SW cocktail

[lowrider]

Anyone willing to share their input on the idea of using SW on front foot only ? Persons experienced in riding plates are aware of the huge suspension effect of the front sliding hardware and the reduction in fatigue as a result (not so much from the rear). Was wondering if this would translate to SW. Has anyone mixed SW with regular TD3. Does anyone ride SW with Boiler Plate.

Edited November 2, 2013 by lowrider
typo

[Ladia]

Has anyone mixed SW with regular TD3.

TD3 front SW back.

[lowrider]

How did you determine which would be front.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

How did you determine which would be front.

More weight on front foot, more forgiveness for the rear foot. I would do the same as Ladia . I want the power and precision on the front leg.

[SEJ]

I wonder if you just ran SW SI heel and non-SW front bail, would it have the flex of a normal binding instead of the "boot screwed to the board' feeling you get from SIs.

Hey, Fin, got a board buster for ya.

Edited November 5, 2013 by SEJ
typo

[Ladia]

I wonder if you just ran SW SI heel and non-SW front bail, would it have the flex of a normal binding instead of the "boot screwed to the board' feeling you get from SIs.

Hey, Fin, got a board buster for ya.

I was thinking about the same. I found new steel SI receiver making extremely stiff connection. That was the reason I gave up on SI all together. SW SI most likely will help to solve this problem, but I will not be able to verify it because I predominantly ridding AT boots and I will not carry two pairs to Aspen.

This also partially answers Lowrider’s question, the rest is like Bryan sad. I did not like “wobbly “feeling on front foot. It was OK ridding down to hill, but on long traverses I hated it.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Gentlemen. I think part of the reason the SW SI took so long is the testing and safety considerations Bomber Industries went through to design and bring the product to us. I would caution anyone considering mixing and matching components , perhaps allow some time to pass to see what idiosyncrasies develope , if any.

I know that when I built my proto type TD3 SW SI a couple years back , I was concerned with the parts working together well , heights matched up, pivot points were in alignment etc.

[fin]

Lowrider,

Good question: I actually rode with one SW SI for half a season while testing. However, I rode it in back and a standard SI in front. I do agree with some of the concepts here that your front foot is the pillar you stand on and the rear moves around. Or the front foot is the power and the rear is the control. Now this is WAY over simplifying but I do believe this to be the case. So having a more movable front versus rear would be opposite of this description.

There is a small difference in height as well for all the series of TD3 bindings. Not a lot though and I have mixed and matched and could not really feel the difference.

[Corey]

I wonder if you just ran SW SI heel and non-SW front bail, would it have the flex of a normal binding instead of the "boot screwed to the board' feeling you get from SIs.

Hey, Fin, got a board buster for ya.

That approach would put all the lateral loads into the toe of the boot, with the heel moving freely. I wouldn't do this. Especially not if you happen to use UPZ boots with their bolt-on toe pieces!

[lowrider]

Lowrider,

I do agree with some of the concepts here that your front foot is the pillar you stand on and the rear moves around. Or the front foot is the power and the rear is the control.

Thanks for the reply. My question was based on the results I found when riding different plates of different stiffness and hardware placement. The soft plate overhanging the hardware left one feeling like you standing on the end of a diving board. When riding a cocktail of SW and NonSW i would imagine the same would happen when comparing front to back as far as power inputs were concerned if the SW was on the front.

[powdahbonz]

I've had about 8-10 runs now on SW standards that I picked up from another BOL member earlier this season. I normally ride TD3 SI's. I put the SW's on my Coiler PRT 182, 13ish scr and am riding the same angles, lifts and cants as on SI's. I started the day on my Schtubby in SI's and switched over after 2-3 runs. On the PRT, I rarely wash out on toe sides and never on heel sides. Yesterday, I washed out 5 times on my heelside and 4 times on toeside. I'm a goofy-it fealt like as I started applying more pressure into the fall line, the board just vanished underneath me. it was very quick on heelsides-on toe sides, it was like you knew the blowout was coming and prepared yourself for impact. Snow was very good, firm but diggable and was not having this feeling on my other ride. I was purposefully trying to over commit. Running the same trail that I had ridden on the Schtubby, no washouts or hiccups. I feel pretty loosey-goosey on the SW's. I don't know if its b/c I'm used to the stiffness of SI and less flex. I don't ever remember feeling that flexy on burton race plates. has anyone experienced this? Guess next up is to try SW on rear and SI front.

[RobertAlexander]

Hi Powdabz, I'm a goofy-it fealt like as I started applying more pressure into the fall line, the board just vanished underneath me. it was very quick on heelsides-on toe sides, it was like you knew the blowout was coming and prepared yourself for impact. Snow was very good, firm but diggable and was not having this feeling on my other ride. I was purposefully trying to over commit.

