Zone Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 OK, here's a silly question, esp. for a carving forum. How do you go straight? The board tends to wander/wobble a bit when going straight down the hill. I'm not sure where to put my weight and am always afraid it's going to catch an edge. Do you put the board completely flat or are you riding a little on edge? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yyzcanuck Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Doc, one thing that might make the board feel that way to you is the taper. More taper, less catching of the tail. For me, If I intend to go straight (to catch up to someone), I ride the tail of the board (completely flat) and lift the nose slightly off the snow. Just squat and lean back with nearly all your weight on the rear leg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nekdut Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Do you have any base bevel? A half to one degree helps a lot going straight, but for really flat cat tracks I am usually riding an edge very slightly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 On edge is safest, but if you want to ride a flat base the trick is to stay loose. This is especially useful on long flat cattracks where you don't want to give up any speed - just try to stay completely neutral and loose on the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zone Posted January 24, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 For me, If I intend to go straight (to catch up to someone), I ride the tail of the board (completely flat) and lift the nose slightly off the snow. Just squat and lean back with nearly all your weight on the rear leg. Thanks. I always wondered how those park monkeys bomb straight down the hill on the tail of their boards (and can't stop for carvers but that's another thread). Will try that and stay loose. No base bevel, as I like the EC stuff and need all the edges I can get. :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crucible Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Ride the tail and keep your knees loose and flexed - another point is to look FAR ahead of you to anticipate terrain and obstacles, this is especially important on cat tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pebu Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 I guess what I've always done is just alternate between edges. Not really turning, but weight my toe edge and then when it starts to go a little squirrly switch edges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 I don't weight the tail particularily. I just stay neutral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexeyga Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Back in the days when I was trying to figure-out the skidding thing on softies, I saw a hardbooter straight-lining in order to get to a wider part of the run i guess... anyways, one thing i've noticed, he was holding his hands behind his back... That looked really odd, kind of a penguin skiing... but when i got on hardboots, i've picked up the same habit... turns out it really helps on straight shots... Keeps me facing forward, relaxed and balanced.. IMHO... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Thanks. I always wondered how those park monkeys bomb straight down the hill on the tail of their boards (and can't stop for carvers but that's another thread).Will try that and stay loose. No base bevel, as I like the EC stuff and need all the edges I can get. :o Park riders can often do that because their nose/tail edges are detuned quite a bit and they have a lot of base bevel. I was on the EC website recently and noticed they recommend a 1 degree base bevel as well. In order to maximize the lifespan of the edges, we recommend sharpening your edges to 90 degrees. If you wish to increase the stability of the board when it is riding flat on the base, a negative one (-1) degree can be applied to the base edge and 89 ° to the side edge. We do not recommend sharpening your edges to 88 degrees or less, as this reduces the edges' lifespan.BTW, are you sure riding with more angle in the backfoot is a great idea? I noticed on your profile that you ride 50/55. I mean if you broken your legs or something that has it off-angle that might make sense, but from my understanding you compensate for bowlegged-ness with footbeds, boot cant, and finally outward binding cant (those are the things I have done and they seem to work). However, if it works for you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willywhit Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 How do you go straight? forward...never straight :rolleyes: http://www.fnsp.com/ :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex1230 Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 that's an old school binding setup. when I was racing in the late 80's/early '90s a lot of people rode those angles. but 5 degrees is a little extreme. puts alot of stress on your knees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dano Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Thith wath NOT a thtraight ethtablishment!!! Oh THNAP!!! You THILLY GOOTHETH!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex1230 Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 I was wondering how long that would take... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skategoat Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Back in the days when I was trying to figure-out the skidding thing on softies, I saw a hardbooter straight-lining in order to get to a wider part of the run i guess... anyways, one thing i've noticed, he was holding his hands behind his back... That looked really odd, kind of a penguin skiing... but when i got on hardboots, i've picked up the same habit... turns out it really helps on straight shots... Keeps me facing forward, relaxed and balanced.. IMHO... I do it all the time while skiing and boarding. There was a time in the 70s/80s when a few downhill ski racers experimented with the hands behind the back position while tucking. I believe in a wind tunnel, it's more aerodynamic. Or maybe they just thought that back then. It never caught on obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinecure Posted January 24, 2007 Report Share Posted January 24, 2007 Careful with the hands behind the back method. I find I'm much less stable that way when going straight, although I do it sometimes for fun. Base bevel helps. So does a longer board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Dold Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Doug Dryer showed me that you could ride straight by weighting the tail, and it worked amazingly well. It seems easier with