Tinkler Rocketman

[GeoffV]

Tinks thanks for responding, this thread has become very interesting to follow

[Shred Gruumer]

This post has me hooked!!

Its like watching LOST... Im addicted now..

Whats in store? please keep going.. Can't wait for the next episode!!;)

[philfell]

BTW did I mention that I saw a Tinkler freestyle at Stratton the other day? didn't know the kid, but he was a hell of a rider.

Tink, My earlier question was more to point out the absurdity of you and Bryan attacking Jack for asking legitimate questions and stating reasonable opinions while ignoring a rather blatant callout. Thanks for confirming that one of you can communicate without insinuating some conspiracy.

The kid was probably Mike Plachard, 14 year old ripper. He's a pretty darn good hardbooter as well.

[KingCrimson]

joking or not you obviously know nothing about snowboard construction or it's history...

on topic to that G3 H-lam/V-lam board, very interesting, it would be very nice for pow and freeriding, not sure about alpine but who knows...some similar things have been done with DH Skateboards recently by both small custom builders (airotica) and more commercial ones like Comet, Rayne and even Watson Laminates has been playing with something like that for Earthwing

I've been messing around bagging and clamping different laminations for skate decks. They have all broken so far. :o

What I'm trying after "Holiday" (:rolleyes:) break you might quite like. I'd actually quite like it if you tried to build one too if I figured out a way to make it work. I bet yours wouldn't break since you actually know what you're doing.

You would start out by v-lamming a "ply" and then running it through a table saw to make a rough shape at 45*. Repeat, and end up with two plies, with the lams going 90* to each other. Finish off with another v-lam going longitudinally, You'd probably have to make this pretty small, specifically SL skate small, since the material waste would be of garguntuan proportions. I think the camber response would be extremely fun.

Thanks for confirming that one of you can communicate without insinuating some conspiracy.

I don't care who you are, that's damn funny!

Sorry..back on topic..

[Gecko]

I have a plan for my next skateboard I need to have a bag press to do it...I plan to Vlam a beam of BB ply's for core of speedboard and then sandwich it between glass to allow a much lighter standing deck and still have both lateral and longitudinal stiffness...kinda the opposite of this idea.

My first couple of boards were Hlam construction the only problem I had with it was that edge hold was to related to stiffness and it wasn't very torsionally stable but they were plenty durable

[Mike Kildevaeld]

you know I had writen this whole gay thing getting all pissed and what ever, but than I just relized I am getting pissed at an old bumb living in the Dalles in a garage so why dont you take those awsome snowsticks and sell the hell out of them but do me a favor mount them in the center of your board and push on the tip like you where doing when Mark begged me to help your dumb idea out and no you lied when you injected they where mounted under binding you are a joke the snowsticks are a joke and why did you split your kildy flex plate edge to edge oh ya that was how I told you to avoid my patent so you did I laughed and you cost Mark Fawsett a gold metal in the first ever snowboard winte olympics oww he won the first run by over 3 seconds all he had to do was stand up and he would have won oooooh lets see 2 -4 million dollars why again oh ya you split the kildy flex from edge to edge to avoid my patent you my friend are a joke

[scubaree]

Here few comments about my new Tinkler toy

Length 180cm, waist 23cm, radius 11-13m.

Full rocker

I've been now running this board on slushy afternoon slope, medium soft groom and medium hard wavy groomed slope. And it is working all of them so nicely. Been riding mainly stix full loose or only slightly tightened, just to get used to rockers.

I can get board full flat with stix if i turn all of them fully tight.

Have not yet change to ride it on full hard surface but i'm sure that this will come later this season.

This board really rocks

Cant wait to get it also on real deeper snow too.

Will give updates later this season about when more miles on different surfaces.

Oh-yeah, if someone wonders, yes this board is built for slopes, so this is not pow-board :D

And can not wait to get my hands on my new BlackMamba built by another genious board wizard, more story about that later

Pokkis

I just wanted to say I like your board. I have seen many Tinkler boards and am excited to try them. I just started out so I'm working my way up.

