Do these comments piss you off too?

[Gtanner]

I once overheard a comment being made to a patroller about how I was leaving too many trenches in the snow and that I should be forced to go take lessons to learn how to 'properly' snowboard...

Patroller's answer; "Well Sir, he is a great snowboarder, maybe you are the one that needs lessons..." I had to buy him a beer!!!

-Gord

[timinor]

Speedzilla said it best...

None of those comments bother me at all.

I don't care what most skiers think.

I smile and laugh at them. My complete confidence that I'm having more fun than they are disarms them.

[Ginsu]

I started in 1992. I did one day of Ski lessons at Stowe, VT and hated it. The ext day I went to Killington, VT and took a group lesson on a board and then a 2+ hour private lesson with an instructor. I was doing 10 times as well on the board and having fun. Which is the important part. Anyway about 2 years latter I was able to convert my wife a life long skier to snowboarding after 1 try and then a friend also a life long skier after 1 try.

So all we need to do is to get the "uneducated" and "unknowing" skiers to try what that criticzise so much. Then they too may join us is in removing all the snow from the slopes!

[carve4life]

I cant believe some people still think snowboarding is a fad!!! I mean come on and just embrass it for heck sake.

to be honest the comment i hate to hear, isn;t from a skier, most of the time you can just laugh those off after one look at their one piece ski suit. the one i hate is, "whooo, bro how do hit jibs with that board?" I usally say "oh not with this board, with my bulldozer."

but honestly props to some of those free style guys, they got loads of talent.

[Guest]

I get stuck on the gondola with many a stuck-up aspenite. We get into the same discussion and I mention I got hit by 3 skiers last year. They act shocked by this info.

Yesterday I got hit by skier number one this year, and fortunately I'm none the worse for wear. He was coming down off the Face of Bell into Spar Gulch, which is a natural half-pipe at Aspen and one of the sickest places to carve I've ever been on. Idiot wasn't looking downhill and smacked into me in the middle of a heelside. He gets all pissed that I was carving up and down the sides of the run, but a patroller buddy of mine saw the whole thing and the guy got in some serious trouble. I'll have to ask him tomorrow what happened to the guy.

[AndyYT316]

LOL. :lol: I JUST FIGURED OUT WHAT MY COSTUME OUTFIT IS GONNA BE!! I am going to be an alien on my board someday this season. Does anybody know if you can choke yourself laying trenches with a cape? Or if you have antennae's on your helmet if there is any "interference"? Rocky Horror Picture Show comes to mind.

Maybe you could get some tin foil for your helmet, and make something like the hats they wore in the movie signs so the aliens (or skiiers) can't read your thoughts. Or just use the foil to be a space helmet.

[Guest Salomon Orangge]

This is why I love Stratton, VT so much. That mtn. caters to snowboarders on every angle.

But I've heard my share of idiocy in the lift lines or gondolas. Near fist fights when some skiier thinks that the backside of my board is the perfect place to keep planting his poles or knock the snow off his skiis.

Most of the comments I hear however are from older people. I mean 40-50+ in age. I think this is because they've been skiers for so long, and their general knowledge of the sport is probably derived from punk skaters or the skidders they see going down the hill. Funny part is, most of the time I snowboard with my father, who IS very skilled. I think this will be his 13th or 14th season. He'll be 59 in March, and I have to say he puts to shame a good portion of the other snowboarders on the hills in terms of fluidity of movement. He's careful in his snowboarding, but at 59, who wouldnt be. I'm just impressed that he still gets out there, straps on his board, and keeps up with me with no issues.

I personally dont like it when people call me a "shredder". I just dont like the term. It sounds assinine.

[Guest jschal01]

As the years go by the negative comments 1-4 seem to get a lot less frequent. Particularly since snowboarding is not only established, but no longer really a growth sport at all. They now seem to come, at least where I am, primarily from affluent professionals in their 50s-60s who ski on average 8-10 days a year, consider themselves expert skiers as part of their social identity, and curiously tend also not be completely honest about their golf handicap. I think all three facts -- continuing to put snowboarding down, the "expert," even "aggressive," skier self-identity, and creative golf accounting all stem from a desire to preserve social status. These are often actually very nice and very liberal people who are not at all aware of the irony in their view of snowboarding.

