Ankle injuries

[Guest crikey]

Hi. I would be interested to know if anyone out there in Snowboardland has had frequent ankle injuries?

I dislocated my ankle after a mega tumble in Jan 2004. I have had lots of physio plus an arthoscopy to clean out the joint and intend to get back on a board in december fitness allowing.

When I fell and wrecked my ankle, I was riding Soft Boots, Burton Driver step ins which are pretty stiff. I had loosened my boots because I was getting shin pain in both my legs. Unfortunately when I tumbled the looseness in the boot did not protect my ankle so pop out occurred.

Previously when I rode my Burton Hard Boots the higher cuff considerably dampened out the shin pain so I have decided that wearing hard boots is definitely the way to go for that reason. I have now got a set of Thermoflex Le Mans boots which are really comfy but the ankle issue is going to weigh heavily on my mind for a bit.

Have you guys had many ankle injuries wearing hard boots?

[Neil Gendzwill]

Got a bone bruise on the side of my heel just below the ankle from screwing up a hard carve and going into major chatter. Took a month or so to heal. Nothing serious. Didn't prevent me from riding.

[Mike T]

I had a nasty, nasty sprain in March '04. I didn't think it was that bad at first but as the swelling went down I realized how bad I wrenched it. I partially tore 3 of the major ligaments. I rehabbed it pretty aggressively and I've got the strength back but not the full range of motion, and it gets a little sore after either really heavy use or periods of no use. A couple of docs have seen it and said cleanup surgery is an option to improve range of motion but not necessary. If I were a runner I might have it scoped, but for snowboarding, hiking and biking it seems OK.

[tahoetrencher]

I've broken each leg once. Both times in hard boots. Spirals to the fib (or tib- whichever is the smaller) The last sled trip was guided by a nice lady in hardboots on a skinny board. Some loss of movement but the only thing that keeps me back is between my ears. Exclusively in HB (9 years in ski boots) since 1989 (Apex- Raceroom) so probably 700-800 days in a race boot. I'll take those odds any day- or at least 2-3 days a week!

[Mark.Andersen]

I blew the cuff cant out of my Raichles a few years back. I broke the medial malleolus (knobby thing on the inside of the ankle) off the bottom of my tibia. For about a year I was unable to get into hardboots due to residual swelling. I could still ride in softies, but I had to be pretty careful. Chatter was really painful. This season I gave up softies altogether for the added support of hardboots and my ankle is far happier.

Here's my picture:

[Guest Randy S.]

As many of you know I tore my achilles riding on January 2. That's sort of an ankle injury. I plan to get back on a motorcycle soon and I may ride again this season since my mountain is staying open through Memorial Day. I tore it in hard boots on a powder board (boots in walk mode). Complete tear and repair 4 days later. Its still stiff and sore, longest recovery period for any surgery I've had.

I'm considering not riding in walk mode in the future, but I'll probably change my mind about that after riding a while and getting it back into shape.

I've been in therapy since the repair.

[Mark.Andersen]

Randy, what bindings were you using? I tried riding my TD2s on pow days and had to use walk mode. I've since started using a pair of plastic F2s and am able to lock the boots down and let the bindings flex.

[LeeW]

hmm. its more of an old injury. i broke it skateboarding. have a metal rod and 11 screws on the bottom of my fibula (the small bone).

every other blue moon, it'd hurt whenever im out hardbooting. but that was when my UPZ was brand spanking new. now, its not too bad.

[Dave Pushee]

About 4 years ago at Sunshine (Alberta), I was hit from behind by a skier.

It was the first day of a one week vacation and I started out with a mountain tour. Our guide led us (mostly skiers plus me) to the top of a slope with windpacked "pow" that ended on a groomed green trail. I went early in the crew and stopped on the groomed at the bottom. I heard some commotion behind me and then saw a ski appear between my feet - then the freight train hit. Apparently a brit in our crew couldn't turn in the windpack and straightlined into me - skis straddled my front foot.

I'm not sure if it was a sprain or hyperextension, but I had to give up on that day and download. Later in the week, I was able to handle my Supermodel with plates on groomers, but the Ultraprime was too jarring, and anything off-pistes was painful too.

