hardbooter picture in Transworld

[Cindy Kleh]

I know you guys wouldn't be cuahgt dead reading a Transworld but there was a picture on the last page that had a hardbooter, Jeff Greenwood, in the pipe.

The caption: "We catch alot of **** here at TWS in regard to content. Some people say that there isn't enough racing coverage. But let's face facts, staring at pictures of guys making turns on coduroy isn't all that exciting. Every photo looks like their sniffing their pits. Well, tell you what, if every spandex-clad dude shredded like Jeff Greenwood, we'd be all over 'em like Anna Nicole on a cheeseburger."

Is that a challenge?

[Phil]

I think that most of the spandex-clad can shred everywhere. If they are good enough to race seriously, then they usually are good enough to take that riding wherever they want.

[NMU Alpine Boarder]

Kinda sounds like Tanner Hall.... I'll bet my whole quiver that Racers take to the park faster than Park people take to the race course....

[Neil Gendzwill]

To do well in the park, you need to be good in the air, have a good sense of where your body is, not get disoriented spinning, all that kind of stuff. I don't think those sorts of skills are all that required in racing and to quite an extent those are natural talents. So if you get a racer who's never so much as thrown a back flip off a diving board, the park is maybe not going to be his forte.

In other news, TWS can blow me.

[Phil]

I would bet that serious park competitors can cross over as well. Your average park and pipe rat - probably not. Tanner Hall has talked too much smack, but he could probably take a course faster than most. He is still a pro, and he still has amazing control and understanding of how skis work. I believe that ability level has everything to do with diversity. If you can truly stomp in the park and pipe, you can probably stomp the gates as well. If you can truly stomp the gates, you can probably stomp P & P. Now whether or not people have a desire to cross over is another story. I have heard a lot of hardbooters say they have no interest in P & P, but I'll bet that they could ride it well if they tried. The problem with a lot of kids riding P&P is that they don't see the reward in learning how to make good turns. Yesterday, as our lift passed a double black, I asked one of my advanced freestyle students if he wanted to go over there. He declined saying that he does not really enjoy the steeps. I asked him if that was because he would have to skid and sideslip too much. He affirmed my suspicion. I explained that if he ever learned to ride the doubles better, his P&P riding would be dramatically better. It is amazing how overlooked cross training can be.

[Phil]

Neil,

What I was saying was that they would do well in there, not that they would be throwing huge spins. I believe that an accomplished racer can go big in the park - albeit maybe a straight air. The same goes with the pipe. 50/50's on rails should also be easy for experienced racers.

[D-Sub]

yeah Id like to see the pic, too.

[Guest 2010]

Well, wait until you see the new Snowboard Life...all of you will be stoked!!!!

In Trenches We Trust

[Cindy Kleh]

I'll be in Summit this weekend and will drop the Transworld mag off to Fin. (I only read it because it's free.) Isn't Kurt Hoy, their editor-in-chief, an ex-racer/hardbooter?

just wondering

[philfell]

Kurt Hoy actually can put a good trench in the hill!

As far as racers crossing over. Most of the racers I know can rip on soft set-ups. Personally I feel when I do get on a good soft boot set-up I feel like it's cheating, because it's so easy.

On the other hand I've been to gymnasics training with some of the U.S. Snowboard Team racers and it was pathtic to watch us try some of the easiest manuvers on the tramp and into the foam pit (Other than Graham, but I don't think he is really human anyway).

Also Greenwood had a pic in Snowboarder a few years back that was very similar. He was doing a HUGE method on a quaterpipe hit. His board was above his head and he was above the people on the chairlift in the background.

[350]

I agree with D-Sub that a guy in huge pants fallin' off his a*# is just as boring or more boring than seeing a picture of a guy laying down a nice carve.

[bobdea]

who the target audience is for TWS

highschool kids basically, they could care less about anything other than the next huck.

alpine is growing and in a few years we will see more alipine in the mainstream

I have had a bunch of jiblets ask me if I am on a "alpine board" this year

in the past I would get asked if its a "mono board"

and I actually see others riding plates everytime I go riding this year

so, I see with my own eyes growth.

tele is on the back end of a boom right now, I see tele gear in shops all over the place now, this was not the case in 1998.