[MUD]

Kildy, I don't think you meant to have me be the recipient of this one...... Should have been tinks I believe.

Since we are on the topic of patents, what is the number of yours???? I would love to read it (I'm kind of a design geek for boards).

[KingCrimson]

Hahah, the "Or my name is Mud" sort of reference is just killing you, MUD!

[svr]

As long as we're talking crazy....

Sorry Jack...Crazy maybe for the East Coast...not for Colorado

Good friend loves his pontoons on the groomed as well...

Having watched and participated in Surfboard design for over 50 years I have

no doubts that Snowboard design has a few options left.

Here is another Idea I had for a Powder board you can call Crazy if you want!

Softbootsailor, here are two japanese boards that are going with a design similar to what you you posted, although not quite as extreme. they are the moss snowstick 58 pt and the vectorglide genius and both have rockered noses.

cheers,

sandy

[Pow]

Maybe go HERE before you jump to conclusions.

I read that and thought hot/hammer too. how are they doing, anyway? I havnt heard much news of them lately.

[BlueB]

Yup, elliminate the sidecut, so the thing can totally suck when you are back on groomed ;) Who needs extreme pintail while you could have a swally? Oh ya, so it can suck even more back on groom. :D

Ok, now serious, you like porpoising in the pow, right? How you would even sink it with so much rocker and pintail? I would think it will want to stay afloat all the time.

[Coloradoking]

joking or not you obviously know nothing about snowboard construction or it's history...

on topic to that G3 H-lam/V-lam board, very interesting, it would be very nice for pow and freeriding, not sure about alpine but who knows...some similar things have been done with DH Skateboards recently by both small custom builders (airotica) and more commercial ones like Comet, Rayne and even Watson Laminates has been playing with something like that for Earthwing

please dont insult my intelligence; i've been working with boards long enough (i know probably nowhere close to you "gods" of boards) to know that this works; i ride a rayne downhill board and i know that this works. i know its hard to detect sarcasm online; however before you know the ACTUAL intent of someone's statements don't start insulting them.

[Gecko]

as someone who grew up on Flatlam snowboards I take it personally when people mock them....sorry

[Coloradoking]

its not a problem, please just try and find out what some one is saying before you openly insult them

[Bordy]

A friend was asking if I make boards for kiting on snow and he sent me some info on what available. I do plan on doing them eventually but read this and one line in particular will make everyone smile and go home happy:)

His timing was perfect as I just got the message!

Rob Whittall - “We have developed a specialized board for the dedicated Snowkiter, designed specifically for the rigors of Snowkiting. This unique design incorporates many new features, which allow the board to ride and feel smoother on the snow. Delivering a feeling that is closer to Kitesurfing, less fatiguing than a traditional snowboard, and allowing the rider to enjoy the Snowkiting experience even more.”

The technology inside the Velocity –

* Posi + Rocker – The Velocity has a positive rocker, and this upward curve across the board helps with initiating turns at slow speeds and prevents edges from grabbing when riding flat.

* Posi + Side Cut – The positive and progressive side cut gives the Velocity its unique shape while providing plenty of contact between the edge and snow. The Posi + Side Cut allows the board to cut through and float over the snow efficiently while tracking very directly.

* True Flex – The Velocity has a constant flex pattern that extends from tip to tail allowing the deck to flex extensively, giving a natural and progressive carve to every turn. The constant flex increases the pop for improved freestyle, and acts like a shock absorber when traversing unfriendly snow conditions.

* Shovel Nose – The tips have been trimmed down in width to reduce the tendency for them to grab when on edge. These tips slice through the snow keeping the board above the snow and tracking directly, resulting in less vibration and a smoother ride, unlike a traditional snowboard that is constantly plowing and crashing thru the snow.

* Phat Ass – The Velocity has a 30cm wide Ass preventing toe and heel drag. It is also one of the reasons the Velocity feels so good in powder, due to the increased surface area the board rises to the surface easily to float on top, even at slower speeds.

