Furi Posted February 25, 2008 Report Share Posted February 25, 2008 Good story, Boris!(BTW, I have nothing against long hair on men, and in my view, long hair in itself does not a hippie make. Maybe the latter has become to vague a term to be useful.) Smoking anything in a confined space with other people is up there with talking on your cellphone in the elevator or smacking your gum. I think there should be manners police, armed with cattle prods. It's just the broken-windows theory taken a logical step further. totally agreed! Sadly enough I probably fall into the category of needing to be cattle prodded :( Normally try to stick to email when on the hill, but sometimes I have to use my cell phone. And often times I can't finish my cell-phone convo in the lift line (which I guess is also considered confined space) so it spills over on the lift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queequeg Posted February 25, 2008 Report Share Posted February 25, 2008 This sounds like the threads I see on cycling forums about out of shape guys riding expensive bikes. Seriously. I'm not by any stretch a serious bicyclist, but I do ride one in the summer and am frequently awed at the fat slobs I see riding around central park in their $5000+ dollar carbon-fiber, aerospoked tri-bikes clad head-to-foot in spandex. I always feel like riding up along side them and asking them when burger-king started putting bike lanes in the drive through ... but I usually just blow by them in my single-speed track bike, wearing my baggy shorts and a messenger bag. I'm not really a mean spirited person, but it really frustrates me to see how our culture has evolved to confuse buying the equipment with participating in the sport. I'm in the NYC snowboarding group on meetup.com. It has something like 1200 members, and probably only about 25 of those members that actually snowboard more than once a season - but I guarantee you that nearly every single one of those 1200 would refer to themselves as snowboarder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Bell Posted February 25, 2008 Report Share Posted February 25, 2008 totally agreed! Sadly enough I probably fall into the category of needing to be cattle prodded :( Normally try to stick to email when on the hill, but sometimes I have to use my cell phone. And often times I can't finish my cell-phone convo in the lift line (which I guess is also considered confined space) so it spills over on the lift. Actually, I think it's totally OK when you're outdoors. I also think a lot of it has to do with how loud the person is talking and for how long. If someone's phone rings in the elevator, and it's a quick and hushed chat to coordinate with someone about where to meet, etc., then that's cool. But loud, blabby "Like, oh my GOD! I was, like, whatever!" conversations--yeah, that's when I wanna buy one of those illegal cellphone jammers. But I'm guilty myself of a quick call from the lift. To talk about my digestive problems, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave ESPI Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 Kinda cool knowing the year I was born, Snowboarding was also :lurk:1976 W00t! Ok, some "Ugly" I heard earlier this week at a Dunkin Doughnuts..... Clerk: "So how is the mountain ?" Asshat: " Was OK, but all those snowboarders scraped all the snow off and made huge piles everywhere". Clerk: "ha yeah; thoses darn Snowboarders........." (rolls eyes) The guy leaves, and Paragon comes out and tells me this as I'm waiting in the car. I wanted to get out of the car and go punch the asshat and tell him that SKIERS are the ones who make mogul piles...... Snowboarders FLATTEN THEM OUT ! sheesh, if you are going to bitch, atleast get it straight ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skatha Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 I took my kids to Disneyland a few years ago and had hoped to visit my aunt in Malibu. She wasn't home that week, but we stayed in a campground in town anyway. One afternoon we decided to head to the beach. I was sitting on the beach, watching my kids and the legions of wetsuited surfers waiting on their boards for promising swells. I watched this older guy show up, old board, pair of trunks.....He talked to the lifeguard a little while and then ran out into the surf. He nailed every swell that turned into a breaker-in fact, I saw him ride in 3 times as often as the high-tech "dudes" out there in the wetsuits (surf temp is about 50 degrees in Malibu, or so it seems). After about 45 minutes he was done and he left. He was definitely a level 7 guy... But, speaking as an amateur astronomer, the easiest thing to do is buy gear. In fact, we call it "aperture fever" when you want to buy the biggest light bucket you can. Astonomy can be frustrating, too. Not every night is perfect for viewing and you can't stay up every night. I used to hate perfect Tuesday nights in March, for example...because of the range of deep sky targets available and the relative clarity of the skies and the fact I had to go to work the next day. So buying gear can be the next big thing to actually doing it. As for bicycling, I've seen these overweight spandex clad guys on $5000 cycles kill it on century rides so I never criticize them. Drinking beer post ride is part of the road cycling culture as well as the running culture and there's people out there than are fat and in shape and don't care about the fat part. I've been riding bikes on road rides for about 20 years now. Snowboarding