What I would like to see are some low cost freecarve boards that still rip, new $300 boards and decent boot that retails for $175 would give alpine a huge boost in my opinion.

in five years I bet that hardbooters are going to be a lot more common in TWS

[Jack M]

Originally posted by bobdea

What I would like to see are some low cost freecarve boards that still rip

Donek Pilot.

[nekdut]

Sean hasn't release any specs pricing or even announced the Pilot series yet though, has he? The only place I've seen them was at SES.

Do you have any detailed info on the Pilot series? All I know is that there's a 147, 152, 167, 172(3?) so far. The core isnt book matched and the base material isnt as fast as on the FC/AX/etc. Production time is supposedly 1/3rd of the time compared to the rest of the alpine line.

[Baka Dasai]

The Ghandi quote isn't really appropriate here, but what the hell:

<i>First they ignore you

Then they laugh at you

Then they fight you

Then you win</i>

Seems like Transworld just moved from step 1 to step 2.

[RDY_2_Carve]

I like the fact that we are the minority. Let them ostracize us. Anybody that can't appreciate what we do is a complete idiot.

I think tele is the most beautiful thing on snow, but I wouldn't dare call them pansy a$$ mogul makers. This guy just has zero tact.

[FTA2R]

i have a free subscription and I was quite surprised to see this and was gonna post but i don't have a scanner. F the author, he probably can't even ollie. I really think someone should write TWS a well written, thought out letter. I just have a feeling a bunch of guys there have never even ridden an alpine boards. Tools.

---

Barry

[SWriverstone]

Oh man, don't even get me going on this... :)

I've already been through this in one sport---whitewater kayaking---where it's exactly the same...the rise of the "X-Teen Cult," where being an in-your-face, irreverent badass with an attitude and trashy clothes is somehow considered a superior form of life. I was ticked off when paddling magazines cowtowed wholesale to the X Market and started featuring cover shots of only the latest gene-deficient moron paddling over a waterfall.

It's exactly the same crap in TransWorld and other snowboard rags, where every page is the same old shot of "Buttcrack Kid" catching big air and ads with photos of people with eyes sewn shut, etc.

Why am I so vitriolic about this? It's shallow for one---these kids don't need all the posturing, because anyone can see what they do is remarkable in itself. But more importantly, it colors how the greater population perceives the sport. (e.g. people saying "Aren't you a little old to be snowboarding?" or when I tell 'em I'm a kayaker, "Man, you're crazy to be jumping those waterfalls!"

(primal scream coming)

GGRRRAAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!

Aah...there. I feel better!

:D

What society needs (in my opinion) are more role models like this: Athletes who are reserved, polite, conservative, not self-centered, seek to avoid publicity, and are simultaneously the best in the world at what they do.

Now I'd want those people on my t-shirt! :)

Scott

(Sorry---this was a bit off-topic...but it was "close to topic." <smile>)

[philw]

TWS is a kind of boy-band-style magazine for pubescent males. It's all vaguely strange to those of us who are acually able to hold conversations with members of the opposite sex. It's a "fanzine".

The magazine is pushing a different sport, closer to skate than boarding. It would be bad for them if truth were out, and the macho teens were found to be sideslipping the beginner terrain whilst old guys rip the steeps.

[Cindy Kleh]

Somebody (me) did write TWS about the picture but I doubt it'll get printed since I didn't I didn't include a picture of someone bleeding or tell Marc Frank he so totally rules with his cleavage nurses hanging all over him:

The most recent issue of TWS had a photo in Last Track of a hardbooter killing it in the pipe. Because alpine riding has been pretty much ignored by the media, most of your readers probably did not understand the picture or caption.

I realize that freestyle is king right now, but most snowboarders, even teenagers, are curious about different kinds of equipment and their advantages and disadvantages in different terrain. PGS is an Olympic discipline, and Boardercross will also be one in the next Olympics. Racing is not going away.

Besides, alpine is much broader than just racing freaks. Granted, there’s a small percentage of riders who call themselves hardbooters, but that percentage would grow if there was more information available.