binding angles around 60 degrees, and on a longer board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Find out what it feels like to be totally neutral on the board. While in a flat spot, get in a position that allows you to put even pressure on the balls and heels of both feet. In other words, 25% on front foot ball, 25% on front foot heel, 25% on rear foot ball, 25% on rear foot heel. I think it was Sickmove who called this "Four on the Floor". You achieve this by being in a very neutral position over your bindings - lined up feet, knees, hips, shoulders. Stay moderately flexed. Then, head down a slope like this with your head turned in the direction of travel. Voila! You can ride straight down the slope. You will also be able to adjust to any trail inconsistancies or accidental edge hookups because you are in a neutral position. This "Four on the Floor" position is useful for a lot of things in snowboarding. Specifically, I teach it a lot for 50/50's and boardslides. It is also useful for a lot of turning drills and halfpipe riding. It is funny reading all of the suggestions in this thread. Think about this: If you were to take a snowboard and whip it nose first across the slope, what would it end up doing? It would start to travel across the slope, but then it would follow it's sidecut until it was heading straight down the trail. It would go down the trail perfectly straight - right down the fall line. So why wouldn't it do the same with a rider on it? The answer is that we are putting input into the edges when we don't want to. Softbooters tend to do this because when they straight line it, they face the nose too much. Some hardbooters will do the same, but hardbooters also tend to have cant and lift that is not biomechanically correct (yeah, but that is what so and so on Bomber told me to ride ;) ). If you cannot do the "Four on the Floor" listed above in a flat area (or carpet surfing), then you are probably not set up on your board well, either because of body positioning, or poor binding setup. Lastly, here is a cool drill - do just what I said about the board - carve until you are perpendicular to the fall line, and then do the "Four on the Floor" and hold it. Most people think that you will catch an edge. In reality, the board will seek the fall line and you will end up going through a 90 degree arc and going straight down the hill. <!-- / message --><!-- sig --> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zone Posted January 25, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Wow straight is not straight forward. I'll just have to get it out of the closet, get on all four, relax with knee bent, arms behind my back and watch my behind... :lol: Seriously, great suggestions. Will try them all. The little local hill has a steep top section and a long flat section at the bottom to the lift, hence the initial question. As for the funny feet angles, I tried on several occasion more conventional angles and my knees just kill after a few runs. But then again, unconventional is OK by me as long as it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Dold Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 Phil is right on about the board wanting to go straight on its own. I once witnessed a Donek Axis go down the hill, sans rider, and it didn't wiggle, turn, tumble or anything, it just went perfectly straight and true. I think it got up to about 60 or 70 miles per hour before it ran into a tree. I'm not saying whose board it was :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullwings Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 This is coming from a former straight liner... The weighting the tail does it all for me. It makes it almost impossible to catch an edge when you weight the tail. I discovered this while riding pow since i wanted to keep the nose on top of the snow, i weighted the tail and tried to pull the nose on the board up. It's actually the reason I turned into a straight liner. I found that riding the tail the whole time made going straight easy, without the risk of catching an edge. (base turned grey in the middle of the tail) Then, beginning of last year, i came here and started reading. straight liner kook syndrome cured. on cat tracks and on the flats, weighting the tail is still what i do. i pretty much tuck and crouch into a full "skier-looking" kind of tuck and really pick up speed that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 You will also be able to adjust to any trail inconsistancies or accidental edge hookups because you are in a neutral position.Thanks for explaining it better than I did, Phil. Another way to think of it is a little bit like riding a drag lift - if you try to control it too much, you might catch an edge or start tracking here or there. But if you just stay neutral and loose, and don't let any little bumps startle you into stiffening up, you'll just slide along the path no trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yyzcanuck Posted January 25, 2007 Report Share Posted January 25, 2007 ...it would follow it's sidecut... No way, no how. All my boards have camber and the sidecut does NOT touch the snow without my weight on the board. If you let the board free run across, down, or up the slope it's not the sidecut radius that is redirecting it. The board begins to follow the fall line due to gravity. I do agree that rider input to the edge is what causes the wiggle but all these funny ideas, on how to go straight, perform the same function... REDUCING RIDER INPUT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 No way, no how. All my boards have camber and the sidecut does NOT touch the snow without my weight on the board. Wow, your conditions must suck if your camber is higher than your snow. Listen, before calling my theories bunk, go out and try it with said high camber boards. When you see the track in the snow, let me know what it looks like. After you have proved me wrong, we'll talk. all these funny ideas, on how to go straight, perform the same function... REDUCING RIDER INPUT. Really? I ride the tail of the board (completely flat) and lift the nose slightly off the snow. Just squat and lean back with nearly all your weight on the rear leg. That does not sound like reducing rider input, it sounds like more input, more work, and can be fatiguing. Why do all of that when all you really have to do is stay neutral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Dold Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 Why do all of that when all you really have to do is stay neutral.Good point, but some of us aren't too good at staying neutral :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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