front bale opens

[lowrider]

Funny feeling on heel side turn i look down front toe bale is open down i go left leg spinning with the 186 coiler spinning like a chopper blade luckily my body kept up with the rotations as well.That sick slow motion feeling slowly leaves my body.I have survived my worst snowboarding fear.Now the big question is anyone working on releasable bindings?? ie; if one opens both open. Never affected my nerve on skis as the fear of windmilling on one ski was moderated by the knowledge that another impact would release the final ski. Not the case with a snowboard almost as long and twice the weight. I was totally in tune with each rotation waiting for that final crunch!! Luckily it didn't happen. Tylenol is my friend! i'm very pleased my hip, knee and ankle have survived the short hellicopter flight. Any other bombers have a similar flight ??

[Erik J]

Oh yeah, this is scary.

I pulled out a set of rear inserts mid carve(ish) at an ECES event. It happened in slow motion for me as well. My instinct was to suck up both knees and give the board a bear hug with all my might. I slid on my back for a loooong way. No injury at all. I felt lucky. The board was a demo......oops.

Oh and Tighten up your bindings!

[lowrider]

I believe my tether strap twisted around my leg and lifted the bale. Going to change to a small short tight leash

[Buell]

I had it happen for the first time this season. I had adjusted my bindings the night before and did not double check the tightness. I did not pick up on it on my first couple of runs of the day either. Check your bail tightness!

Serious slow motion. My back foot came out when I hit some soft snow and got forward on the board. I managed to straighten the board under me with my front foot as my head dropped into a front flip. Kept that motion going all the way onto my back as my board came over me. I was then able to keep the board in the air until I slid to a stop. Whew!! Is about all I can say to that experience.

[AaronG]

If you are concerned with the binding releasing on you again try this little fix. Cut a piece of cord or nylon webbing and attach it to the cutout of the toe lever. Slip the cord or webbing under the lowest buckle of your boot, then close the buckle trapping the webbing or cord under the buckle. The toe lever won't be able to open as long as your buckles are tight.

If this is on your rear foot it will only take a second more to close your boot buckle also. Cheap insurance to not have the lever open up again.

BTW, this will only work on trenchdiggers and Cateks, the other bindings don't have the necessary cutout to attach something

[mr_roboteye]

A long time ago I broke the baseplate on a set of burton race physics while riding my sims burner 188 at ridiculous speeds. I didn't tumble though, just slid on my keester, so I didn't get hurt at all. The worst part was the walk back to the top of the chair.

later,

Dave R.

[ursle]

exactly what kind of binding?

[Transistor Rhythm]

I saw a Nordicboard at Axamer Lizum this weekend (too bad when returning rent ski's for a colleague at the end of the trip so I could only look and not test it ), and the difference between a Nordicboard and a traditional or more modern monoski is that it has two plate bindings mounted on top of a ski binding, so it would always release both legs at the same time.

I can see other problems rise if your legs are bound to a small piece of metal but it won't be half as bad as releasing one leg while the other one is mangled still in the binding. I've decided will never ride a monoski if it's not a Nordicboard, why take that extra risk?

Now I could see a similar setup work in conjunction with Vist or Hangl plates. It would be interesting to find out!

[b0ardski]

releasable snowboard bindings have been tried before and abandoned. The mechanism to make both feet release if one binding opens is complicated and bulky, also there is a good reason that skis that release no longer use leashes, imagine cartwheeling down a hill with a freshly sharpened plank tied to your leg:eek: so ski brakes add more bulk & complexity = more wieght & expense.

I don't want that plank coming off my feet wether I stand on it forward or sideways.

I like the idea of trapping a tether under the buckle but I refuse to give up the security & convenience of my step-ins til they pry them off my cold dead feet.

[BulletProof]

I had the front foot come loose once, I hadn't set in the heal bail properly, fortunatly, my short clip-on leash kept my boot on the board (Tele leash clip with short section of 6mm cord from binding to bottom buckle).

Now, I adjust the bail very tight with no slop on the boot (had to dremmel the sides of the boot tongue a bit for my OS1).

Double check the bails on the top of the run and twist both boots around to check for play, take the first turns easy.

[ur13]

And this thread is why I stopped riding bails a long time ago.

I love intec heels (and no I've never had a failure or icing issues in 8 years riding them. I also like the stiffer connection o the board.)

[lowrider]

Thanks for the info just finished making up a couple of short tethers.Good to go as soon as pants return from cleaners ! Bruce told me the origin of the boards name its becoming clearer every outing .

[Dave ESPI]

On three seperate occasions Ive had my bails open on me. Almost always on boards where I'm running low angles under 50 degrees. Something about the boots twisting lateraly in the bails makes them open. I created a web belt section with small quick clips that went under my boot and around the toe bail for my back foot. It worked wonderfully till I was at Stratton Mountain 2 weeks ago and I accidently left it sitting on the ground. I went for a few runs and was hessitant, but the bail was holding..... till I came down tamarack and dropped a really big toeside that need a lot of pressure to arc it, and the next thing I know Im superman sliding down the face of the hill with that all too familliar feeling of the rear foot being loose. It really messed with my confidence and I spent a good half hour trying to find that silly strap at the base.