and skateboarding have a huge "poser" contribution to the crowd of self described participants, but to say you have to be somewhat an expert to call yourself one is unfair. If you ride, you are a rider. I don't care if you suck because, quite frankly, I suck. I live in TX and have a family and a job. I'm probably not going to go anywhere this year because of the job so I don't get to ride that often (and now, not at all) but I have had afternoons when I didn't suck and I had fun and it was golden. Way in the back of my closet, I still have my last snowboard I purchased-a Donek. I still have my Lemans boots. Who knows? I do know that, if I ride again, freeride style with fairly shallow angles in my hardboots on my Donek, that I'll be a rider, despite the fact I don't fit a defined style-I figured out my own style based on the limitations of my knee and ankle-so don't not call me a snowboarder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassandtim Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 I do know that.......I'll be a rider, despite the fact I don't fit a defined style-I figured out my own style........so don't not call me a snowboarder. +1,000,000 I find lately that I have less and less tolerance on the hill and end up having more confrontations with the 'Core' (if that's the term du jour) set. It's not the styles that they choose that get me fired up; it's the attitudes and it goes way beyond snowboarding. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furi Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 <snip> As for bicycling, I've seen these overweight spandex clad guys on $5000 cycles kill it on century rides so I never criticize them. Drinking beer post ride is part of the road cycling culture as well as the running culture and there's people out there than are fat and in shape and don't care about the fat part.I've been riding bikes on road rides for about 20 years now. Snowboarding and skateboarding have a huge "poser" contribution to the crowd of self described participants, but to say you have to be somewhat an expert to call yourself one is unfair. If you ride, you are a rider. I don't care if you suck because, quite frankly, I suck. funny story about the being fat in shape part. I also road cycle and a few years ago I had a very humbling experience that I'm actually really grateful for. After I put in a good amount of time building up a good base for the season I was feeling pretty good. I would participant in our local clubs 60-mile Sunday rides and was always in the lead group helping set the pace. So during the week I was doing my normal training rides I came across these two older fat guys riding along. One guy was on an old steel framed bike (Bianche Piaggio) and the other on a fancy carbon monster (Pinarello). So I'm thinking to myself Mr. fancy carbon guy is out for a ride with his buddy who probably last ride that bike in the mid-80's. Since it's my normal riding loop - my "turf" so to speak - I decide to show them how we ride around here. :p I said hi to them and then moved in front and set a hard pace, they stayed right up there with me I increased the tempo and thought for sure I would drop them. 3 miles later the guy on the Bianche pulls up to take point and sets a grueling pace. 6 miles into it with these guys and I get dropped off the tail end and I can't keep up. After I got over it (i'll admit I was crushed...) I saw those guys again on my weekday training rides and got their contact info and started riding with them regularly. They had both been riding over 40+ years and I learned alot about training, building base miles, and conversing strength from them. Made me a better rider and I dropped the crappy elitist attitude I didn't even know I had Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmartshopper Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 +1,000,000I find lately that I have less and less tolerance on the hill and end up having more confrontations with the 'Core' (if that's the term du jour) set. It's not the styles that they choose that get me fired up; it's the attitudes and it goes way beyond snowboarding. Tim I don't know if you're aware of the Burton campaign to get videos of rider poaching MRG, Alta, Toas, or Deer Valley? I didn't think it was terrible at first - I suppose it could be done without being an a$$. Of course it wasn't though.... Go to burton's site and watch the vids that Burton, as a corporation, decided to put up? A bunch of cute Jr. high girls talking like punks with baggy pants riding over skiers tails and spending the entire run - not poaching the sweet off-limits MRG terrain - but intentionally harrassing intermediate skiers on groomers. It's one thing for kids to do that. It's another thing for Burton to select that video for display. I'm a cheap sumnabitch, and it pains me to pay full retail for a Donek/Madd/Prior, when I know I could get a leftover Burton off fleabay for 1/2 the price... but guess what I just did anyway? Those guys aren't making the $$$ off the extranious B.S., so the boards are going to cost more. I can deal with that. ________ Teen Health Advice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nils Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 already posted that one...but here it is again, since i'm a lucky owner of a copy of this rare movie...maybe snowriter seen the movie already.. Date: April 1977 Location: Utah Rider: Dimitrije Milovich Board: rectractable skegged 175cm ST with straps ( note that he rode his board very