjoyable or safer. To dismiss what other's attempt without the

knowledge of how that device works or how best to use it is in my opinion sad. To those who fail to understand what

motivates others to see deficiencies and address them will never understand that part of humanity that is part of the

solution rather than the problem. Tinker on fellow carvers your always welcome in my shop.

[michael.a]

I on the other hand have been riding for 8 years and have severely impinged my wrists, particularly in the first 2 years when falling over every other turn as a beginner. I also ride touching the snow (inadvertently first putting pressure and later as a failsafe measure during balance loss). In hindsight, I should have been using wrist protection from the outset. Now I have a number of chronic issues at age 32 that later down the road will require major serious surgery and/or face disability.

 

Wrist protection. USE IT.

[Neil Gendzwill]

I on the other hand have been riding for 8 years and have severely impinged my wrists, particularly in the first 2 years when falling over every other turn as a beginner. I also ride touching the snow (inadvertently first putting pressure and later as a failsafe measure during balance loss). In hindsight, I should have been using wrist protection from the outset. Now I have a number of chronic issues at age 32 that later down the road will require major serious surgery and/or face disability.

 

Wrist protection. USE IT.

Well, if you have a tendency to try to stop your falls with your hands, then yeah wrist protection will help.  If you know how to fall, not so much an issue.

[philw]

I on the other hand have been riding for 8 years and have severely impinged my wrists,  ...

 

Wrist protection. USE IT.

(politely - I won't shout back) But if you look at your own avatar you can see immediately why you need that protection.

 

http://www.ski-injury.com/specific-injuries/wrist

The available data seem a little out of date and may be heavily influenced by the majority terrain park users and the relatively low number of experienced snowboarders, and in my case the relatively low amount of powder some people ride.

 

Reducing the risk of injury related to reaching for the snow with gadgets is one approach, but to me it's an inelegant approach.

 

Risk-assessment is a personal issue, as is riding style.

Edited June 17, 2016 by philw

[michael.a]

Actually I find the cause environmental. Those who ride in the fluff and hero snow ride high and aloof, hands up high. Those who ride the frozen hardpack that within an hour thaws out to a rutted out mogul mine field ride low, compact, with hands always pointing downwards ready to correct loss of balance. Case in point: racers. Every single one directs his hands on the snow. Bad technique? Arguably yes, as it breaks angulation and dips the shoulder. Necessary? Yes.

Edited June 18, 2016 by michael.a

[b0ardski]

if that was a lightsaber handle I'd be all over it

[SunSurfer]

if that was a lightsaber handle I'd be all over it

Next iteration mods hmm.... ;)

1/ Light sabre

2/ Whisky/vodka/martini (shaken, not stirred)/antifreeze of choice compartment

3/ Bling (mirrored finish externally)

4/ Turn indicators

5/ Paintball cannon

6/ Smoke flares

7/ Jet assist for cattracks

8/ Hand warmer elements in the handles

etc.

Suggestions welcomed.

[lowrider]

You forgot "lessons". so one doesn't have to be such a deviant that necessitates the use of such dangerous aids. Hope

season is going well !

[SunSurfer]

Just been reviewing 2015-6 Fis equipment regulations. Skiers are encouraged to wear protective equipment and alpine ski racers gloves can have plastic shields that slide over them. For snowboarders there is no regulation about gloves at all, while there are specific regulations for alpine, freestyle and ski jump skiers gloves. Hand armour may actually be race permissible in 2016.

[SunSurfer]

Pictures of Left handed 3D design built in TinkerCAD. Matching Right handed version. .stl files available on request.

Minor problem. Local commercial 3D printing company quoted me over $500 per hand to print them in Nylon 12. 
http://3dprint-nz.com/3d-printing/3d-printer-materials/

My "found item" construction method suddenly looks a whole lot more reasonable.

 

Edited April 23, 2019 by SunSurfer