uh ohh, Shred, Prior is cramping your style

[bobdea]

prior stubby

http://www.priorsnowboards.com/demo-boards-list.php?BSTY_ID=17&USED_RATING=1,2,3,4,5

check out the second one down

[Chris Houghton]

Nah, sidecut should be 14m for it to qualify as schtubby. Shred?

[willywhit]

prior stubby

http://www.priorsnowboards.com/demo-boards-list.php?BSTY_ID=17&USED_RATING=1,2,3,4,5

check out the second one down

I'm in....for a $10 toque

http://www.priorsnowboards.com/snowboarding-gear-caps.php

[bobdea]

Nah, sidecut should be 14m for it to qualify as schtubby. Shred?

my stubby is 11 meters, I realize most have a longer scr but I wanted something turnier

[GeoffV]

my stubby is 11 meters, I realize most have a longer scr but I wanted something turnier

It's not a Schtubby then with a 11m side cut. The whole concept of a Schtubby was a short board with a larger side cut.

Mine will have a 14m side cut like Jacks, I thinks Shred's X2 designs had a 13m side cut.

Shred spill the beans

[tex1230]

Per Bruce:

X2

171 x 20 x 13.2m

(I ordered mine skinny - 19 waist - but otherwise unchanged)

[Jack M]

Mine will have a 14m side cut like Jacks, I thinks Shred's X2 designs had a 13m side cut.

Shred spill the beans

Yes, this is no secret - Schtubby X2 = 13.2m, Safari = 14m.

14m works great for me. Had a 13m board once and at Sugarloaf it was just in no-man's-land all the time. Too long and too short at the same time, if that makes any sense.

[BlueB]

Whole Schtubby concept developmnet was quite funny to watch...

It started as a quite short board with pretty long scr. 164/16 if I still remember correct.

Then, boards were getting longer and radiuses shorter on every next generation. With 171/13 we are already at pretty normal specs - there's quite a few old production boards with similar specs... Eventually, someone would want more all-round functional nose on that thing, and evolution into "normal" board will be complete...

For your enjoyment, here's the Schtubbesse. In Schtubby concept, the one with the shortest one wins, I guess ;) Her boddy stats are 159/20/14.

[bobdea]

It's not a Schtubby then with a 11m side cut. The whole concept of a Schtubby was a short board with a larger side cut.

Mine will have a 14m side cut like Jacks, I thinks Shred's X2 designs had a 13m side cut.

Shred spill the beans

it has the stubby nose and Uncle Bruce calls it a turn stubby so I do too true to original concept or not

[BlueB]

Her boddy stats are 159/20/14.

Oh, I forgot to mention, it's X-11 - light years ahead of what you guys ride :D :D :D

[astrokel]

I'm not sure if this is a thread jack or not so apologies in advance...

Question for those with experience with varous sidecut radii (especially board designers/builders)

I drafted out a 180 effective edge sidecut with 13m and 14m radii and the difference comes out to 2.23mm (millimeters). This is a difference of less than 1/8 inch over a little less than 6 feet. Considering that trenches in even hardpack are at least say 3/4" deep how does that 1/8" difference reveal itself in the turning characteristics of the board.

It seems to me that the design of the nose/shovel of the board and the flex would have WAY more impact on how the board turns than that miniscule amount of sidecut on anything but boilerplate.

My conjecture is that sidecut is easier to classify and measure than nose shape or even flex so that's what people talk about, but like I mentioned previously the nose shape and flex would have a much bigger impact on board turning characteristics.

In talking to BV about getting a Stubby he mentioned how important the camber shape on the nose and the shovel were on the board. It seems to me that's where the magic is...

Appreciate you guys thoughts on the matter...

btw the actual sidecut depth for the 14 M sidecut is 31.19mm with the 13 M sidecut 2.23mm less

[Jack M]

Whole Schtubby concept developmnet was quite funny to watch...

It started as a quite short board with pretty long scr. 164/16 if I still remember correct.

Shred's Infiltrator was 161/14.7

[Jack M]

I'm not sure if this is a thread jack or not so apologies in advance...

Question for those with experience with varous sidecut radii (especially board designers/builders)

I drafted out a 180 effective edge sidecut with 13m and 14m radii and the difference comes out to 2.23mm (millimeters). This is a difference of less than 1/8 inch over a little less than 6 feet. Considering that trenches in even hardpack are at least say 3/4" deep how does that 1/8" difference reveal itself in the turning characteristics of the board.

It seems to me that the design of the nose/shovel of the board and the flex would have WAY more impact on how the board turns than that miniscule amount of sidecut on anything but boilerplate.

My conjecture is that sidecut is easier to classify and measure than nose shape or even flex so that's what people talk about, but like I mentioned previously the nose shape and flex would have a much bigger impact on board turning characteristics.

