Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Well, it looks like I'm not the only one.... And Boris, a couple questions. Is there sufficient clearance between the board and plate? Or between the plate slider blocks and the board? Also, you just threaded the UHMDPE for the bolts into the slider and pivot blocks? I ended up through-bolting mine with a plate of stainless steel. Also stiffened the entire plate with a strip of maple. It was really flexy before that. My design is (obviously) based on Sean's. (Remember Sean, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Well, it looks like I'm not the only one....And Boris, a couple questions. Is there sufficient clearance between the board and plate? Or between the plate slider blocks and the board? Also, you just threaded the UHMW for the bolts into the slider and pivot blocks? I ended up through-bolting mine with a plate of stainless steel. Also stiffened the entire plate with a strip of maple. It was really flexy before that. My design is (obviously) based on Sean's. (Remember Sean, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!) I love that you're using the bottom side of the board as a bearing surface. As a board designer, I should have thought of just using p-tex on the bottom, but I didn't. I wonder how the uUHMW to UHMW bearing surface will hold up. Very cool. Are you sure you have enough travel there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Sean, if you are referring to my plate, the slider you are looking at is an early version. I have since modified it to give a longer travel length. I do wish I had access to a CNC machine. Your work is beautiful. Makes mine look like it was whittled by one armed monkeys. As far as how well the UHMW bearing surfaces hold up, I'll let you know. :-) BTW what are your thoughts on tapping the UHMDPE? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Sean, if you are referring to my plate, the slider you are looking at is an early version. I have since modified it to give a longer travel length. I do wish I had access to a CNC machine. Your work is beautiful. Makes mine look like it was whittled by one armed monkeys. As far as how well the UHMW bearing surfaces hold up, I'll let you know. :-) BTW what are your thoughts on tapping the UHMDPE? I don't think you'll get adequate retention. Even if you did initially, the cyclical loading would wear the threads and they would eventually fail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Sean, if you are referring to my plate, the slider you are looking at is an early version. I have since modified it to give a longer travel length. I do wish I had access to a CNC machine. Your work is beautiful. Makes mine look like it was whittled by one armed monkeys. As far as how well the UHMW bearing surfaces hold up, I'll let you know. :-) BTW what are your thoughts on tapping the UHMDPE? Is that lower slider plate aluminum or stainless. 1/8in aluminum will never support the loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 The metal under the Delrin is 1/8" Stainless Steel. Curious though that you don't feel aluminum will support the load but don't question the use of totally unsupported plastic or the point load applied by the 3/8" bolts BlueB used. Speaking of which, doesn't the use of 2 bolts rather than a through-bolt essentially create a kind of hinge point putting additional stress on only 2 of the mounting bolts? I would think a solid shaft helps spread out the load between the 4 bolts holding the UHMDPE to the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Good luck DIY'ers, and I mean that sincerely. Bruce Varsava was telling me at the ECES that a bunch of his fellow provincial racers were home-brewing Apex knock-off plates by cutting up old snowboards, and that most of them were having a lot of trouble. I guess many were too flexible, and had improper axle placement. The action of the plate and the board would actually combine to a detrimental result, worse than having no plate at all. I look forward to hearing from you guys this winter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I hear ya, Jack. I looked at many of the designs and felt Sean's was the right combination of design/strength/simplicity. It was also something I could actually stand a chance of duplicating in my shop. As for stiffness, I did originally build it from an old K2 Fatbob with no additional support. It was like being on a trampoline. Way too much flex. So I stole yet another idea from Sean and ran a maple stringer up the center on the underside. It stiffened things up nicely. I feel much better about it now. The placement of the axles was in part dictated by the inserts on the board. I think it'll be ok. The binding center is just onboard of the shaft. I can work with the position slightly, bringing one foot or the other more directly over the pivot but I'm starting here. I guess we'll see. I have virtually nothing invested except time, with most of the materials being things I had kicking around. I think I spent $7 on the stainless axles. And seeing as how you're just up the road, if you're nice to me, I might even let you try it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I transfered the answers to your questions into the "Plan-B Plate" tread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Good luck DIY'ers, and I mean that sincerely. Bruce Varsava was telling me at the ECES that a bunch of his fellow provincial racers were home-brewing Apex knock-off plates by cutting up old snowboards, and that most of them were having a lot of trouble. I guess many were too flexible, and had improper axle placement. The action of the plate and the board would actually combine to a detrimental result, worse than having no plate at all.I look forward to hearing from you guys this winter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I guess many were too flexible, and had improper axle placement. The action of the plate and the board would actually combine to a detrimental result, worse than having no plate at all. With the systems