If someone with the exact same background gets in 20 days or more on skis, I find that the simple fact of greater exposure to the lift-served environment tends to whither away negative views of snowboarders as a class. And, curiously, the 20 days or more club seems to not feel the need to call themselves an "expert" skier.

On the hill, in my experience the most dangerous groups in terms of hitting others are either inexperienced teenage boys, or reasonably good but not great skiers in their 40s or 50s who generally are skiing fast and reasonably well, but can't process the line that either a carving snowboarder or carving skier will take. They also have a bad habit of not stopping to apologize for bumps or of assuming collisions are their fault. Before ragging on them too much, some people on this site have posted about shoving softbooters down at the entrance to trails, etc., without recognizing that the person they were shoving by their own description had the right of way and also likely was a pretty nice person who didn't need to be shoved or snowed or whatever.

As for MRG, snowboarders initially brought that closure on themselves. And, I think it would be a shame for MRG to lose any of its natural-snow niche. In the Catskills, we're already losing Plattekille to the snowmaking and grooming gods of commerce. If more-mature snowboarders keep hitting some of the backcountry in those parts and earning respect for their skills and behavior, and also make clear that they only want to ride the same bumps, ice, and scratch as the skiers @MRG, I think access will open and then the snowboarder days there will be...underwhleming. Most people don't like to ride bumps. :)

[Guest dragonsword5]

:rolleyes:

LOL. :lol: I JUST FIGURED OUT WHAT MY COSTUME OUTFIT IS GONNA BE!! I am going to be an alien on my board someday this season. Does anybody know if you can choke yourself laying trenches with a cape? Or if you have antennae's on your helmet if there is any "interference"? Rocky Horror Picture Show comes to mind.

My friend and I dressed up in full body cow suits on a school ski trip We got in trouble though because we couldn't get our ski lift tickets out without taking the suit off :rolleyes: This year though we're going to peirce one of the cow "nipples" and put the pass through the hole

Anyway as to the comments I'm around skiiers mostly in my school and I've heard some of those comments here and there, but I can agree with a skiier on the fact of snowboarders hurting but skiiers hurt just as much. I've had a beginner snowboarder who didn't know how to stop ram me with his board at the base of my back when I was sitting down. That wasn't fun, but I've also had skiiers who couldn't stop ram into me (my friend actually did this)

But I have noticed that you get more respect as an Alpine Carver then a Freestyle snowboarder. I've had skiiers come up to me and ask some questions and when I was actually doing some good carves then wiped out XD I had a skiier just jokingly talk to me how I was "doing good there for awhile" You also get a lot of points and questions as an carver which also adds to the respect I guess.

I love this sport

Edit: I edited part of this post so I wouldn't offend anybody else. Sorry to tufty and Neil.

[EPIK CARVE]

I just say that a couple years back the most well known snowboarder(Jake Burton) in the world lost his whole season(200+ days) beacause a skier broke his leg. Don't take any of their comments as ridicule, use them to educate them and maybe even ride with them. Let's be the better people and show them that we have changed even though most of them have not!!!!

[philfell]

Remember these comments are coming from a snowboarder. I spend probably one out of every two days on snow (that's a year round average, not just the winter).

Most of the collisions I've seen at resorts are the fault of a snowboarder. This is by no means a scientific, it is only what I've wittnessed.

Snowboarder do ruin the pow more than skiers, (scrape the snow off). An inexperienced snowboarder can go to expert ungroomed runs and simply sideslip down. A skier with the same amount of days under their belt would probably be walking down that same ungroomed run. This happens all to often, on pow days I'll go up to some of the line I like to do and there will be multiple sideslip marks from snowboarder top to bottom with no turns inbetween.

So no these comments don't piss me off, because there are some truth to some of them.

[Guest dragon fly jones]

Go Phil.