In talking to BV about getting a Stubby he mentioned how important the camber shape on the nose and the shovel were on the board. It seems to me that's where the magic is...

Appreciate you guys thoughts on the matter...

btw the actual sidecut depth for the 14 M sidecut is 31.19mm with the 13 M sidecut 2.23mm less

you mean 2.23mm more. And yes, it it noticeable. I like to have at least a 2m difference between boards in my quiver, because I think less than that and you've got nearly redundant boards, but I went with 14m and not 13m for a reason. I'm pleased with the results, and glad it's not 13.

[Jim]

Do all Schtubbies have the same flex? Just curious after seeing one ridden like a slalom board.

[astrokel]

I guess my question is how sure are you that the difference is in the sidecut rather than the other elements of the design?

[GeoffV]

We really should have BV respond to this, I'll see if I can get him to explain it for us. :D.

[BlueB]

Shred's Infiltrator was 161/14.7

My bad for not looking up the old tread.

[astrokel]

I guess my question is how sure are you that the difference is in the sidecut rather than the other elements of the design?

I should clarify the question above in terms of the attitude behind it. It's truly a question as opposed to a challenge to an observation.

How DOES one differentiate the effect of the sidecut on a board from the effect of the flex? Is it apparent in terms of the how much effort it takes to bend the board or the difference how the board performs on ice as opposed to softer snow? I realize it sometimes comes down to "feel" learned from years of experience on different kind of boards. But is there anyone out there that can describe their experience?

[SEJ]

BlueB, that's funny. This "New design" is morphing into a standard carver. I don't doubt that the flex in the nose and the shape of it have as lot to do with the performance. (The guys at SES were blown away by the thing. Everybody I talked to that rode it said it could be a one board quivver) But, looking at the stats, it's turning into an FP.

[bobdea]

the nose does I think, look at kesslers, the new SG stuff and some of the other newer coilers they all come up off the snow before the sidecut stops and goes back in. It does SOMETHING that you can feel (I think!)

Both the stubby and this beast of a GS board I have, have a nose like that and both boards hook up big time but when riding flat feel all nimble and small, kinda neat. I'm sure flex has as much to do with it as well.

[astrokel]

The shaping of a surf board is all feel and intuition. It feels like that is how the newest boards are being approached as opposed to a board being a physical manifestation of a bunch of numbers (length/sidecut/width/etc..). That's super cool.

Talking to BV about the front end of the stubby was a revelation...

[astrokel]

BlueB, that's funny. This "New design" is morphing into a standard carver. But, looking at the stats, it's turning into an FP.

Like I said, a board is more than a bunch of numbers... a caveat is that I have never ridden a stubby but thinking about the theory and hearing about others' experiences makes me a believer... Yes, we can;)

[Jack M]

I guess my question is how sure are you that the difference is in the sidecut rather than the other elements of the design?

Well, my schtubby 170/14 carves a bit shorter than my old 2001 Donek 186/15, significantly shorter than my Madd 180/16, and significantly longer than my old Prior 177/11.9. This is what I wanted when I ordered 14 instead of 13.2. Carve size is exactly as I expected from a 14m board.

[Jack M]

the nose does I think, look at kesslers, the new SG stuff and some of the other newer coilers they all come up off the snow before the sidecut stops and goes back in. It does SOMETHING that you can feel (I think!)

Actually the nose doesn't come off the snow... it comes up off a hard floor if you press the board down flat. But that doesn't mean you've got any less effective edge while carving on snow. Specifically, the <i>camber</i> stops further down the board than before.

While you're carving, the edge is pretty deep in the snow - so much that the point where the nose edge is meeting the snow is waaay up the nose - like in this picture, it's up around 10 o'clock (imagine a clock face on the nose):

So, the nose is actually carving! Nose shape and the nose <i>kick</i> affect the carve shape, and especially the initiation. So it seems that what Coiler, SG, Kessler and probably others are doing is designing nose shape and kick as an active participant in carve shape, rather than as an afterthought. They're thinking in 3 dimensions. Pretty cool, really.

What it does, as far as I can tell, is it makes the board smoother, less hooky on initiation, and the nose doesn't plow as much. I also think it's better on rutty or bumpier conditions.

[GeoffV]

What it does, as far as I can tell, is it makes the board smoother, less hooky on initiation, and the nose doesn't plow as much. I also think it's better on rutty or bumpier conditions.

This is very true and exactly what I experienced when I was demo'ing a Schtubby. The board feels more forgiving and not as nervous as snappy boards like Madds or Virii's. This is the first time I've experienced a board that you can relax on and let the board ride you vs. you having to work to ride the board. My legs are usually shot be 2 pm and I was amazed that I still had plenty of juice left. It was nice to ride relaxed all day.

Don't get me wrong I like to ride hard and work the board, but it is nice to have a board in your quiver that you can ride and just relax on. The Schtubby fits that bill, it is one of the smoothest boards I've ever ridden.