[Jack M]

Originally posted by SWriverstone

Athletes who are reserved, polite, conservative, not self-centered, seek to avoid publicity, and are simultaneously the best in the world at what they do.

Tom Brady.

As for the Donek Pilot, I just caught a glimpse of it at the SES, and took a few runs with Sean while he was riding it. He said he was surprised at how well it rode. The few stats I gleaned was a 20cm waist and a price tag starting with 3. Cool.

[Derf]

Originally posted by nekdut

Sean hasn't release any specs pricing or even announced the Pilot series yet though, has he? The only place I've seen them was at SES.

Do you have any detailed info on the Pilot series? All I know is that there's a 147, 152, 167, 172(3?) so far. The core isnt book matched and the base material isnt as fast as on the FC/AX/etc. Production time is supposedly 1/3rd of the time compared to the rest of the alpine line.

For those of us who were not at the SES and are in the market for an inexpensive all mountain board, could you enlighten us on that Donek Pilot? What is the shape, similar to an Axis, Freecarve or Incline? What does "The core isnt book matched" mean? I could live with a slower base material on an all mountain board since I already have a decent freecarve deck.

I always wondered why the Incline is 360$ and the Axis 550$ when they have a similar construction and similar stiffness index. Is it the core that is much different?

[patmoore]

I too get a free subscription of TWS but they've gone directly from the mailbox to the trash for the past couple of years. The last time I perused an issue I decided to see how many random pages I could view before I saw a board actually making contact with snow. Sadly, every single shot was either in the air or on a rail of some type.

On a more positive note, interest is growing among older winter sports enthusiasts. I competed in a USASA GS and slalom competition at Sunapee a month ago and there were five (count 'em, five!) competitors over the age of 50.

I just competed in Connecticut's Sr. Winter Games on Tuesday (on skis - see below) and I convinced them to add a snowboard GS race next year!!

[Cindy Kleh]

See you at Nationals this april?

[Guest Redman]

I've been riding quite a while. I've ridden through a bunch of trends such as split tail boards, soft bindings with 3 straps and cant plates, baseless bidings, symmetrical carve boards, asym carve boards, back to asym. carve boards, etc.

When I first started there seemed to be (in my locale anyway) 2 types of riders. Skateboarders who couldn't skate in the winter and got boards, went to golf courses and built jumps. The second would be the same except we skiied so we crossed over. Riding a board meant freedom from clunky heavy ski boots. Once we got certified by the ski patrol to ride the lift we built jumps at the ski area, had them torn down by patrollers, rebuilt them etc. Snowboarders were despised by a large percentage of skiers. Feeling the hate, I believe as the culture developed, it naturally gravitated towards freestyle type riding as it was anti-skiing ie: carving and discipline.

About the time many of us were learning to carve on our sft setups, along came a mag called Transworld Snowboarding. WOW, snowboarding must be getting big. At the time, there was coverage of both soft and hard booters. Being an American mag, the coverage was more freestyle oriented because that is what the vast majority of riders were doing.

Things went along like this until eventually there was zero coverage of racing and hardbooting in general. This was reflected on the hill. Back in the early to mid 90's I could count the number of hard booters I saw on the hill in one hand and that was for the entire season. Why would the mags cover something that was such a small percentage of the riding populace?

About this time I got reaaly bummed on the ghetto image of snowboarding and cut my riding drastically. Looking back at those years of practically no riding, I am full of regret. I let the larger image of snowboarding get to me and forgot that I was not part of that image although I was viewed in that sense just because I rode.

Fast forward to this year. I started teaching again and the passion for the sport was renewed. Being older and a bit wiser I have enough sense to no longer give a **** what the overall image is and will do things that I like without regard to the latest trends. If I want to do a hands fown nose ride pretending I'm on my old split tail cruizer 165, I do it. If I want to bust a switch 540 over a 40 foot gap, I do it (well not actually, I crash and get a sled ride because I seem to have lost my balls when it comes to air).

I guess what I'm getting at is this: Does it really matter what's in the popular mags if you're doing what you love and are passionate about? If it really affects you that TWS only covers freestyle, print your own damn mag.

Red