BlueB Posted March 21, 2012 Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 I didn't like the Swoard too much (I was on an appropriate for my boddy stats, 168H 2nd gen). It worked great on steeps doing EC by the book, and on flater runs for quick cross-unders/push/pulls. I didn't like it on medium pitch and race derived technique. Edge hold was great and it could turn tight at high inclinations. It locked into the carves almost too much, especially when you screw up the weight distribution a bit. I like few other boards more even for EC purpose, which could be related to my style (not completely based on Swoard doctrine). How heavy are you Randy? If under 170ish, Nidecker Proto could be a great play board for you. It can go anywhere, turns super tight, you can be lazy on it if wanted, holds edge very well. I'm close to 190 and am too big for the board - on steep hardpacked blues, I pretty much overpower it and have to do carve/slarve hybrid. Yet, it is the board that's always in my car... Other similar boards are Another inexpensive option is F2 SpeedX/ElDiablo. A bit less versatile, but more tollerant to higher speed/rider weight. Other similar boards are SG Cult and Prior AWD. Finally, if you can tollerate wider waist (24.5) look into Steepwater Steep, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Kight Posted March 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 Wow, true thanks to all you guys for wonderful input, as everyone of you guys has far more experience than I. I've noted all mentioned in this thread and begin further research. I wish like hell I could spend a few days demo'ing some of these, but around here that's a pipe dream. I'm about 225lbs for those that have asked. As much as I'd like another custom, after the Kessler money hemorage, I'm reluctant to try the Coiler/Donek route. I might fly out West this next season and try a demo or two. I think I'm starting to sound picky/finicky. Just looking for that ultimate ride as we all are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buell Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 Absolutely follow your own instincts on this. Obviously we all have varied opinions. My thoughts are that the more picky you are, the more a custom makes sense. I think you already learned quite a bit from the Kessler and can get much closer on your next attempt. Cost wise, someone would love to have your Kessler and you can likely sell it for the price of a new Coiler. The resale value on hardly used Coilers is really high compared to the new cost. That is why I would get a new Coiler every year when I was riding them, it just did not cost me that much. New Swoards are more expensive than custom Coilers. The Pure Boarding boards are fairly expensive as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTwoO Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 The Swoard is a very nice board to ride. Think of it as a long wheel base BMW or Bentley. The statement that the Swoard wants to go fast is not my experience. Through the softer construction (and you can choose it as soft as suits you) and the wider body, the board does nice high G carves without excessive speed. For all day riding this is by far preferable IMHO. With lower speeds, the size of a crash is just smaller. The radius is smaller than the GS guns that makes it relatively nimble in traffic. It is less tiring getting and keeping the wide board on its edge and once on its edge, the grip is very reliable and comfortable. Through the softer construction, the board is also much more forgiving than the GS boards (The Kessler 185GS that I rode in Jan aside...) If you want to go racing, don't take the swoard, but for full days with gaping skiers and snowboarders this board is just insane. It is the perfect board for a headset and the feeling as if you are "dancing" your carves. Off piste is not its forte with a nose with very little lift. It'll give you some float, but pulling it over a stone will put cuts right through your heart. BTW, I'm not doing EC (yet), just free carving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valsam Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 I didn't like the Swoard too much (I was on an appropriate for my boddy stats, 168H 2nd gen). It worked great on steeps doing EC by the book, and on flater runs for quick cross-unders/push/pulls. I didn't like it on medium pitch and race derived technique. Edge hold was great and it could turn tight at high inclinations. It locked into the carves almost too much, especially when you screw up the weight distribution a bit. I like few other boards more even for EC purpose, which could be related to my style (not completely based on Swoard doctrine). How heavy are you Randy? If under 170ish, Nidecker Proto could be a great play board for you. It can go anywhere, turns super tight, you can be lazy on it if wanted, holds edge very well. I'm close to 190 and am too big for the board - on steep hardpacked blues, I pretty much overpower it and have to do carve/slarve hybrid. Yet, it is the board that's always in my car... Other similar boards are Another inexpensive option is F2 SpeedX/ElDiablo. A bit less versatile, but more tollerant to higher speed/rider weight. Other similar boards are SG Cult and Prior AWD. Finally, if you can tollerate wider waist (24.5) look into Steepwater Steep, too. ΒlueB why don't you recommend the highly expensive burton speed 168 wide that you recommended to me and i broke the bank paying 150$ for it? I haven't ridden a sword but last week on hero snow riding the speed i thought that there can not be any other board for even 5-10 times more money that can do what the speed does ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kieran Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 ... i broke the bank paying 150$ for it?so the whole €uro crisis is your fault, is it? ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTwoO Posted March 23, 2012 Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 I didn't like the Swoard too much (I was on an appropriate for my boddy stats, 168H 2nd gen). It worked great on steeps doing EC by the book, and on flater runs for quick cross-unders/push/pulls. I didn't like it on medium pitch and race derived technique. Edge hold was great and it could turn tight at high inclinations. It locked into the carves almost too much, especially when you screw up the weight distribution a bit. I like few other boards more even for EC purpose, which could be related to my style (not completely based on Swoard doctrine). How heavy are you Randy? If under 170ish, Nidecker Proto could be a great play board for you. It can go anywhere, turns super tight, you can be lazy on it if wanted, holds edge very well. I'm close to 190 and am too big for the board - on steep hardpacked blues, I pretty much overpower it and have to do carve/slarve hybrid. Yet, it is the board that's always in my car... Other similar boards are Another inexpensive option is F2 SpeedX/ElDiablo. A bit less versatile, but more tollerant to higher speed/rider weight. Other similar boards are SG Cult and Prior AWD. Finally, if you can tollerate wider waist (24.5) look into Steepwater Steep, too. Hooked into the thread a little late and did not read till this post... Som smoking recommendations in there!! Much closer to the needs of the FP. That SG Cult is one that I won't mind trying some time. Is the F2 Eliminator not also an option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valsam Posted March 23, 2012 Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) so the whole €uro crisis is your fault, is it? ;) I also bought very expensive bindings new (20 euros)from ebay and charged both board and bindings to my credit card that i could not pay off that led evidently to the almost collapse of the hole european banking system! It was either my fault then or maybe the Greek and european crisis has something to do with some people buying houses and boats and cars and 1500$ snowboards that they couldn't pay off,does the name lehman brothers ring a bell? Someone had to pay for every ones mess ups (yeah you know who I'm talking about,ill give you a hint it's across Europe and you cross the Atlantic ocean to get there!)and it was little Greece that had the traitors politicians that where wiling to betray there country so it would take the blame and be shown as the black sheep! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmin3OZnC0w Edited March 23, 2012 by valsam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Vu Posted March 23, 2012 Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 As a disciple of Rob Crobar, would like to share some views on Swoard as I own both the Dual and Extremecarver decks. Some reviews above mentioned the Swoard to “lock into a carve”. Would like to respectfully disagree as what makes the Swoard special is its ability to instantly change direction during a high speed carve almost at will. Having tested other brands, the Swoard is the one that “lock” the least while having fantastic edge hold. From a surfing feeling, I think the Swoard is an excellent choice. I both windsurf/waveride and ride (somewhat newbie) at skateboard parks and the Swoard does provide that surfing grooving feel. For sure it is not designed nor intended to ride between gates with competition technique. But then, last time I checked, there are no gates on waves :o. Would like to second everything NTwoO said about the softness of the Swoard. 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCrobar Posted March 23, 2012 Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 The one thing I hope to convey about the Extremecarver is that if you NEVER try to lay out one Euro-Carve, the Swoard EC board is a very easy to ride, forgiving, ALPINE style board that is a lot of fun when just cruising around enjoying the day; it is not just an EC board or demanding race board, this is what I meant when I called it versatile. The EC Swoard not meant to be an almountain board, but it is actually closer than you would think because of the soft flex and wide waist width and despite the shape of the low profile nose and larger sidecut. That said, I realize that a Swoard is not for everyone. I respect BlueB and Buell's comments as I have read many of their posts over the years, always insightful and to the point. As Randy found out, the Kessler is not for everyone as well. It seems to me that liking or not liking the design of a Swoard or a Kessler, etc. is 'perhaps' related to a riders preferred technique and where they happen to be in their personal riding ability continuum. Nothing wrong with this, we are lucky to have a choice of board builders to meet our desires and needs I can say that since riding a Swoard I have not felt the urge to continually buy a new board each season, constantly looking for something new each year. Not saying it is the best board in the world, but it is a quality board that many will enjoy. Peter - I am getting older, have a busy young family so I don't get out as much as I wish I could ... time to pass the torch to younger rippers like you and your brother! When I do get out for a ride I really enjoy my time, hopefully this string of post will help Randy find a board that works for him. Cheers Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