[tufty]

The reason why people usually point to their kids first when talking about snowboard/skiier collisions, I believe, is because their kids are beginner skiiers and take up the ENTIRE TRAIL! with the "pizza cut" thing. I can't stand that. I know I've ran over a few of those dear little skiiers a few times when they so innocently cut me off

How can I put this? Hmmm. Gently, maybe. If you come from uphill and run over my kid, even if he is a beginner, and even if he is taking up the whole trail, it's 100% your fault. As will be the fact that you will have to deal with me. The ski patrol might get called, and if you're lucky it will only be to remove your liftpass and escort you off the mountain. Show the slightest sign of carrying on without stopping, and they will be hauling you off to have a little chat with the police[1]. And if you catch me on a bad day, they will be removing pieces of your equipment from unnatural orifices.

Run into me, it's less of an issue. We're adults, and we can discuss it. But you run over my kids and get lippy about it, there _will_ be consequences.

Your attitude is exactly _why_ people moan about inconsiderate boarders (and skiers, don't even get me started on completely out of control snowbladers). And that's as gentle as I can be on this particular subject.

Simon

[1] Carrying on without stopping and offering help after a collision is (quite rightly) a criminal offence here, and taken extremely seriously. It can carry a penalty of up to 18 months in prison.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Snowboarders scrape the hill more than skiers, there's no denying it. As Phil points out, they can and do scrape their way down anything, and then brag about being able to "ride a black diamond" afterwards. And seeing as most kids choose to ride these days, I'm betting most of the rude behaviour is coming from riders - not due to equipment, just due to general youth/ignorance/asshattery.

And yeah, I'm with Tufty - if you hit someone when he's the downhill skier, it's your fault except in a few very limited circumstances. And if you hit my kid, we've got a big problem.

[wavechaser]

Well allllright!! This is such a great thread...let's concentrate on the negative...not like we ever have any fun out there right?

As for MRG, snowboarders initially brought that closure on themselves. And, I think it would be a shame for MRG to lose any of its natural-snow niche. In the Catskills, we're already losing Plattekille to the snowmaking and grooming gods of commerce. If more-mature snowboarders keep hitting some of the backcountry in those parts and earning respect for their skills and behavior, and also make clear that they only want to ride the same bumps, ice, and scratch as the skiers @MRG, I think access will open and then the snowboarder days there will be...underwhleming. Most people don't like to ride bumps. :)

Who said anything about wanting to ride the TRAILS at MRG??? ;)

[alpinegirl]

there is no snow to actually scrape off here in western NY, although we do boast some of the most highly polished ice

[Guest dragonsword5]

I'm sorry for offending you and anyone else. I edited my post to not have that comment.

[Linus]

there is no snow to actually scrape off here in western NY, although we do boast some of the most highly polished ice

That's same for us :D

[Guest jager]

I find I see a lot more out of control skiers than snowboarders. But, looking at it as a skier, I guess I could see how they might think we were out of control. I myself ride at I was taught to ride which back then was keeping the upper body static pretty much, hips and legs doing all the work. But even laid out I'm not flailing. Good grief, I hope not! That would be terribly embarassing. LOL! But the whole riding style of a lot of people on soft boots is more relaxed so their arms might swing and all, I guess. I could see someone thinking that might mean out of control. When you see an out of control skier, don't they usually have every limb moving in a different direction? LOL! Sorry, that was mean!

I notice the majority of colliisions or near collisions I see involve someone flying over a knoll without checking their speed at all and plowing into someone skiing or riding below the knoll. I have only purposely tried to hit two people and both times, one of my kids were about to be hit. The first time, with my older daughter, I knocked the guy out of his skiis before he hit her. The second time, I outran the kid, laid it out a little, said a prayer, and scooped my youngest up and just laid down on my back with her on top of me. We spun and I twisted my back but she was fine. She's a tiny kid. Had this guy hit her, he could have killed her. It really pissed me off because he kept going. My husband wanted to go after him but he stayed with us so I could hobble to the lodge. I didn't ride for a month. Pickle sniffer!

[Allee]

I'm impressed with you guys who find time to not only look out for yourselves, but for your kids as well. I have a hard enough time just trying to keep myself out of trouble!

i suppose it just comes down to common sense - unfortunately it ain't so common these days. Knolls and drops, as Jager points out, are the worst - I never speed off the top of a dead-vision roller because I have no idea what's under there. Better to brake and check than take out someone's kid or the idiot jibber that's sitting right underneath (why don't they stop on the top, where you can see them?? aaaaarrrrrgggghhh!)

