barryj Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 Just curious how UPM fell out of favor and what's better and why. Having UPM option for a Donek AF plate (Thanks Jack!) on my K168 took an already Wow! board to Holy Crap! level of performance and not to mention how a plate really adds noticable cushion for old knees! I can ride all day through chop, crud, ice with the plate.....otherwise would only of lasted a couple of hours without it. .........I'm thinking of a new board, so what's the better plate mounting option these days and which plates do what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) Because World Cup and high level racing is the primary market for plates by a large margin, and nobody and I mean nobody is using UPM on the World Cup. Nor is anyone who takes their racing seriously. Allflex plates work far better for racing than any UPM plate. Of all the plates I've tried I would say the Donek AF and Allflex Spring Plate had the most impressive edge hold on ice on tight turning boards. However the Allflex is heavy and a lot of work, non-athletes need not apply. The AF is rather tall. The Apex was the most "well rounded", being lowest, lightest, sexiest, and pretty effective. But I can see why nobody races on them after trying Allflex. Frankly I think for my freecarving purposes, I've come to the conclusion that plates are not worth the weight and height, and that you can replace them with better technique. They made me realize I was twisting the board with my feet, and was too much in the back seat on toeside - not weighting my front foot toes enough in the first part of the carve. If you are getting a custom board made, you could request more torsional reinforcement between the feet to get some of the benefits of a plate. That really worked well for me on my Winterstick. Edit - all that said, I would like to try a Donek AF again on something like a Kessler 168, as the brief time I spent with one was pretty darn eye-popping. Edited January 6, 2022 by Jack M 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) Im confused, Vist? Allflex? UPM?... I have a Kessler , WTF do I get... what fits? What's your recommendation if I finally do get and want to try one...what should I put on it? the option list keeps growing if you take into the Asian market...and now obtainable... Just would want one if it truly does help on our ice out here... ps... btw its sure is hard to consider one when the cost will be more than what I paid for the board... ...they are ridicouluoualslsous expensive... Edited January 6, 2022 by Shred Gruumer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 @Shred Gruumer, If you have UPM inserts, get the Donek AF or Apex X-plate. AF has better edge hold on ice, Apex is lower and sexier. If you have Allflex inserts, I think the Allflex spring plate is more than you want to spend and more weight than you want to deal with. I also tried my Allflex non-spring plate on my K168 and F2 Proto 163 and personally I hated it. Just did not let the board carve, at least not with me on it. You could look for a used Apex X-plate with Allflex mounts... I have one I will sell... If you only have 4x4 inserts, or don't want to spend much, Vist Snowplate 17 is the best bang for the buck at 295 Euros. Apex X-plate is also a lighter/lower option with 4x4 mounts. @Termin8tor is selling one. I wouldn't bother with the Donek AF since the 4x4 version just uses an adapter that adds height and weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Jack M said: K168 and F2 Proto 163 and personally I hated it. That's all I needed to know... Both of which I have... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapos Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) Not sure whats the issue with the allflex on @Jack Mboards - why it wouldnt let you carve? mind you there is a third option for allflex insert pattern - Sinline and so far it has been working great for me with stellar hold that doesnt sacrifice the feel of the snow, like it did with Apex X plate. Dont get me wrong Apex X rode really good, but I just didnt like the detached feeling. I mainly ride man made snow/ice so plates come in really handy even though I am just a carver not a racer. Edited January 6, 2022 by slapos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted January 6, 2022 Report Share Posted January 6, 2022 3 hours ago, slapos said: Not sure whats the issue with the allflex on @Jack Mboards - why it wouldnt let you carve? I'm talking about an Allflex GS longitudinal cut "soft" plate - solid top, no springs, no H cut outs. I love it on my GS board. But on my SL and 168 it just didn't let the board bend enough. YMMV The Allflex Spring Plate worked fabulously on my SL, it's just very heavy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted January 7, 2022 Report Share Posted January 7, 2022 3 hours ago, slapos said: but I just didnt like the detached feeling. That's what always got me when I tried one... Slow going on trails sucked major arse juice 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLN Posted January 7, 2022 Report Share Posted January 7, 2022 How does Apex work for free carving? I'm aware that all the racers use it, but does it work in less than perfect conditions? I remember reading about snow/ice getting underneath the plate and etc. That's not the case with UPM plates obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapos Posted January 7, 2022 Report Share Posted January 7, 2022 10 hours ago, Jack M said: I'm talking about an Allflex GS longitudinal cut "soft" plate - solid, no springs, no H cut outs. I love it on my GS board. But on my SL and 168 it just didn't let the board bend enough. YMMV The Allflex Spring Plate worked fabulously on my SL, it's just very heavy. That's crazy. I had the same exact plate with soft stiffness too. Rode it on oxess 164 medium and nobile 166 with ptex and I couldn't complain how they had worked. Oxess https://youtu.be/k8IPo9oogeg Nobile https://youtube.com/shorts/psayEi5KM58?feature=share Also the weight didn't seem so much of a problem for carving. For sliding and holding in your hand maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowrider Posted January 7, 2022 Report Share Posted January 7, 2022 Barryj Bomber boiler plate lite will serve you well since you are not caught up in the mind set of racing. It is not the current bling but it will make your knees very happy. The sport will be dead along with the current generation of riders very soon so consider this your opportunity to secure a piece of snowboarding history as I am pretty confident any boiler plates out there are the last ones to ever exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryj Posted January 7, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 hour ago, lowrider said: Barryj Bomber boiler plate lite Yeah BP's are great for the money. I had a V2 Lite UPM which was very good but found a Donek AF UPM even better......and Soooo much cheaper the newer options. The Apex X is the over $1200 I belive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted January 10, 2022 Report Share Posted January 10, 2022 A major difference between AllFlex mount pattern plates and UPM mount plates is the inter axle distance. AllFlex is significantly longer so that the board twist/torsion +/- flex control created by the AllFlex plate is produced over a greater length of edge. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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