west carven Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 howdy randy i agree with peter vu that the swoard is not a solid carver, maybe in just right hero snow. i found that it likes to "drift" as in a car analogy. i only have three days on a 168 medium that i rode last year. as for an all around board i would get a coiler all mountian metal, it would cost about the same, but will hold an edge ten times better. did not ride the swoard this year because i was waiting for the right conditions that never was. also my coiler AMT is a way better ride. get a custom coiler made just for you, whats better than that. click on Aaron and the Swoard in my signature... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buell Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 I can say that since riding a Swoard I have not felt the urge to continually buy a new board each season, constantly looking for something new each year. Not saying it is the best board in the world, but it is a quality board that many will enjoy. Cheers Rob Rob, that is a misinterpretation of my post. I regularly change my boards because I love trying new ones. That has to do with me, not the boards Bruce was building me. My post had to do with the cost and resale of Coilers if Randy wanted to tweak a design to get it even more to his liking. That is because you can tweak boards with Bruce, not because you will need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCrobar Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Rob, that is a misinterpretation of my post. I regularly change my boards because I love trying new ones. That has to do with me, not the boards Bruce was building me. My post had to do with the cost and resale of Coilers if Randy wanted to tweak a design to get it even more to his liking. That is because you can tweak boards with Bruce, not because you will need to. Hi Buel Hey, that comment by me was in no way directed at you or anyone. The comment I made regarding this was all about me and my past, I have spent years buying boards and buyers guide(s), searching for the right board as Randy is doing. I love riding and getting new boards, ask my wife about this! Sorry for the confusion, this is sometimes a pitfall of communicating via a forum, etc. For the record, I happen to agree with you regarding your Coiler thoughts. Cheers Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buell Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Hi BuelHey, that comment by me was in no way directed at you or anyone. The comment I made regarding this was all about me and my past, I have spent years buying boards and buyers guide(s), searching for the right board as Randy is doing. I love riding and getting new boards, ask my wife about this! Sorry for the confusion, this is sometimes a pitfall of communicating via a forum, etc. For the record, I happen to agree with you regarding your Coiler thoughts. Cheers Rob That is funny. Whoops. It totally matched something I said in my earlier post about a new Coiler every year. I am sure more posters here would love a wife to surprise them with boards they wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buell Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 I am pretty sure the Coiler models I am thinking of are the Monster and the Mini-Monster. One rider I know who had a Monster described it as like "riding a lounge chair". Another carving buddy got one this year and it totally changed his riding. He always looks just like a longboard surfer making beautiful carves down the slope, now everything is that much smoother. He also never passes up a chance to ride it in the soft snow in the trees. Maybe he will post up his thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTwoO Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Just realised that after going to all that trouble posting, I might as well add it to a gear review. Some of the other posts in the thread can easily be added to the review. Care to join? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Ah Burton Speed, I forgot... I guess it was long discontinued, so hard to come by. Would be good for OP's weight too. Yes Eliminator and Volkl Cross can fit the bill too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTwoO Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Never got round to riding it at our carving camp, but the Kessler all mountain looked very scrumptious. Got to be a possibility... Although they are a little more expensive new... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aracan Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 i would get a coiler all mountian metal, it would cost about the same Really? I thought Bruce's boards would cost notably less (base price 840,- for a Coiler vs. 1.000,- for a Swoard EC). Don't know how much the difference in shipping cost would be, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GavinB Posted April 15, 2012 Report Share Posted April 15, 2012 Hi Randy I only saw and read this thread now..so replying to you a bit late. But here is my story: Prior to going to Aspen this February to the WCS (World Carving Session) with Joerg and the gang from Pureboarding ... I was riding a PRIOR 169cm 4WD, (Stiff) Head Pro Stratus Boots and TD3 Sidewinder Bindings and had been dreaming about learning to EC and getting a SWOARD. Once in Aspen, Joerg let my use a BASTARD 162 (I tried the 169 and it was a bit difficult for me) He also gave me a pair of (flexible) 27.5 Raichle Boots to use and his Bindings .... I now ride with the Back Boot in the WALK mode with very loose straps and the Front boot in the RIDE mode with not so tight straps. This helps you bend your knees and get down really low. I spent the next 13 