IT IS THE SINGLE SCARIEST FEELING EVER on a carve board at 20+ mph when you hear that "PING!" sound and then see your foot swinging up in the air on a heelside as you go down...... or when you are on a toeside turn and end up doig a europowerslide into a race fence head first.....

I was really really lucky at stratton, and didnt hurt myself. I devised a "leash" clip into doing what I needed. Ill post a pic in a few Minutes.

[Dave ESPI]

pic of toe bail.

I loop the clip under the front foot clip. All it has to do is just keep the tension on it. While riding and works fine. To release I just unclip the toe adjuster and it releases. Later I unclip the leash and slip it back under the toe and clip it to the bail loop.

[yyzcanuck]

DaveESPI... could you post a pic taken directly from the side of your boot/binding? I'm curious.

[Dave ESPI]

Here is a series of pics how it helps and releases.

[Dave ESPI]

pull the ratchet release up and the lanyard slides out and under when you flip the toe bail open. Remove clip and then lay the leash under it, rebuckle, then clip the lanyard to the toebail ring.

I dont have a pic of my original design, but this one is faster by far.

Not bad for on the spot ingenuity.

[yyzcanuck]

I can't see clearly from those pics (because of the angle) but it looks like the front bail lever is just barely over centre.

I've never used HEAD boots but I'm curious if others have the same problem or if you're the exception. What length shell are you using?

[Dave ESPI]

Im a SASQUACH..... big foot.

Mondo 30-32. It pushes the bindings to their limits and it really happens to my back foot most when when "Stomping" a landing off rollers or changing edges in mid air for hop carves, or deep toeside/heelside turns where I am using toe leverage to stand back up or to tweek the board.

[Corey]

I can't see clearly from those pics (because of the angle) but it looks like the front bail lever is just barely over centre.

Ditto, this shouldn't really happen. If it happened to me, I'd try spreading the toe clip open (closer to this "|" than this ">").

Dave/YYZCanuck, please check your email. :)

[mackDan]

Now the big question is anyone working on releasable bindings?? ie; if one opens both open. ?

The problem is as you point out, if one releases then the other MUST release. Too complicated. What happens if there is a malfunction, well then you get the helicopter effect that you experienced. Think of that happening in a bad crash, board and one leg going in one direction, and your body in the other. Lots of really (I mean really F**King bad) twisted knees, ligaments, torn everything, OUCH!

The beauty of snowboarding happens in multiple ways, in stead of 4 things, two on your feet and two in your hands, there is only one thing attached to both your feet. Simplification, its awesome.

That one item (the snowboard) firmly attached to both feet, forms a triangle with your legs. Now triangles are the basic form of buildings and structures. And the strongest! So you and your snowboard are stronger together than as separate units. Now that's a lot of generalization, but basically its true. So you want to be firmly clamped to your board and have it stay that way.

Now go figure out why your front bail let loose!!! This is probably a toe and heel piece adjustment problem, you need to move then further apart (longer foot base).

[yyzcanuck]

... or deep toeside/heelside turns where I am using toe leverage to stand back up or to tweek the board.

Again, I don't know Jack about the HEAD boots (and I probably should!) but... is it possible the shell (between heel and toe pads) is deforming up into an arch when be heavily loaded? I've seen this with really soft Raichle & DeeLuxe shells (SB413, Spa and even some LeMans) especially on large sizes.

Maybe try putting the boot in the binding and, while closing the front bail, watch the boot sole and binding plate to see what's going on. I'm curious to find out the root cause of your problem.

[Dave ESPI]

my boot does flex a bit. I can lift hard and the toebail holds, but if I "STOMP" down, or put lateral pressure on it the toebale acts like a can-opener and pops off. It only happens when Im at angles under 50. I turned them back up to 60, and dont have any problems.

I had a Rentiger 163 I was on 2 years ago and it yardsaled me so hard I ejected from both bindings and slid completely disconected down the face of the second drop of exhibition trail of Jiminy just under the main chairlift. I sat up and said to myself " WTF JUST HAPPENED?".... I had a few other people see me go down and they said it was one of the most spectacular things they had ever seen!

great... thanks.... I feel "special" ?

So now its always a concern in the back of my mind.

The first time I ever had this happen I busted a pair of SnowPro RACE bindings like 3 years ago (there is a thread around here somewhere) where the adjustment roll out grub screw for the heel plate sheared off because I ride such a big boot.

[BulletProof]

I'm wondering about the amount of knee / ankle injuries ratio between Snowboarders and skiers.

[philfell]

Check the toe and heel pads of your boots for excessive wear.

And a releasable binding would not have helped in you case. The idea behind a releasable binding is that when a crash happens the binding release.

In your case the release happened first causing the crash. If the system worked like you want were if one bail opens both opens, we would be able to ride the lift.