DiveBomber Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 just wondering if its doable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 I believe Doug Dryer, he of the 282 cm Tinkler, is missing an ACL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecshredder Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 It is doable but you could do permanent damage. Cartilage is more valuable than ACL because it can't be replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quigley Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Jumped off my tierney ride (t-board, 2 wheeled longboard) about 4 summers ago. Was going about 35 mph down the road off of Mt. Sherman, should have inspected the run. The rain had washed sand across the road. I should have gone to my pads but tried to run it out. As I stepped off my board and planted my left foot I felt a brief sharp pain and heard a sound like a gun shot. My acl was gone. This effected my decision to accept that I was never gonna make it pro and so retired from sbx to coach. I have not felt like i could huck the 80 footers since that injury. But 4 winters later I am feeling almost 100% again. Pretty much trust my knee again fully. So my take is that yes you can carve without an acl, without both maybe not. Was on a downhill course yesterday on my Sims 197 Burner, the fastest skiier got speed gunned at 59 mph, me 52 mph. Not missing my acl much at all, but got to take your recovery and rebuilding of mucles easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelc Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 I have no pcl in my (rear) right knee and have injured the mcl of both legs badly at least three times. My daughter ruptered her acl completely about five years ago and is still skiing quite aggressively. Conventional wisdom had it that repairing/replacing the acl was necessary in order to avoid cartilage damage. My orthopaedic surgeon friends tell me that the latest long term studies can find no statistically significant difference in the fifteen year ocurrence of osteoarthrosis. Naturally this was very disappointing to them as they both make just about all their income from acl repairs. A key factor seems to be muscle strength and they both recommend cycling as the best strategy for aiding knee stability. I also think that the quad strength i gain from carving may help. Also i think having a ligament injury in the front knee is a different deal as a slip when one footing off the lift may lead to further cartilage damage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelc Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 interestingly this guy had an entire international rugby career without an ACL: http://www.rugbymuseum.co.nz/ABProfilee.asp?level1=All_Blacks&Level2=ABC&IDID=500 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny Posted February 28, 2011 Report Share Posted February 28, 2011 I rode from 1993-1998 with a fully torn ACL and partially torn MCL on my back leg, but I wore a custom CTI brace. Strictly hardboots and skiing - no softies and not much jumping, and no riding backwards. The brace beats up the pantlegs but otherwise isn't too cumbersome, and there was no pain associated with the injury. Finally the knee got too loose and I had it rebuilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 Been riding about 18yrs with a 50% ACL tear and an MCL tear. Used a brace for the first 2yrs, but must always workout the legs all year. Not sure whether I would follow this route again since I am always about 75%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoBear Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 It is doable but you could do permanent damage. Cartilage is more valuable than ACL because it can't be replaced. I agree, I am only 5 weeks away from getting my doctorate in physical therapy. I have torn my left (front foot) ACL and had it replaced, no brace needed. Cartilage and menisci do not grow back and an article I read showed that 68% of active people who do not have an ACL loose, from damage, at least one of their meniscus with in 5 years of loosing the ACL. Loose your carliage and meniscus = high likelihood of total knee replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecshredder Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 I also tore my front ACL 8 years ago. I had it repaired right away but the procedure used (kneecap graft) causes all sorts of pain issues for me still. My knee is scarred up pretty bad inside and I'm always one wrong move away from spraining my pattellar tendon, happens over and over again resulting in chronic tendonitis. One thing I would recommend to anyone would be using cadaver graft procedure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. Sherman Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 Doable, but make sure you have a REALLY good brace. Surgery is a season ender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted March 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Ok so its been about 9 days, Im feeling better, saw an ortho, and he said its torn, but I dont really feel any looseness yet. I partialy tore my PCL in my opposite leg about 3 years ago, and was back in about 4-6weeks. This knee feels about the same. Im able to pedal on my trainer right now for a few minutes and I put my boots on and stood on the board, and kinda feel ok. really the only time i feel much pain is when I straighten my leg out. Though i can fully bend it back right now, only about 110* of movement. For one the doctor said I have to get full ROM back before they would do surgery anyway... so once it feels better... before I have surgery which I intend to do, whats the harm in making a few turns?? I was really ripping it up last time out (well last time before the crash, but this was on the BX course) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobD Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 interestingly this guy had an entire international rugby career without an ACL:http://www.rugbymuseum.co.nz/ABProfilee.asp?level1=All_Blacks&Level2=ABC&IDID=500 Rugby players tend not to have average legs. A lot of soccer players don't have ACLs either, similar amount of muscle to compensate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0ardski Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Ok so its been about 9 days, Im feeling better, saw an ortho, and he said its torn, but I dont really feel any looseness yet. I partialy tore my PCL in my opposite leg about 3 years ago, and was back in about 4-6weeks. This knee feels about the same. Im able to pedal on my trainer right now for a few minutes and I put my boots on and stood on the board, and kinda feel ok. really the only time i feel much pain is when I straighten my leg out. Though i can fully bend it back right now, only about 110* of movement. For one the doctor said I have to get full ROM back before they would do surgery anyway... so once it feels better... before I have surgery which I intend to do, whats the harm in making a few turns?? I was really ripping it up last time out (well last time