days trying to keep up with the Pureboarding guys .... They used the Bastard & the Black Diamond mostly and I think I only saw a TWO on display at the Pureboarding Dinner. They did the Jumps in the Park, They did the Moguls, They did The Highlands Bowl, they rode in Soft Powder and Lay Down Flat on the Groomed Runs ... ALL with the same boards they were using every day ...no matter what they did / where they went / what conditions there were. NO QUIVER OF BOARDS NEEDED. That IS Joergs slogan ... SURF THE SNOW .... Same board for ALL conditions !!! I struggled to learn to EC with them as I was spending my time and all my effort just trying to keep up with them. I followed them places I had never been before and never thought I would go ... ie Hiking up Highlands Bowl and riding all the way down. I was too scared to go over the jumps witht them...but do want to learn that some day ...as I have fallen hard before going over an unexpected jump ... I switched back to my PRIOR for a day and was very happy to go back to my Borrowed BASTARD !! Bottom line ... I was not sure I would ever be able to learn to EC...no matter which board I had by the time I left Aspen ... But I ordered a 162 BASTARD from Joerg, I bought the Raichle Boots and their Bindings and back home I went. Once back home and practicing on my own ...things suddenly clicked ...as I was NOT racing to keep up with the rest of the Pureboarding Gang .... and I could practice slowly in my own time. I knew what I had to do ... I just had to keep practicing and practicing the skills and drills they showed me in Aspen. I honestly believe that Joergs gear, The Bastard, The Bindings and the (Flexible) Raichle Boots ...helped make it all possible for me to learn to EC. I know you wrote that EC is not your primary focus ...but it was and is mine... but The Bastard and the Black Diamond go anywhere ... and most of the Pureboarding crowd LOVE their Pureboarding Boards or wish they had one. I have never ridden a SWORD so cannot compare them. Personally I did NOT like the top sheet on the Black Diamond.... it is too GLOSSY BLACK for my liking.... I prefer MATT BLACK. I actually liked the Top Sheet on the TWO ...but then the Top Sheet on the BASTARD grew on me and now I really like it a lot. Needless to say ... it stands out on the Mountain and I get LOTS of comments on it and my set up now. I am in touch with Joerg ... so if there is anything I can help you with please let me know. I also know Dan in Canada and Ray on the East Coast who are VERY involved with Joerg and Pureboarding and they also know a million times more than me ... so I can put you in touch with them as well. Obviously coming out to the WCS and SES on the West Coast would be a great idea as you could get to demo all these boards .. and do some Clinics with the Pure Boarding guys and ride with them as much as you want. I actually want to help them set up some extra clinics for the newbies to EC and Pure Boarding ... as before they were more in the Ride and Keep Up If You Can mode !!! I'm sure I have left out some stuff ... so feel free to ask me anything if you have any other questions. Bottom line ... I LOVE my Bastard and it has changed snowboarding for me. I know people say it is NOT the BOARD but the RIDER ... But I am NOT a GREAT snowboarder and NEED ALL THE HELP I CAN GET from having the GEAR that makes it EASIEST for ME to do what I want to do. and the BASTARD did just that for ME !!! I ride ALL over Mount Hood in Oregon in ALL conditions with my Bastard now. I know they are also GREAT on ICE ...but I still need to learn to master that. The guys can lie down flat on the ICE when they are carving.... The Pureboarding boards are VERY versatile...that is for sure. BTW ...Don't ask me any TECHNICAL stuff ...as I have no interest in that. That you can ask Joerg, Dan or Ray ... I just ride and have fun. Gavin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GavinB Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 After wanting one for the past 4 years ....I just ordered my Swoard !!!!! My Gen4 SWOARD Extremecarver 168H will leave Europe tomorrow on it's long journey to Hood River, Oregon USA. I will get to ride it at Timberline on Mount Hood this summer. I will be going to ride with the SWOARD guys in Europe in January 2013 at BOTH these events: 12-13 January 2013: Peyragudes (Pyrenees, France) 26-27-28 January 2013: Zinal (Valais, Switzerland) - Main event - ECS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnaud Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 I will be going to ride with the SWOARD guys in Europe in January 2013 at BOTH these events: I will be very pleased to meet you during these events Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nils Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 On your way from Pyreneans to the alps, stop by in Lyon we'll drink a beer ! msg in advance! Nils Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GavinB Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 Hi Arnuad... Same here ... can't wait to meet all of you guys at the two events in Jan 2013. Hoping my SWOARD arrives this week ... but might only be next week !! Wish it was here today as I am going snowboarding tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GavinB Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 Hi Nils Would be great to meet you in Lyon. We will be spending a week in Versailles at my cousin between Peyragudes & Zinal. Not sure if we can make it to Lyon.... but can look into doing a day trip from Geneva ???Any chance of seeing you in Zinal rather??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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