I never did see anyone except the first aid crew at Sunshine who decided that it probably was not broken. It's fine now.

[Gecko]

Originally posted by LeeW

hmm. its more of an old injury. i broke it skateboarding. have a metal rod and 11 screws on the bottom of my fibula (the small bone).

every other blue moon, it'd hurt whenever im out hardbooting. but that was when my UPZ was brand spanking new. now, its not too bad.

though not that bad. I folded mine landing a big frontside stalefish, it took about 7 months to heal up to the point I could skate again though I still skate with a brace. It's now a "trick" ankle that collapses about once every two years or so. It hurt after about 3-4 hours of soft riding though since I've switched to plates I've all but forgotten about it on the snow...hell with my S-one I don't think about it skating these days at all

[skatha]

Originally posted by Dave Pushee

About 4 years ago at Sunshine (Alberta), I was hit from behind by a skier.

It was the first day of a one week vacation and I started out with a mountain tour. Our guide led us (mostly skiers plus me) to the top of a slope with windpacked "pow" that ended on a groomed green trail. I went early in the crew and stopped on the groomed at the bottom. I heard some commotion behind me and then saw a ski appear between my feet - then the freight train hit. Apparently a brit in our crew couldn't turn in the windpack and straightlined into me - skis straddled my front foot.

I'm not sure if it was a sprain or hyperextension, but I had to give up on that day and download. Later in the week, I was able to handle my Supermodel with plates on groomers, but the Ultraprime was too jarring, and anything off-pistes was painful too.

I never did see anyone except the first aid crew at Sunshine who decided that it probably was not broken. It's fine now.

The question is-did the skiier yell at you for "running into them"???

;)

I sprained my ankle this year too-took about 6 weeks to get over probably because I'm old....

Sad to say, after everybody else's horror story, the accident is too weeny to recount

[tex1230]

About a year ago, I had a full rupture of my achilles, surgically repaired + 6 months of rehab. Painful, frustrating...but the upside was, after my surgeon & physical therapist told me "no more high-impact sports"(ie no air, no skateboards, no jogging) I switched back to carving...and rediscovered the reason I love this sport.

[Guest Randy S.]

Originally posted by Mark.Andersen

Randy, what bindings were you using? I tried riding my TD2s on pow days and had to use walk mode. I've since started using a pair of plastic F2s and am able to lock the boots down and let the bindings flex.

I was on F2 Titanflex bindings. I keep those on my pow board.

[dr. sandman]

Originally posted by Mike T

I had a nasty, nasty sprain in March '04. I didn't think it was that bad at first but as the swelling went down I realized how bad I wrenched it. I partially tore 3 of the major ligaments. I rehabbed it pretty aggressively and I've got the strength back but not the full range of motion, and it gets a little sore after either really heavy use or periods of no use. A couple of docs have seen it and said cleanup surgery is an option to improve range of motion but not necessary. If I were a runner I might have it scoped, but for snowboarding, hiking and biking it seems OK.

Very similar to Mike T.'s -

Early Feb '05 - "last run" easy toe side, board hooked up, went down to hands/shoulder on toe side. Board kept going, twisting esp. the rear leg & pulling heel way of bottom of boot (SB413's). Boots had felt a bit loose, but I figured "last run, I can get by". Like Mike's, I felt it when it happend, but didn't think it was going to be so bad. X-Bone SI's were great, allowed to release and let off the strain and pain. Stood up a few minutes later, cranked down my boot, and started down.......heel side no prob., but toe side was @#%&* painful! Sideslipped down, and spent next 3 days on crutches. Doc'd and X-Ray'd w/ no fracture so sidelined for about 1 month. In March spent week at Mammoth, wrapped tightly, with a fair amount of pain, then in early April went to Copper for a week and got by, again firmly wrapped, with much less pain. Still mild pain today and noticable decreased range of motion. Orthopedic MD friend said may take up to 3-6 months to heal and decreased ROM is common, and that micro surg might allow for increased ROM.