before the crash, but this was on the BX course) With a month left in the season I'd say ride now fix it later, I've been w/out an mcl and acl on the front for 20 yrs, It's weak but still works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted March 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 actually sometimes Abasin is open till june Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted March 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Rugby players tend not to have average legs. A lot of soccer players don't have ACLs either, similar amount of muscle to compensate. actually I have pretty large legs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecshredder Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 With a month left in the season I'd say ride now fix it later, I've been w/out an mcl and acl on the front for 20 yrs, It's weak but still works. Thats BS. The MCL heals in 8 weeks. You wouldn't even be able to walk without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelc Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 i have destroyed both mcl's My last accident, a severe over the front at pace in slush overextended my rear knee. Completely ruptured the pcl and major damage to an allready compromised mcl. It took four months to walk without a limp, and six months to run. The mcl has healed somewhat. pcl has left the building Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0ardski Posted March 7, 2011 Report Share Posted March 7, 2011 Thats BS. The MCL heals in 8 weeks. You wouldn't even be able to walk without it. I may be full of it, all I can say, since I never had it repaired, is that it never felt like it reattached itself and that knee still flexes sideways in a way it never moved before I hung from it wrapped sideways around a tree. My legs were quite buffed up back then from lots of big mt. telemarking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecshredder Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I totally tore the ACL and MCL, grade 3. Before my MCL started healing, a couple weeks or so, there was no walking on it. By the time I had ACL surgery I felt like nothing was even wrong, but I didn't try anything close to the forces of riding. Now if your ACL was never reconstructed any loseness you feel is probably it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tswei Posted March 9, 2011 Report Share Posted March 9, 2011 now 19 years into having no ACL in my left knee. tearing it was actually is the reason I stopped skiing and started boarding. i have no idea if it is doing long term cartilage damage for me, but I do work to keep my legs strong and only suffer pain when I am NOT exercising enough (hah, great excuse to do my favorite sports). Cycling and carving (on smooth snow at least) definitely works. Nothing builds my quads like carving. I don't agree that a brace is necessary. I am guessing the forces involved in carving would way overpower a brace quite easily. It would however remind you subconsciously that "hey dummy, you are injured here" which may have some benefit. My ortho, a leading guy in the bay area who works on a lot of pro sports athletes, tells me that a lot of pro athletes in basketball and football play without ACLs, just not publicized as it'd probably affect their marketability. I think a lot of it depends on your own physiology. If you have a lot of natural muscle and stability, 3 out of 4 ligaments may suffice depending on what your sport is. I don't find carving creates a lot of lateral stress on the knee. I did have to give up ultimate frisbee however. If you don't have pain or instability in the things you like to do, I think no surgery is better than surgery. You can always get the surgery later if things deteriorate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted March 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 Well I can ride my bike, and walk, can't really run yet, Id like a to get a couple more days on the mtn before surgery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patmoore Posted March 13, 2011 Report Share Posted March 13, 2011 My first ACL tear occurred at a sky diving competition in 1969 and the pain was excruciating. Surgery was primitive then so I opted to do nothing for almost thirty years. I continued to participate in gymnastics up to age fifty despite some lack of stability in the knee. It wasn't until I got into skiing the winter of 96-97 that it became a problem. I'd have to stop every three hundred yards and wait for the pain to subside. I finally had the surgery that spring and two subsequent "tuneups" to remove torn cartilage. Today it's bone-on-bone full-on arthritis treated with periodic injections of hyaluronic acid. Because of the limited life spans of Total Knee Replacements, my doctor is advocating I wait five more years for that procedure. I'm not sure I can wait until age 70 but will try. At the end of January last year, I was pacesetting and experienced a sudden twist of the knee. After sliding in a ball to miss a gate, duck under a rope, and avert a lift tower I was able to stand up but felt the instability. Frankly the pain I had experienced forty years ago was absent this time and I convinced myself it wasn't torn. I had an MRI done and while waiting for the results wore a neoprene knee brace and competed at the NASTAR Open at Windham (won my division in skiing and boarding). When I got home there was a call telling me the ACL was torn. I had a Townshend brace made so I could get through the Nationals and then had the surgery on June 22nd. That knee is fine now and I'm having a pretty good year racing on skis and the board. I still can't bend either knee as much as I'd like but not much I can do about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted March 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 If I do ride again this season, any thoughts on if its better to use my softer shorter set up, or a bigger board and stiffer boots? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valsam Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I have torn my ACL on my left knee 2 times ,first time back in 1988 they just streched and bolted down the same ACL and it broke again after 9 months and the second time they tried the new way "plastic surgery" they called it and it still holds up until today but with allot of pain (my left knee was'nt the same again!),after that i also torn both my PCL'S (all from basketball)! I couldnt ski after even the first surgery because skiing is very stresfull to the knees thats the reason i tryed and stuck with snowboarding! Basketball has done it again,partly torn my left MCL this Christmas at a veterans basketball tournament,after a month i rode but the pain is huge! I think that there is no way someone could ride without a ACL because the first time i torn my ACL i waited nearly 6 months to have surgery and i was limping all the time, my knee could not bend or extend 50% of normal and i was loosing it all the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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