I am trying to understand your thoughts here. What is "goofy-it fealt like" and Vanished, Blowout, impact, are you using yellow/yellow or Blue/Blue? Is this something you think you can adapt to over time? Over commit , by how? going early, picking board up more. I am trying to see what it is that I will be getting into when the sw si arrive. Thank you, R

[powdahbonz]

I'm a goofy rider and I felt that as I transitioned to heelside turns and drove pressure up into the fallline, my normal carve and ability to edge into the hill, I was washing out (board coming out from under me and falling onto my back). On a toeside, I could feel my back 1/4 of the board getting away from me and washed out on my toeside as well. When I rode my other Coiler in regular TD3 SI's on the same run, practicing the same movements and techniques, I had none of these problems. The pads on the SW's are blue. To clarify, these are non-stepin SW's. They are early BOL prototypes. My TD3 are run with yellow elastomers, running 55 front 3 degree toe lift and 50ish rear with 3 degree heel lift. As far as adapting, I'm going to try just my rear foot next weekend.

[scrutton]

Interesting, so there is an adaptation curve.

[lonbordin]

There are some who don't believe in introducing more flex in the binding/boot/board interface.

They make good arguments and their riding backs up their viewpoint.

I'm on the fence myself. I miss the ability to move around (like surfing)... hoping for a technological (magnetic?) breakthrough someday.

[Shred Gruumer]

Ewhhhhh.. more slop on the front foot...sounds less responsive and more effort to flip board edge to edge.

[RobertAlexander]

SW SI blue heel blue toe, after about ten days, the last 3 was good carve snow that I could throw some energy at. The SW SI did run smoother. It did not effect my timing at all. I put the yellow pads in the toes and am going to see what this squish is about for tomorrow. Same Bat time, same Bat channel, R

[digger jr]

I have 15 good firm snow carving days on the SW step ins front and back blue pads 60*ish angles front and back. To me they feel significantly less flexy side to side than standard SW which I rode all last year. I think this is due to the fact that with the stepins you lose that little bit of flex inherent with bail setup. I like the feel. More direct than bail SW but enough to allow easy fore-aft movement and feels good on the knees, almost as good as the Gizmos in that respect.

[RobertAlexander]

Another good snow day to test the SW SI , this time with the yellow pads in the toes, blue pads in the heels. I noticed a slight more flex using the yellow toe pads compared to the blue toe pads. It was not any great concern as though I had to relearn or retime my turns in any way at all. Just a bit more smoother, Go out and blast away.

Now the trick is to get the yellow heel pads, I think that this will be more of a change, as that is where the pivot movement starts, at the heel. Any flexing that goes to the toe does so thru the boot in torsional twisting. I will post again when the yellows appear in the heel. They are a different shape and are more volume, than the toe pads. R

[RobertAlexander]

At Eces I obtained a full set of SW SI heel pads color Yellow. I rode them all of eces and then at my home mt Loon, for aprox 10 more days of good carving conditions. I also use yellow e rings in front and rear. My opinion is that this was a perfect match for all terrain and conditions. The flex was not at all to soft in any manner. It was again, perfect. Any crud under the pack gets absorbed to be hardly noticeable. Slight edge pressures to fine tune a carve where still consistent. I was doing all of this on a nirvana. Oh, I also had the toe pads yellow as well. In my opinion, yellow is the way to carving success. Thanx, Rob

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Thanks for the updates Rob, what is your weight ? Board length?

I have found the TD3 SW SI to be not as flexible as the TD3 SW Std bindings. Which I personally prefer on the groomed. It makes perfect sense figuring some of the movement in the Std is in the flex of the toe and heel pads vs solid heel pins.

I need more hours on them, however, I am very much pleased with them so far.

[RobertAlexander]

200 pounds out of the shower, and it is the Nivana 174. I will post some in use pics taken at eces , once/if I get permission.

[RobertAlexander]

One picture is showing compression of pads, the other picture is showing no load, (uncompressed). you can also see how much the toe block is angled. I hope these load ok to show this. R

While investigating these SW SI bindings earlier in the season, I watched a youtube of someone testing the yellow toe and heel pads on there living room rug. The amount of pad squish out was scary to see, and I chose to try the blue pads. But that yellow test on the rug was at 70 degree room temperature and I believe that the temperature makes a big difference. While I was trying the blue I noticed that there was definitely more room for flex so I tried the yellow pads in both tow and heel, and am very pleased with the results. I am posting these pics to demonstrate that there is not that much squish out while in a hard carve at 25 degrees f, as there was in that youtube vid at room temperature. Save the pic yourself and zoom it yourself to see better. Good luck R

Edited March 20, 2014 by RobertAlexander
update