bobdea Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 any update to info on these beasts 1) will I need longer screws? 2) wasn't there supposed to be a email that they were gonna send out? 3) graphics? 4) will I start slinging crack to get the cash to go to Argentina to ride this thing? hope I am not annoying anyone by posting yet another thread about these boards I just feel a little in the dark here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 I didn't get the newsletter either until I asked for it, even though I had already purchased a 170. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted May 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 robertedea@earthlink.net thats strange I bought a 170 as well and they have not sent me a thing thanks guys for the help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Sub Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 Originally posted by Jim Callen You didn't get the latest e-mail regarding voting for the graphic or the refer-a-friend system? I'd e-mail it to you, but I can't figure out how to forward it via the bomber e-mail system. What's your address? I didnt either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 I didn't buy a Madd, but just got an email. Well, a bit strange here. But may be he wants me to buy a Madd because the sellingfigures aren't that what they expected till now. So prices are still low. Greets, Hans. (some quotes out of the latest Maddemail) Refer a Friend and Save on your new or existing Madd Snowboard. When you let your friends know about the advantages of riding a Madd Snowboard, you earn credit towards your own Madd Snowboard. For each friend who signs up (through July 31st), you receive a $50 credit that will be applied to your order. When your friend makes the $100 deposit, your referral credit information will appear on the order and will be credited to your balance. Simply reply to this email with your friends' names and email addresses or have your friend access us through www.maddmikes.com and have them mention your name. We'll send out a letter similar to what you originally received, with the description of the Madd 158 and 170. We still have people trying to get in on the pro-form deal. As we hoped we would have sold a few more boards, we are doing one last push. Pricing schedule for Madd Snowboards is as follows for order received by: May 31st - $550, June 30th - $600, July 31st - $700, August - $800 MFSR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike T Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 ... just click the "snowboard info" link @ www.maddmikes.com and ask.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 Originally posted by Hans I didn't buy a Madd, but just got an email. Well, a bit strange here. But may be he wants me to buy a Madd because the sellingfigures aren't that what they expected till now. So prices are still low. May 31st - $550, June 30th - $600, July 31st - $700, August - $800 MFSR Because they are selling the boards so cheaply... my guess the only way they can hope to make a profit over the one-time overhead production fees is to increase their product volume. Had they sold all the boards at $800, I think they would be sitting pretty. Ofcourse, I'm not in the manufacturing industry - but I think the reasoning makes sense. Personally, I think it was a questionable idea to offer the boards at $500 and then slowly ramp up the price $300 to $800, because no one is going to pay $800, they would rather just wait and *hope* that it will drop down to $500 again. Would have been better to do like $650 and $750. But again, that's just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted May 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 I am subscribed now hopefully they can get them to the european market it seems that between more people in the sport there and that they are more willing to pay a insane price for gear I think that its a more profitable market for Madd but thats not fact its just a asumption based on what little I know about that market Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 Originally posted by bobdea I am subscribed now hopefully they can get them to the european market it seems that between more people in the sport there and that they are more willing to pay a insane price for gear I think that its a more profitable market for Madd Aren't they having them built them in Europe? I remember someone mentioning Italy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 11, 2004 Report Share Posted May 11, 2004 Originally posted by Jim Callen Has anyone ever read that article about Madd written back in the 90's about what they need to do to suceed in the snowboard market? I found it rather interesting. You mean the business case study written about them? This one was written in 2001. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 You know, we've been enjoying some artificially low prices for a long time now. Equipment in the ski industry comparable to Madd, Donek, Prior, Coiler, Bomber, Catek, etc costs at least $800. Very easy to drop more than a grand on skis and bindings. -Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdboytyler Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Originally posted by Jack Michaud You know, we've been enjoying some artificially low prices for a long time now. What's your reasoning for the prices being artificially low, other than the comparision to skis? I think the comparison between skiis and snowboard price is that skiers are dumb enough to pay the artificially high ski prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirk Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Any one know where the Madd people, Shaggy and Cheri, are? (sorry, had to use the expression) Out of town perhaps? I've e-mailed 'em twice in the past week for the most recent update and haven't received any response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Originally posted by gdboytyler What's your reasoning for the prices being artificially low, other than the comparision to skis? I think the comparison between skiis and snowboard price is that skiers are dumb enough to pay the artificially high ski prices. My question is what is the main cost involved in producing skis/snowboards. Is it the materials? Or is it the machinery? Or the labor? If it's the materials, then the snowboard ought to be more expensive. If it's the machinery then they ought to cost roughly the same. My guess that it's the labor (for handcrafted equipment)... meaning that skis are more expensive since making a pair of skis would be roughly equivalent to making two snowboards... so it would seem to make sense that high end skis cost a little less than double that of a high end snowboard. Other equipment thoughts: For bindings, I'm no expert... but I sense that it's much harder to make a binding that hold well most of the time, but still can release when needed. That much require some complicated mechanics compare the super solid, highly designed for performance, but fundamentally simple design for regular plate bindings and even Intec step ins. Finally... from what I've heard, alpine boots are a generation or two behind the latest ski boots. And so it's not surprising that they are cheaper... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Originally posted by gdboytyler What's your reasoning for the prices being artificially low, other than the comparision to skis? I think the comparison between skiis and snowboard price is that skiers are dumb enough to pay the artificially high ski prices. I could go into detail but I probably shouldn't. Suffice it to say that at the end of the day, our beloved boutique manufacturers are not compensating themselves appropriately, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Originally posted by Jack Michaud I could go into detail but I probably shouldn't. Suffice it to say that at the end of the day, our beloved boutique manufacturers are not compensating themselves appropriately, imo. While I agree that prices are lower than what they could be, and that the fine manufacturers who produce alpine equipment deserve to earn a good living off of their work. From my point of view (I don't have a innate knowledge of the industry). I believe the low prices are mostly due to market realities and not altrustic sacirfice "for the sake of alpine snowboarding." Coiler is perhaps one of the few companies where this is definitely true. Bruce makes custom boards for cheaper than regular stock boards. Aside from that, I think most of the Snowboard prices are set to be competitive with larger alpine snowboard manufacturers (mainly European companies like F2 and Volkl) and with each other. In general they are smaller companies and have less brand recognition and hence need to price their goods competitively to compete. If you disagree with that, just look at Madd snowboard... which arguably have a superior board... yet no one here would pay $800 for the boards, heck... barely 25 people got the board with whopping ~40% discount. The problem is that there are not enough alpine riders... and maybe (my thought) the common perspective that it's better to have 2-3 affordable good boards than one expensive, great board. Catek and Bomber *have* managed to distinguish themselves as well known, high quality products, especially since Burton has dropped out of the market and there are few European brands that sell bindings readily available... hence they are able to sell their goods at a more comfortable profitable margins and volumes. I don't thnk it's a concidence that the two bindings are priced exactly the same (yet noticeably higher than other brands of bindings). I mean I can't see Bomber as being in trouble if they continually sell out of their production runs selling stuff at full price. I mean maybe they aren't making a fortune off of it, but I think it affords Fin a somewhat comfortable lifestyle. So the low prices in my mind are really a reflection of low interest... maybe as the snowboarding populace enters middle age, we'll see more of renaissance of alpine riding (there are indicators that this is already starting). Again, I have no special knowledge of the alpine industry... this is just what I think things are going based on what I see. Here's to a bright future though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdboytyler Posted May 12, 2004 Report Share Posted May 12, 2004 Originally posted by Jack Michaud I could go into detail but I