that mount on 4x4 patterns, you do not have to many choices, at least not going super wide like with outer set of UPM. So, if one's stance is not too wide, binding centers can be just inboard from the axles. Guys riding narrow stances have few more options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jburrill Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Really cool to see all the new designs. Id love to see a hardware kit that could adapt to home made plates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokkis Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 You can take Donek hw-kit and put it your own plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 And seeing as how you're just up the road, if you're nice to me, I might even let you try it out. And you could take a ride on my Bomber ------ Plate. (name to be revealed soon!) :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xy9ine Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Really cool to see all the new designs. Id love to see a hardware kit that could adapt to home made plates. indeed. i'd be all over that. great way to recycle dead old decks. though i can see a manufacturer reluctant to sell hardware only due to lack of implementation control leading to the possibility of poor performance, failure, etc. all sorts of fun liabilities. still... i'm assuming the donek hardware conversion kits don't have all the necessary bits for a diy plate (ie, there's some common hardware between the two mounting types). correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 And you could take a ride on my Bomber ------ Plate. (name to be revealed soon!) :D Great! A little compare and contrast going. I love it! Do I get to ride the Kessler too? Oh wait...you sold that one. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 i'm assuming the donek hardware conversion kits don't have all the necessary bits for a diy plate (ie, there's some common hardware between the two mounting types). correct? I would not be able to use Sean's "hardware kit" on my plate. He builds metal reinforcements into his that my plate does not incorporate. Afraid his hardware would pull right through a homemade plate. Unless you made it from scratch.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 The metal under the Delrin is 1/8" Stainless Steel. Curious though that you don't feel aluminum will support the load but don't question the use of totally unsupported plastic or the point load applied by the 3/8" bolts BlueB used. Speaking of which, doesn't the use of 2 bolts rather than a through-bolt essentially create a kind of hinge point putting additional stress on only 2 of the mounting bolts? I would think a solid shaft helps spread out the load between the 4 bolts holding the UHMDPE to the board. Maybe I'm missing something. I guess I'd have to see more detail on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Maybe I'm missing something. I guess I'd have to see more detail on this. Well you can see it here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Just wonder, why you did the elaborate wing shaped bases? Bigger dead spot and potential to point load a board with metal top sheet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 Just wonder, why you did the elaborate wing shaped bases? Bigger dead spot and potential to point load a board with metal top sheet... Two reasons: Weight and pressure distribution. I originally had a large rectangular base in order to help spread the load. I don't know how much good it would have done but my gut told me it would be better than a small footprint. The size was based on the footprint of an average plate binding. I then cut them down a bit to save some weight and felt the smaller points would flex a bit rather than create a "point load". And technically it's not a metal topsheet board. All in all, it's a combination of experience, instinct and winging it! I'm certainly no engineer but I have built a lot of things and nothing's fallen down yet. lol I plan to take it easy and see how it goes. Like you, I feel what's the worst that can happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobD Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 what's the worst that can happen? A quick lesson in mini boarding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarder_Ted Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 A quick lesson in mini boarding? I've always wanted to take up a new sport! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powdahbonz Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 I for one would love to try both and while not feasible now for Sean and Fin, it would be great to see something in the way of a demo/rental/swap project that would allow perhaps some regional trials and comparison for us. I am interested in feeling the performance and getting a chance to try the advancements. Looking forward to riding with you both to get your feedback. Projected 1st turns first week of December Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tb Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 I for one would love to try both and while not feasible now for Sean and Fin, it would be great to see something in the way of a demo/rental/swap project that would allow perhaps some regional trials and comparison for us. I am interested in feeling the performance and getting a chance to try the advancements. Looking forward to riding with you both to get your feedback. Projected 1st turns first week of December I don't think im letting any kind of hat out of the bag here. . . . Sean has already talked to me about shipping a spare plate with both 4X4 and UPM hardware so I would have it available for people to try, either on a spare donek demo board, or their own board. I live west of boston, but will likely be at: stratton sunapee Wachusettes (possibly in the gates) Ward (USASA) and Nashoba (5 minutes from my house) Other arrangements can likely be made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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