lowrider Posted January 15, 2013 Report Share Posted January 15, 2013 Now my wife won't know what board i want for my birthday! Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger jr Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 Thanks for "owning up" Todd, I understand your feelings completely on this, as this site is hopefully open to all ages ect.... That said, thanks for sharing tastar. Very funny Puddy Tat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 (edited) Coiler Nirvana FC 170...This is how it came out... Believe it or not it turns from black to emerald green in natural light...An unexpected "happy accident!" Toward the nose and not visible in the pic, it has some subtle geometric shadows that add just the right amount of character... Edited January 16, 2013 by glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLN Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 Can you post some more info on this plates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 Can you post some more info on this plates? Yes...The plates are made by John Philkill (JP1 on bomber). They're designed to isolate the rider from the board like the other plate designs that are popular now. They allow independent foot movement/input and are surprisingly light (under 2 lbs. if I recall correctly)... You'd have to check with John on that...I've used an earlier design of John's plates and liked them so decided to use them on this new ride... I'm sure John would be more than willing to fill you in on all the details. Great guy and thoughtful machinist/designer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowrider Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 Stupid simple design. Similar rubber mounts were used on John Deere riding lawnmower engine mounts since the 60's. Bomproof. Simple effective so simple people don't realize how effective they are. Hinge, slide, shock absorption all achieved by rubber. " Add that to the bord porn title " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted January 16, 2013 Report Share Posted January 16, 2013 From the Rules and Guidelines for this Forum page, I'm guessing your post violated the rules: This. No need for tb to own up, these have been the rules since 2003. We have always considered the atmosphere here to be like an après-ski bar. There will be adult conversations and things might get a little loud, but kids are allowed in. And there will not be any pin-up girls on the walls! :). Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Stupid simple design. Similar rubber mounts were used on John Deere riding lawnmower engine mounts since the 60's. Bomproof. Simple effective so simple people don't realize how effective they are. Hinge, slide, shock absorption all achieved by rubber. " Add that to the bord porn title " Yep, great design...There were those who quietly disparaged this design but now seems like everybody is going for the principle, albeit in different ways. I think John was on the right track all along...Simple,effective and light...John's got a good logical mind and is a good hand at design and machining... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jskyhawk Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Yep, great design...There were those who quietly disparaged this design but now seems like everybody is going for the principle, albeit in different ways. I think John was on the right track all along...Simple,effective and light...John's got a good logical mind and is a good hand at design and machining... Don't the characteristics of rubber vary greatly with temperature? I wouldn't think this would be an issue sitting underneath a John Deere mower but... Correct me if I'm wrong here but I would think that as temps change throughout the day the characteristics of the rubber mounts would change the flexibility/absorption of the Philkill Plate mounts. I saw Virus prototype plate using the same mounts and I question both the performance of the rubber in colder temps and how the rubber can hold up in cold temperatures while being loaded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donek Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 When I spoke with him at ECES last year, he indicated the rubber bushings were not rated for tension applications. Perhaps he's found a work around for that problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowrider Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Don't the characteristics of rubber vary greatly with temperature? I wouldn't think this would be an issue sitting underneath a John Deere mower but... Correct me if I'm wrong here but I would think that as temps change throughout the day the characteristics of the rubber mounts would change the flexibility/absorption of the Philkill Plate mounts. I saw Virus prototype plate using the same mounts and I question both the performance of the rubber in colder temps and how the rubber can hold up in cold temperatures while being loaded.I guess the suspension under your car doesn't function when it gets cold ? I'm pretty sure no one claimed it was perfect but it is perfectly simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Don't the characteristics of rubber vary greatly with temperature? I wouldn't think this would be an issue sitting underneath a John Deere mower but... Correct me if I'm wrong here but I would think that as temps change throughout the day the characteristics of the rubber mounts would change the flexibility/absorption of the Philkill Plate mounts. I saw Virus prototype plate using the same mounts and I question both the performance of the rubber in colder temps and how the rubber can hold up in cold temperatures while being loaded. Well, I'm sure there is some effect from temp. but you'll have to show me that effect practically...I've ridden these plates and I can't see where there is any noticeable performance disadvantage... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 When I spoke with him at ECES last year, he indicated the rubber bushings were not rated for tension applications. Perhaps he's found a work around for that problem. That may be true that they're not "rated" for extension. That doesn't necessarily mean they won't hold up under that stress. It means to me that they haven't been certified for that particular application. John has done some pretty heavy testing and hasn't had one fail...I trust him because I know how thorough he is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 17, 2013 Report Share Posted January 17, 2013 Don't the characteristics of rubber vary greatly with temperature? I wouldn't think this would be an issue sitting underneath a John Deere mower but... Correct me if I'm wrong here but I would think that as temps change throughout the day the characteristics of the rubber mounts would change the flexibility/absorption of the Philkill Plate mounts. I saw Virus prototype plate using the same mounts and I question both the performance of the rubber in colder temps and how the rubber can hold up in cold temperatures while being loaded. Let me ask you...Have you ever "tried" these plates with rubber isolators or are you just "questioning?" If you haven't "tried" them, then you have nothing to offer as far as criticism goes...It's just speculation.If you have tried them and you see a performance flaw, then go right ahead. I'm all ears... Please don't read as an attack. I'm just pointing out that without trying them, you can't make an informed determination... I heard one guy say "They won't work." He never tried them he just made an arbitrary judgement. He was wrong...:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Stevens Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 digger jr.'s got pretty much the best avatar I've seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkaholic Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I have ridden both the