My thoughts are ANY green trail where the are beginners, especially if it's not too wide, just isn't worth the risk. Beginners have no control over their gear. I had a stand up with a guy when I was learning, he was doing mach one through a green area and I wobbled and fell in front of him, he collected me with his skis and then proceeded to throw a mental about how I should stay the hell out of his way. Um, excuse me??? Uphill skier, learners area, high speed ... a$$hole.

Carving is especially bad, we've all had this discussion before, but people just don't expect that you're a) coming across the hill b) as fast as you are and c) that you really can't see them. Generally, I'll keep the carving for where there's a ton of room and few people - I'm lucky that I have the hills to do that. It pays to keep in mind that most of the time, YOU'RE the oddball.

Slopes are like roads ... speed where you can and where it's safe, and assume everyone else is out to get you. Makes for a safe day at the hill.

[Neil Gendzwill]

I'm sorry for offending you and anyone else. I edited my post to not have that comment.

Deleting the comment doesn't help any, I just hope you consider changing your attitude about these things. Several times a year we have these discussions and almost always someone posts something like you did. "That beginner was turning unpredictably when I hit him, it's his fault". "Who could have known that guy would just be standing there under the drop-off, it's his fault." "Beginners shouldn't be on the expert trails, it's their fault". If he's downhill from you, it's your fault no matter that he was turning unpredictably, in over his head, whatever. If you can't avoid him, you're in violation of the code.

[JJFluff]

I was put into the hospital by a skier about 8 years ago. She was half my size but hit me from behind, caught my front edge. I cracked my jaw in half between my two front teeth, and bit a hole through my upper lip. I was downhill from her, the only way she could have caught up to me is if i was traversing across the hill at the time. I don't remember what happened, but it was probably both of our faults. I was in control, but she was inexperienced and it's impossible to know which way a boarder will go next. Now I'm so paranoid I never ride anywhere near another skier,boarder on a hill, and I always try to be uphill from anyone, because I know I can react quick enough to stay out of trouble. Other than that, I get nothing but possitive comments from people. I've noticed most advanced skiers i talk to always say if they would snowboard, they would love to try an alpine board. Others say its great to watch me ride, and just alot of possitive interest in the board and what you can do on them. It's funny how many freestylers think it would be so boring to just go straight down the hill everytime. If they only new what it felt like to actually make a turn on a board, compared to pivoting on their front foot. The worst thing here in wisconsin is that the snowboarders in the ski school where I ride, should be the students and not the instructors.

[carve4life]

i think neil has a very good point. As a rule of thumb i try to wait at the top of the hill for a break if possible. that way I know I'm clear down hill and all I have to worry about is the up hill guy, who SHOULD be look for you, but of course i always try to make sure there isn't some body bombing down hill while i'm riding. (you would think the guy behind you would see your making traversing turns and plan accordingly but....) If you can clear the hill in this fashion, you get a semi worry free ride, of course this doesn't always work out near the lodge or on very busy days. Didn't somebody make a smock that said "this rider makes wide turns"?

[skipuppy]

Yes beginner skiers use up the entire run... thats what they teach you to do. As an experienced person you expect that and plan accordingly- especially if its on a beginner run. Besides, if you can tell they are a beginner anyway you should give yourself even more responsibility because even if they wanted to be responsible for their actions they might not even be physically capable of skiing at the safe level. Everyone learns some time.

As an alpine boarder you have to always take the responsibility on yourself that you aren't that predictable merely based on the fact that most people aren't familiar with how we ride: we cut across the entire run and do it beautifully. As a skier one of the first lessons I was taught is that you always look up before going down. If you are worried, you wait for people to pass you and then follow them instead of jumping in the middle. Kinda like merging on a freeway with an ultra-wide load. You wait for people to pass you instead of causing utter mayhem. Imagine mergine in front of a kid who just got his learner's permit??

[Mark Brown]

#2 - Yep, all the time... But then again, every collision I've had is been with a uphill skier hitting me on a blind heelside turn.

#3 - Pisses me off too... ssssssccccccrrrrrrraaaaapppppppeeeeee - but at least I can hear them comming...