[trikerdad]

You need more options in your poll. Where do I check "broken"? Happened a long time ago when I was still riding a soft setup. Over flexed forward and cracked one of the chunky bones on the top of my right foot. Rode the rest of the season with the pain and swelling and didn't find out it was broken until a couple years later when I was being x-rayed for another injury.

[Guest crikey]

Sorry about only 4 options. I was concerned primarily about spraining or dislocating my ankle again if I was to wear hard boots. But the general feeling I am getting is it'll be ok.

Just a bit of further info on my injury. I caught an edge after putting a few quick turns in following big air from a roller that I was nailing. I mostly saw sky, snow, sky, snow, about four times before I stopped moving and then got dragged down the mountain by my rucksack loop and my legs in the air, Most undignified.

I was riding out in Saalbach Hinterglemm in Austria and was taken to Zell to the Hospital there. They said it wasnt broken but wanted to do a further xray at a different level to evaluate my ligament damage. A cutesy Austrian physio girlie came in and wheeled me to her torture chamber. There i my leg was put in a wooden frame and a leather strap attached to my calf and draped over my ankle in the direction of the dislocation and then 5 kg was hung off the strap. As you may imagine It was a bit painful. I was yelling and squirming so much she could not take the xray. She removed the weight and told me I could stop yelling. I pointed out to her that she might care to look at my ankle as I still felt like yelling some more. She then realised that my ankle was dislocated again and looking very unnatural. It was her turn to start yelling for a doctor to come and put me straight again. Needless to say I didnt get another ligament xray.

So dont trust cutesy looking physioterrorists, they all want to hurt you really.

[Cindy Kleh]

An ankle injury which is almost unique to snowboarding is chipping the talus bone, right above and inside the heel bone. It takes a forward thrust (flex) while on the toe edge to break it off, and it mimics an ankle break except that it doesn't heal and feel better even after months. It can only be detected with an MRI and most orthopaedics that don't practce in mtn. towns don't look for it. If it doesn't get surgery and proper care, it usually means lifelong arthritus in the ankle joint.

[Guest crikey]

I had an osteochondral lump (bone and cartillage) removed from the outside of my ankle last month, about a year after my fall. It had taken a divet out of my bone when it went. The docs told me I had got bruising of the bone and possibly a fracture inside the joint. They couldnt tell any more by the MRI.

I am still very achy in that joint though. Specially in the mornings when the fluid has drained there over night.

Soon be running on it though.

[skatha]

Originally posted by crikey

Sorry about only 4 options. I was concerned primarily about spraining or dislocating my ankle again if I was to wear hard boots. But the general feeling I am getting is it'll be ok.

Just a bit of further info on my injury. I caught an edge after putting a few quick turns in following big air from a roller that I was nailing. I mostly saw sky, snow, sky, snow, about four times before I stopped moving and then got dragged down the mountain by my rucksack loop and my legs in the air, Most undignified.

I was riding out in Saalbach Hinterglemm in Austria and was taken to Zell to the Hospital there. They said it wasnt broken but wanted to do a further xray at a different level to evaluate my ligament damage. A cutesy Austrian physio girlie came in and wheeled me to her torture chamber. There i my leg was put in a wooden frame and a leather strap attached to my calf and draped over my ankle in the direction of the dislocation and then 5 kg was hung off the strap. As you may imagine It was a bit painful. I was yelling and squirming so much she could not take the xray. She removed the weight and told me I could stop yelling. I pointed out to her that she might care to look at my ankle as I still felt like yelling some more. She then realised that my ankle was dislocated again and looking very unnatural. It was her turn to start yelling for a doctor to come and put me straight again. Needless to say I didnt get another ligament xray.

So dont trust cutesy looking physioterrorists, they all want to hurt you really.

HeHe....

PT=pure torture

[jdgang]

Third day out during my first year boarding did a endo on my board. rip all of the ligaments in my left ankle. waiting a month and no problems since then

[Gtanner]

This past season, one week before heading on vacation to Whistler, I managed to partially tear three ligaments in my ankle playing volleyball. Inside, outside and over the top...damn opposing player travelling under the net and landing on me!

So I managed to get through the week at Whistler by going through a ton of physio and lots of pain-killers...thanks again to Prior for letting me demo a 4WD for the week.