probably shouldn't. Suffice it to say that at the end of the day, our beloved boutique manufacturers are not compensating themselves appropriately, imo. That's an admirable thought. You should follow through and include a 15% tip on your next board purchase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted May 13, 2004 Report Share Posted May 13, 2004 Originally posted by gdboytyler That's an admirable thought. You should follow through and include a 15% tip on your next board purchase. One step ahead of ya, Ty. I could have gotten a bit more of a "deal" on a Madd for my efforts here and with the ECES, but I offered to pay the normal price because I wanted to help make sure the production run happened, and, they're worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Gilmour Posted May 13, 2004 Report Share Posted May 13, 2004 The business case study is a Houghton Mifflin text on strategic management. Ironically the students who emailed me over the years might be interested to see what actually happened. I an friends with the BU prof. who helped get this case study into the book- my hope was that it might attract financing. Labor is a big cost of the board...as is the cost of the particular resin. When it comes to craftsmanship- and subtle nuance- the Italians have it hands down. We could likely never maintain the quality if we were to produce them in China- unless we had some insane QC guy down there. Ultimately , snowboarding is addictive- and so is a board that lets you ride at a higher level. Drug dealers often discount their first sales to new customers. But in our case...this drug is actually good for you. ________ Mitsubishi Galant Lambda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted May 13, 2004 Report Share Posted May 13, 2004 Originally posted by John Gilmour Labor is a big cost of the board...as is the cost of the particular resin. When it comes to craftsmanship- and subtle nuance- the Italians have it hands down. We could likely never maintain the quality if we were to produce them in China- unless we had some insane QC guy down there. Ultimately , snowboarding is addictive- and so is a board that lets you ride at a higher level. Drug dealers often discount their first sales to new customers. But in our case...this drug is actually good for you. That was your fatal flaw! You made your boards too good and too durable... you need to design in a "timed death" feature in which the board shuts down after 2 years... making people buy a "replacement" in shorter and shorter time spans! So my thought was that for "larger" (I'm using the term relatively) companies that already have their customer "hooked" like Bomber and Catek should split their focus between continually improving their product and finding ways to streamline their production operation to reduce costs WHILE maintaining an extremely high level of quality. Unike designing a high quality object... these tasks are less exciting business objectives - but the extra money save could be put into more R&D... creating a better product (endless cycle). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted May 13, 2004 Report Share Posted May 13, 2004 Hmmm. sounds like what we are doing! Can you say Lean! Kaizen! Kanban! Continous improvement. And then pass the savings onto the customer and demand a 10% reduction over the next 3 years! Thats what we have to do just to get the business and keep it! its where its going. But the Recreation business or any thing thats fun doesn't apply! :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted May 14, 2004 Report Share Posted May 14, 2004 I say that prices for alpine gear are artificially low because they are based on the prices for mass-produced softboot/freeride/freestyle gear. That's what people have come to expect to pay for "a snowboard" or "snowboard bindings". This link is imaginary. The boards and bindings we ride are in a whole other league. Even Burton is making $350 bindings, and guess what, they're still just 2-strap softboot bindings that can't carve. Five of their ten bindings are $250 or more. The sixth is $200, and you wouldn't even want to ride it. I'm not saying that I think it would be fair if all prices were pegged to the ski industry tomorrow. And I'll be interested to see if Madd can pull off the $800 mark. I think there needs to be a happy medium between a ski industry price point and a Burton industry price point, but it's obvious to me that right now, the boutique alpine snowboard industry is well on the low side of that, and it doesn't need to be. -Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Gruumer Posted May 14, 2004 Report Share Posted May 14, 2004 Yep! right on the money with the one piece concept..its an intresting drill when you demonstrate it to a company,,,and they go.. huh? wow! how did that happen? Yea,, we are up to our necks in it here! Passion,, a good thing to have! yep... I thank the stars ..cause im thinking that day will come.. But in the "Gladiator" "Not yet" ............"Not Yet" http://www.parker.com/ Bob you might want to watch the commercials for the Engineers! Yes! one of the few who love my job! Right Said Shred:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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