Miguel Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 Last year I basically took a hiatus from the hardboot world and rode (about to perform sacrilege) softies. Basically my reasoning was that I found the alpine setup limiting my non groomed riding potential. I like going in the occasional bumps, trees etc. I know some seem to be able to do it all on their carving boards but I just found it too much work. Well...as you might expect...carving was in my soul and the softies just weren't getting it done. Reenter the Donek Incline. Just yesterday I busted out my step ins, hardboots and my old Donek Incline which has both ends rounded. I think I've found my marriage made in heaven. I was able to go anywhere on the mountain while still being able to lay down very sweet carves. I experimented with riding in walk mode which I found very relaxing. I believe combining hard boots with that boards really bridges the gap between the two riding worlds. In fact the Incline is very similar to the Axess on Doneks stiffness index. In any event it's good to be back. I also have a Coiler AM and Donek FC which I'll save for special days. I do have a question. Which hardboots are the absolute softest/flexy? (reasonably past and present) I currently use Raichle 224s. Any other Incline riders out there and do you agree? Miguel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gecko Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 probably Raichle 413's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crucible Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 The softest hardboots for alpine riding that I have found are actually alpine touring ski boots- boots like the Dynafit Zzero and Scarpa Spirit 3 and Spirit 4 are worth looking at for hardboot freeriding. I use very old Raichle 121 Corcordias and Intuition liners for both ski-touring and freeriding off piste- it saves me from having to buy two pairs of boots. Geo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Donnelly Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 Nordica SBH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Dahl Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 I've ridden SB224's, SB123's, Rossi ski boots, Dynaitf TLT4's, Airwalk softies and Switch Flexable Axel's, K2 Clickers, some others that escape me as of now...I vote for the SB123's as being better, by a small margin, than the Dynafit"s. Why? They flex better both in forward flex and lateral flex, because they are designed to. I use my Dynafit boots exclusively backcountry, and some on-piste, but will use the SB123's on a freeride board almost exclusively on-piste from now on. SB413's would probably be a bit more modern choice, or the low end Track series. Add into the mix the BTS with the softest springs and you'd be set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utahcarver Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 As far as Pat's recommendation of the Nordica SBH's, I'll second the recommendation. Unless he knows something I don't, good luck finding a pair. I own both the 123's and 413's. 123's have BTS yellow springs and the 413's have the blue springs. The 123's are a very soft flex. I've never experienced shin bang or any discomfort with this 3 buckle boot. I use a Booster strap on the top cuff. The 413's are stiffer but, still soft by comparison to other boots in the Raichle/Deeluxe lineup. I use both boots in powder and on groomers in Western snow conditions. I would think that either pair of these boots would go very well with your Incline. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0ardski Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 123's & 124 3 buckle with thremoflex liners kicks a$$ on any lace up system you could ever create. way beats the SBH for even flex range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted January 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Thanks for the suggestions....one more question. Do they all accept the Intec heel? I use older Bomber stepins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b0ardski Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 The nordica sbh, raichle concodias, are based on ski touring boots like the dynafit & not intec compatable. These boots are meant for back country hiking and have vibram or other traction soles, and work with approach skis & crampons as well as standard plate bindings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Dahl Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 SB123's and up should all accept the Intec Heels, but the older boots will require drilling the cable hole, which should be marked for that from the factory. SB121's, and any ski boot will not be compatable for the stepin system, but will work in std. plates, for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackDan Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Miguel, I'n glad you've found a way to ride off piste with your hardboot rig. I think I use 413s and previously had 224s. Never really thought about buying a boot that was softer, just was cheap at the time. I'm not sure how much the boot as to do with my riding ability off piste, but I'm happy with what I have and will go anywhere on a mountain with my boards. I ride with the cant locks in off or on depending on the conditions and how loose I feel for the day. Sometimes I ride locked, but more upright, say if its snowing, but not much accumulation, and the conditions are similar on and off