* 164 cm Length – With the thinner nose and wider body, the Velocity rides like a smaller snowboard, despite its impressive length. At 164 cm, it offers the perfect size for eating up rough surfaces, cutting cleanly across ice, and staying on top of deep snow.

* Materials – The Velocity is a high quality snowboard built in the USA. Constructed with a sintered base and a solid wood core laminated to our specifications. Triax and Biax laminates mixed with resins designed to reduce weight while retaining maximum strength. High-grade stainless steel inserts and carbon fiber stringers round out the Velocity adding up to one of the most well built boards on the market.

He He He... that was me and Robby..........Best snow kiteboard ever.....Robby is my boss at Ozone....

Rocker rules. this thread is so funny.......

Again rocker rules...... Of course just my opinion....

he he....

http://www.driftsnowkitemag.com/drift/2008/11/07/the-season-at-skyline-has-started/

[Gecko]

its not a problem, please just try and find out what some one is saying before you openly insult them

you make an openly insulting comment like

i give it 2 runs before EPIC FAILURE!!!!

about flatlam snowboards and expect someone who both road and made them not to feel that you are either speaking from ignorance or just being a jerk?

[KingCrimson]

its not a problem, please just try and find out what some one is saying before you openly insult them

He didn't openly insult you at all. It was a pretty damn ignorant comment in my mind. Also, not trying to be a dickhead, (obviously going to come across as one, no two ways about it) but it sounds pretty dickhead-ish to be telling Gecko what he should and should not be doing in regards to respect. He's by far one of the most patient members on here.

Edit: Example above..

Bordy- This is a pretty good thread, and an opinion from you other than "Rocker rules" would be awesome. Do it.

[tufty]

He didn't openly insult you at all. It was a pretty damn ignorant comment in my mind. Also, not trying to be a dickhead, (obviously going to come across as one, no two ways about it) but it sounds pretty dickhead-ish to be telling Gecko what he should and should not be doing in regards to respect. He's by far one of the most patient members on here.

Edit: Example above..

Bordy- This is a pretty good thread, and an opinion from you other than "Rocker rules" would be awesome. Do it.

a: Rocker ROOLZ!!!

b: Rocker SUXX0RZ!!!

c: I don't give a fsck, but it's funny to watch the arguments

pokkis: Beautiful board. Enjoy.

tinks: Any chance of a reduction in price to "lifty" wage levels? (I know, I know, but worth a shot :)

[Bruce Varsava]

He He He... that was me and Robby..........Best snow kiteboard ever.....Robby is my boss at Ozone....

Rocker rules. this thread is so funny.......

Again rocker rules...... Of course just my opinion....

he he....

http://www.driftsnowkitemag.com/drift/2008/11/07/the-season-at-skyline-has-started/

Bordy

The picture of the board looks quite interesting. I have been avoiding snowkiting despite living 1 minute from a big lake as I really didn't like riding the high sidecut twins and just haven't had time to build anything different. Rocker and straight or reverse sidecut, damn, sounds just like the board I use for water! Come to think of it, when you look at what this entire thread is about and compare to what we use in water for kiting, it provides an easily understandable perspective depending on the medium you are riding in/on. I wouldn't consider riding a cambered/sidecut board in the water although I think it has been done for a certain ride. For most applications I wouldn't think the rockered board would be to my liking for snow however certain conditions and ride it would certainly be a good idea. How does that thing turn on harder snow?

If you could just get rid of the highbacks next, I'm all over it!!

My idea was somewhat to build a jumbo snowskate, very much like those little skateboard things that have a mini ski underneath them. Just make it much bigger and have the platform wider than the actual board that touches the snow so you could just use footstraps as the leverage from being above and out would allow it. I was still thinking a board with camber and sidecut but with a 20 m or so on the heel and a 10m on toe, titanal of course:)

A guy up here builds these things called "Snowfer" and it utilizes the same leverage idea but for use with a windsurf sail.