Virus bushing plate (extensively) and the Gizmo v1 (JP1 plate). The virus worked quite well and I was a bit bummed when I had to return it. I rode the Gizmo on a '90s racestock BS 178 with TD1s and it isolated me very well and I had a blast on my old racer. I tested with this setup because it is a very unforgiving, stiff ride and really let the Gizmo shine. A side benefit of the Gizmo is that it provides some lateral movement similar to sidewinders. Ink Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I have ridden both the Virus bushing plate (extensively) and the Gizmo v1 (JP1 plate). The virus worked quite well and I was a bit bummed when I had to return it. I rode the Gizmo on a '90s racestock BS 178 with TD1s and it isolated me very well and I had a blast on my old racer. I tested with this setup because it is a very unforgiving, stiff ride and really let the Gizmo shine. A side benefit of the Gizmo is that it provides some lateral movement similar to sidewinders.Ink Now there's a valid critique...Somebody who has tried them. The newer version Gizmos are actually better since they're lighter. I had inserts installed so as to do away with the original three plate design which facilitates a reduction in weight since the top plate attaches directly to the board ( with isolators between the plate and the board of course). In any event, I think John has been on the right track since the beginning... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jskyhawk Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Let me ask you...Have you ever "tried" these plates with rubber isolators or are you just "questioning?" If you haven't "tried" them, then you have nothing to offer as far as criticism goes...It's just speculation.If you have tried them and you see a performance flaw, then go right ahead. I'm all ears...Please don't read as an attack. I'm just pointing out that without trying them, you can't make an informed determination... I heard one guy say "They won't work." He never tried them he just made an arbitrary judgement. He was wrong...:) I am just making conversation, I had a curiosity about the rubber. Just looking to hear your thoughts, no criticism intended. I think because we are on a web forum everyone expects an argument. I'm not here for a pissing contest, just to share information. I believe I phrased myself correctly, and I even said to correct me if I am wrong. Thanks for correcting me! I met John over at ECES last year and had some lingering questions. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) I am just making conversation, I had a curiosity about the rubber. Just looking to hear your thoughts, no criticism intended. I think because we are on a web forum everyone expects an argument. I'm not here for a pissing contest, just to share information. I believe I phrased myself correctly, and I even said to correct me if I am wrong. Thanks for correcting me! I met John over at ECES last year and had some lingering questions. ;) You're right, I did expect an argument and mistakenly took it as that...Sorry...As I read the post again, in that light, I can see you were just posing a question... Well,maybe I could answer one of the questions. John does have the performance parameters as to temp range and the isolators are durable to a temp. much lower than I want to be out there. I don't recall the exact temp. but it's LOW, as in low survivability conditions... If you ever catch up with John, he loves for people to try his plates and give honest opinions. I'm sure he'd be glad to let you try them. He'll be at SES and probably will have a set for people to try... Again, sorry about the misread...I've been attacked verbally here for just posting a comment about a another board that I was having built and am maybe a little defensive at times... Edited January 18, 2013 by glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Tat Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Glenn, What is John using as a mounting pattern for these plates? It doesn't appear to be UPM as from your photo it looks like it might be centered around where the normal (4X4 or 4X8) insert packs are? Cheers, Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Glenn,What is John using as a mounting pattern for these plates? It doesn't appear to be UPM as from your photo it looks like it might be centered around where the normal (4X4 or 4X8) insert packs are? Cheers, Dave Dave, The Gizmo pattern (eight inserts total) are centered over the 4X4, or UPM if you have that. With my board, I decided to go with the 4X4 because Bruce said the other plates being produced could use the 4X4 pattern. That way, if I ever go to sell the board, all bases are covered... Glenn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jskyhawk Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 You're right, I did expect an argument and mistakenly took it as that...Sorry...As I read the post again, in that light, I can see you were just posing a question... Well,maybe I could answer one of the questions.John does have the performance parameters as to temp range and the isolators are durable to a temp. much lower than I want to be out there. I don't recall the exact temp. but it's LOW, as in low survivability conditions... If you ever catch up with John, he loves for people to try his plates and give honest opinions. I'm sure he'd be glad to let you try them. He'll be at SES and probably will have a set for people to try... Again, sorry about the misread...I've been attacked verbally here for just posting a comment about a another board that I was having built and am maybe a little defensive at times... No sweat, its really easy to mistake context when not speaking verbally with someone. I appreciate the info, and that is a really nice rig you got there... Sweet topsheet and I like the white sidewalls, enjoy it! I will try to get on a PhilKill plate system this year and give my review (not questions). Hopefully we will see him at ECES again this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenn Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 No sweat, its really easy to mistake context when not speaking verbally with someone. I appreciate the info, and that is a really nice rig you got there... Sweet topsheet and I like the white sidewalls, enjoy it! I will try to get on a PhilKill plate system this year and give my review (not questions). Hopefully we will see him at ECES again this year. Again, sorry...And thanks for the props. I'm sure John will be at ECES the next time they have one. If you contact John here (JP1) I'm sure he'd be glad to talk to you about them. I don't want to speak for him but maybe you might be able to work out some way to try them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puddy Tat Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Dave,The Gizmo pattern (eight inserts total) are centered over the 4X4, or UPM if you have that. With my board, I decided to go with the 4X4 because Bruce said the other plates being produced could use the 4X4 pattern. That way, if I ever go to sell the board, all bases are covered... Glenn Ok. It uses a proprietary insert pattern then. Still looks like an interesting, simple, and light system. Cheers, Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ok. It uses a proprietary insert pattern then. Still looks like an interesting, simple, and light system. The version of the Gizmo I tried at the ECES in 2010 mounted right to my standard 4x4 board, has that changed? I was pleasantly surprised with the amount of "comfort" the system provided, albeit at the expense of some snow feel and responsiveness, but at that time my biggest critique was the weight. The plates on Glenn's board look identical, have they been lightened somehow? Perhaps hollowed out with ribbing underneath? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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