piste. I'm sure you will find the right times to use both to your advantage, and its nice because you can just reach down and flip the level and change mode. Definitely riding in deep powder, you'll want to be un locked to get the flexibility in the upper boot. good luck in your riding and I'll wave as I pass you by, heading down Scott Chute or through the trees up on top of Heavenly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 I have the 224s as well, they're pretty darn soft. Do you feel the need to go softer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bumpyride Posted January 25, 2009 Report Share Posted January 25, 2009 Raichle 123's again. Ugly but comfortable and is pretty much the ideal off-piste/terrain boot. Walks easily and rides well in the Walk/mode if you're not too big. Have intec heels on all my 123's easily installed with a drill to enlarge the holes for the T-nuts. I have one pair that I have used continuously for 14 years and bought them used. Bought 2 other pair for backup and for the other home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted January 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I have the 224s as well, they're pretty darn soft. Do you feel the need to go softer? That's a good question. I really don't know if there's a significant difference between the 224s and the 123s. Anyone know? When I started riding hardboots I had an old pair of Raichles with the golf ball dimples...white with some other day gloish accent colors. I think they were three strappers with maybe a power strap..not sure of the model nember or age. I bought them used...shoulda kept tnem. That was meny years ago. Basically I was looking for something lighter and easier to walk around in. BTW..I'm putting my softies on my Prior powder board....like we get a lot of that in upstate NY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Posted January 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 Miguel,I'n glad you've found a way to ride off piste with your hardboot rig. I think I use 413s and previously had 224s. Never really thought about buying a boot that was softer, just was cheap at the time. I'm not sure how much the boot as to do with my riding ability off piste, but I'm happy with what I have and will go anywhere on a mountain with my boards. I ride with the cant locks in off or on depending on the conditions and how loose I feel for the day. Sometimes I ride locked, but more upright, say if its snowing, but not much accumulation, and the conditions are similar on and off piste. I'm sure you will find the right times to use both to your advantage, and its nice because you can just reach down and flip the level and change mode. Definitely riding in deep powder, you'll want to be un locked to get the flexibility in the upper boot. good luck in your riding and I'll wave as I pass you by, heading down Scott Chute or through the trees up on top of Heavenly. Yeah...I often ride with the knob turned turned to the side but with the other thingy in the walk mode. It allows you to flex all the way down but only to the third position coming back up. That seems to work best for me. But frankly I don't really notice all that much difference even when it's on full walk mode. I may take out my Coiler AM tomorrow and will probably have it locked and loaded for that. I'll be experimenting. Can't believe it....over twenty years and still experimenting with my freaking boots...is that unreal or what? What do they say...it's the journey...not the destination. Yeah....that's it!;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateW Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 I do have a question. Which hardboots are the absolute softest/flexy? (reasonably past and present) I currently use Raichle 224s. Any other Incline riders out there and do you agree? I have 124s and 324s, and they're pretty similar in flex, probably the same as your 224s. I've tried AF600s (now called Indy, and for a while called Suzuka, I think) and they were stiffer. I am pretty sure that the current Track 325 (for a while, "Le Mans") is from the same mold as the 124/224/324/325/etc, but the 325 is stiffer than the X24s. And has nicer buckles on the latest model. In short, I don't think you're likely to find anything softer from Raichle/Deeluxe. UPZ's boots are much stiffer. If you want flexy boots, don't go there. :) I kinda think of myself as a freeride person who also loves carving... I rode a couple of stiff freeride boards for a few years before going to a 23cm twin-tip custom, and then a 21cm Coiler AM, and eventually ended up on a custom 19cm-wide Axxess. Each time I went narrower I expected to lose a bit of versatility but it never happened, I just liked it better. A narrow waist feels pretty light underfoot, especially edge-to-edge, which makes it nice and agile in the bumps. (I did ride a 17cm board for a season and it felt just a little weird riding moguls, like I couldn't rotate my upper vs. lower body quite enough.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NateW Posted January 26, 2009 Report Share Posted January 26, 2009 Can't believe it....over twenty years and still experimenting with my freaking boots...is that unreal or what? I never liked walk mode, but I think it took about ten years before I finally decided that I prefer #4 over #3 on Raichle's 5-step forward lean adjuster. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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