This application might be a good place for the snowstix as the lakes/fields you ride on are real variable so the adjustability would be a benefit. I have built skis to 270 cm for the dudes who windsurf on ice and know they always seem to want something different for different conditions as on any one day it can really vary from ice to pow.

So someone please build me a board with the deck on top so I can use footstraps, straight heel edge with maybe a bit of sidecut on toe side and rocker/ camber adjustability similar to the Pokkis board.

I seriously think it would really be a decent ride:biggthump

I knew something positive would come of all this!

Titanal of course:1luvu:

[Mike Kildevaeld]

not even sure how I did that pissed off maybe can't think.

The Patent Number is (I have no idea) did you see it, that is the best part of patents you have to find it, or get a lawyer to search sorry but that is the truth also 24/7 payed for it so I never really cared nor do I have that number but if I did I would be an idiot to tell anyone all I remember is my name is on it as inventor, Salamon Skis where interested in buying it they took a trip to see 24/7 but no deal was made, again no idea what happened there iether, I was snowboarding getting ready for the Olympics few other things on my mind ay...

[Mike Kildevaeld]

Was this your podium shot of the silver medal at your very own Indycross Nastar Champs, you may want to consider a dentist.

The reply came in five seconds, I was actualy drawing up a new invention that I did not steel from someone else, so you actualy have to do alot of work to figure out.

[Shred Gruumer]

Boy.. The SES should be one heck of a warm and fuzzy family reunion!!

Hope it doesn't end up as the ECES Death Cage Match!!

Don't mess with the Trailer!!

[Bordy]

Bordy

The picture of the board looks quite interesting. I have been avoiding snowkiting despite living 1 minute from a big lake as I really didn't like riding the high sidecut twins and just haven't had time to build anything different. Rocker and straight or reverse sidecut, damn, sounds just like the board I use for water! Come to think of it, when you look at what this entire thread is about and compare to what we use in water for kiting, it provides an easily understandable perspective depending on the medium you are riding in/on. I wouldn't consider riding a cambered/sidecut board in the water although I think it has been done for a certain ride. For most applications I wouldn't think the rockered board would be to my liking for snow however certain conditions and ride it would certainly be a good idea. How does that thing turn on harder snow?

If you could just get rid of the highbacks next, I'm all over it!!

My idea was somewhat to build a jumbo snowskate, very much like those little skateboard things that have a mini ski underneath them. Just make it much bigger and have the platform wider than the actual board that touches the snow so you could just use footstraps as the leverage from being above and out would allow it. I was still thinking a board with camber and sidecut but with a 20 m or so on the heel and a 10m on toe, titanal of course:)

A guy up here builds these things called "Snowfer" and it utilizes the same leverage idea but for use with a windsurf sail.

This application might be a good place for the snowstix as the lakes/fields you ride on are real variable so the adjustability would be a benefit. I have built skis to 270 cm for the dudes who windsurf on ice and know they always seem to want something different for different conditions as on any one day it can really vary from ice to pow.

So someone please build me a board with the deck on top so I can use footstraps, straight heel edge with maybe a bit of sidecut on toe side and rocker/ camber adjustability similar to the Pokkis board.

I seriously think it would really be a decent ride:biggthump

I knew something positive would come of all this!

Titanal of course:1luvu:

The twisted board is steller on almost all snow conditions, how ever its weakest surface is hard lake frozen firm ice. It is however the revease side cut that holds back its edge grip not the rocker. Just last weekend I was doing tow in stuff on it behind a snowmobile on packed roads, and I have ridden it at the resort for kicks.

I wish for sure it was made out of titanal, I wish my water board was titanal also!!!! Ya know a few years back i build a light wind water board with camber and sidecut (about 20m) and it ripped, I handed it off to a fellow kiter and they are stiill loving it in the lighter winds.