It's been a few months and I'm back to all my sports, but it still hurts at max flex and I still wear an ankle support.

First ankle injury while riding arrose when I hit a tree coming out of a training course right before nationals...I still did the race, but was horrible.

Great topic,

Gord

[dr. sandman]

Very similar to Mike T.'s -

Early Feb '05 - "last run" easy toe side, board hooked up, went down to hands/shoulder on toe side. Board kept going, twisting esp. the rear leg & pulling heel way of bottom of boot (SB413's). Boots had felt a bit loose, but I figured "last run, I can get by". Like Mike's, I felt it when it happend, but didn't think it was going to be so bad. X-Bone SI's were great, allowed to release and let off the strain and pain. Stood up a few minutes later, cranked down my boot, and started down.......heel side no prob., but toe side was @#%&* painful! Sideslipped down, and spent next 3 days on crutches. Doc'd and X-Ray'd w/ no fracture so sidelined for about 1 month. In March spent week at Mammoth, wrapped tightly, with a fair amount of pain, then in early April went to Copper for a week and got by, again firmly wrapped, with much less pain. Still mild pain today and noticable decreased range of motion. Orthopedic MD friend said may take up to 3-6 months to heal and decreased ROM is common, and that micro surg might allow for increased ROM.

So now it's 6 months later. I still have about the same level of pain as I did in March/April, and certain positions are extremely painful. My son fractured his fibula, so we've made several trips to a Bay Area sports med. specialty group so I figured a 3rd opinion wouldn't hurt. This Dr. looks at the x-ray from my local ortho and says "so did he tell you it was fractured? So, he orders an MRI and sure enough, classic "Snowboarders Fracture" (talar process) - I should have payed more attention to Cindy:

An ankle injury which is almost unique to snowboarding is chipping the talus bone, right above and inside the heel bone. It takes a forward thrust (flex) while on the toe edge to break it off, and it mimics an ankle break except that it doesn't heal and feel better even after months. It can only be detected with an MRI and most orthopaedics that don't practce in mtn. towns don't look for it. If it doesn't get surgery and proper care, it usually means lifelong arthritus in the ankle joint.

Girl - you made a better diagnosis than 2 of my local docs!!

So now, I had a cortisone injection about a week ago to attempt to reduce the scar tissue - no relief yet. If that doesn't work (less that 50% chance that it will) next option is orthoscopic surgery to try to reduce the scar tissue. If that doesn't work, then it's fusion surgery which will still allow up/down movement but no twist. Not good. Had it been properly diagnosed (per Cindy's advice), I would have been in a non-weighbearing cast for 6 weeks, a boot for another 4 and would have most likely had considerably better resolution of the problem. Maybe I'll get to ride this season.

Just wanted to post this to make you and yours aware of this. see attached article: http://www.aafp.org/afp/20020901/785.html

[Mike T]

Sandman - after reading your post I feel extrmeley lucky that mine has healed as well as it has!

The orthoppedic masseuse who has been treating my shoulder (bike injury that I posted about in June) took one look at it and determined that my hip alignmnet was far enough off to have stopped it from healing. Two hours of orthopdeic massage and two weeks later, I've got full ROM back!

[NateW]

Between skateboarding and BMX my ankles had a rough time while I was growing up - no major injuries, but so many moderate sprains that my ankles now "sprain" (maybe not really, but hurt bad) at the drop of a hat. They bothered me in soft boots occasionally, but it's hardly ever an issue in hard boots.

On the subject of PT: I had PT for knee trouble a couple years ago, and they said their motto was "We're not happy 'til you're not happy."

[mnfusion]

I had a 3rd degree sprain (there may have been small bone fractures but they couldn't tell from the xray) from skateboarding. It took nearly a full year to fully heal. 5 months to walk without pain and another 7 before I could cut side-to-side without pain. Granted returning to rugby two weeks after the injury probably didn't help, but I almost lost my job because of the injury and haven't skated my short board since.

Oh yea, no problems with snowboarding after it healed, but it hurt like hell for a season getting in and out of my boots. Once I was in my boots though I really had no problems.