I really like the snow skate two piece idea, for the frozen lakes I think that is the call, when you have to bite into the ice, making more power via leverage. I think the board really needs two sections of radius however, with the center of each arc under the heel of the foot since we are really just riding the back foot and half of the board while making resistance aganst the kite. The toe side can still be one arc and a tighter radius would be a huge advantage. When I rode for best their board had a 20M ish radius I rode it for a year and always wished it had a smaller toe side, and the next year I got a banana hamock from Travis, then I left Best and brought the hamock idea and concept with me to my new sponsor.( Part of the reason I left Best is they wanted to just copy the hamock and put there name on it, while Twisted used the idea as a base and build a better board for kiting.....from it).

Living here in Ut the conditions are always freash, And I really only use ice on lakes as a "freeway" to get around from spot to spot, the current board works fine for traveling across ice but if it where to be ice spacific it would need to be different. I have a bunch of concept ideas for firmer snow but I only ride ice while traveling, at events where there is no other option I have asked lots of ice kiters and it seems to me they are more concerened about flex then shape, it seems having a nice soft board that tracks well with a large radius maybe even with a heel centered sidecut that would provide more pounds or pressure per inch and could be the answer. With snowkiting being so new there are hundreds of ways to improve the board tech since it is still based on gravity sliding sports, there are currently only about three boards made to snowkite with and only the twisted is a progression item, with tuned flex and width adjustments, but it is pretty crappy inside as cost was the biggest issue and at $450us I think we did a good job trying to put a working prodect out to the kiting comunnity that trumps all others for 90% of the conditions. Other snowkite boards are just snowboard copys with some kiters name and flex pattern to make them different...the response to the twisted board has been very positive!

As always Bruce I am happy to share any ideas I have, you know how I am... I still have about a thousand stuffed in my head.....

BB

Oh yea and for the rest of the posters Why not rocker? Think of all the energy you as a rider save by not having to provide the power to de-camper a board that is bent in the wrong direction you want it to bend in, also if you need to use energy to bend the board that means it is trying to bend back against the turn, That doesn't mean there is less pressure being distrubited to the tip and tail, the board is already a big lever there has to be energy going to the tip and tail, the tip diggs the trench and the goal is to get the tail to follow, you don't need camber to make that happen, Camber just adds more energy to bounce around and make the board feel crappy.

And Jack, you know i love what ya do for BOL but... you really need to stop placing "racers' and "freecarvers" in seprate catagorys, all you are doing is creating unreal comparisions about the same sport. Racers are Freecarvers who have perfected the art of board riding. Come to terms with that and the sport should grow.... thats part of the reason this forum hinders the sport also.....but for some reason some posters have enough clout to keep the board beleiving "their Ideas about alpine riding" Not the "current state of alpine riding". Most of the reason I stopped posting here was becuase I had to field insults and ideas from airchair riders who base their Ideas on info read or imagined, not experanced.

None of the GS or PGS or SL race boards I have ever ridden have been out proformed or out free ridden by a "freecarve" stick and every freecarve board I have ever ridden needed improvment. Lots of improvment.......

Well in till I had enough and shaped some real free ride shapes based on the current level of the sport and board building, and not what I thought was good about my factory prime from 95... hence my new shape the Bsquared from Prior... Its a alpine snowboard.. not a race board or a freeride board, its all the tech of a race board with manners for everyone to enjoy!!!! Oh yea and it of course goes backwards...

Rocker, magnatraction, tip camber profile, Metal, usable tails, riser plates and such. these are all "new ideas" in alpine riding get on board or stay on your old board.... I don't care, your the rider its your time on the hill spend it how you want!!1:biggthump

[Steve Prokopiw]

with your opinion on the rockered board concept.My intuition tells me that there is merit to the possible energy saving benefit;afterall,wouldn't centripedal force be partly responsible for edge pressure and hold anyway? And the characteristics of the board such as snap and torsional and longitudinal flexibility should be able to be determined by how it is constructed and with what materials etc.Just like any other custom.

BTW, the last paragraph of your post sums it all up for me.