much on the front...) Movie: April's Footage ( extract )...shot in 16mm! Comment: first ever snowboard movie ( modern moves, jumps and good level)... it has to be noted that: - at that time DM was probably the best rider alive, on almost contemporary design board ( put edges, a real core and edges and u're set today) - this is at a time when Jake, Sims, Chuck and the others were far from making boards as performant and efficient, or provide riders with same level.. - this is only early 1977 ! - this movie is my all time fav! I wish i was there watching him live! - i promessed not to publish the whole movie sorry for the brutal end ! Nils <div><object width="420" height="329"><param name="movie" value="http://www.dailymotion.com/swf/xd8r7&v3=1&related=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.dailymotion.com/swf/xd8r7&v3=1&related=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="420" height="329" allowFullScreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always"></embed></object><br /><b><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xd8r7_aprilsfootage-sample_sport">April'sfootage sample</a></b><br /><i>envoyé par <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/messire">messire</a></i></div> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 that is awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowriter Posted February 26, 2008 Report Share Posted February 26, 2008 already posted that one...but here it is again, since i'm a lucky owner of a copy of this rare movie...maybe snowriter seen the movie already.. I saw that you posted this on another thread. Very nice ... a great piece of history!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willywhit Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 love that winterstick ! I will attest that JG is a complete teetotaller ugly sled- 2 man carving sled would rule, tho http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=6659018&ch=4226726&src=news Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photodad2001 Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 I don't know if you're aware of the Burton campaign to get videos of rider poaching MRG, Alta, Toas, or Deer Valley? I didn't think it was terrible at first - I suppose it could be done without being an a$$. I agree, the idea was good. Should have put some stipulations on it that video that has snowboarders initiating contact with skiing patrons would not be accepted. It actually shows why those slopes don't want snowboarders. Core snowboarder: "Hey, why don't you let snowboarders in here?" Management: "Well why don't you play back your video footage? ...Oh, there you go, you just ran over that guys skis on purpose, and patted that skier on the butt, should I go on?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowriter Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 I don't know if you're aware of the Burton campaign to get videos of rider poaching MRG, Alta, Toas, or Deer Valley? I didn't think it was terrible at first - I suppose it could be done without being an a$$. Perhaps, but I think Burton ultimately was encouraging people to break the law (basically trespass) which, I really don't think is a good idea ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photodad2001 Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Perhaps, but I think Burton ultimately was encouraging people to break the law (basically trespass) which, I really don't think is a good idea ... Burton did say anyone making a video must by a lift ticket. Anyone with a lift ticket is not trespassing and not breaking any laws. Let's say a group wanted to make a statement against Disney. It'd be like telling people to pay for admition to Disney World and get a picture of them giving Mickey Mouse bunny ears. (By the way, giving Mickey Mouse bunny ears is not permited at Disney World, but not against the law. They will throw you out if you repeat this offense after being warned.) Same concept. Where the snowboarders making the video cross the line is when they initiate contact with other patrons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmartshopper Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Where the snowboarders making the video cross the line is when they initiate contact with other patrons. The thing that bothers me the most though, is that Burton selected that video out of many. Why? Because the participants were such a good fit for their propaganda machine. It's hard work keeping a company with a few $100 million in annual revenue at the forefront of the 'counter-culture'. Luckily, the bulk of their target audience is... let's say... impressionable. ________ Milena4male Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 I think this thread is funny...... I like the history lesson, pretty cool. To the rest of it, all I can say is: How is the air up there? When you get off your high horse, we can talk. I started (given it was 22 years ago) where those kids are now, I had the same attitude, smoked, and generally tried to piss people off. Have we really forgotten what it was like to be a teenager? Sure I didn't start snowboarding because it was "cool", I started because it was skateboarding in the winter. But I have the feeling that is the case for a lot of the riders these days. I am just glad I don't HAVE to hike anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowriter Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Burton did say anyone making a video must by a lift ticket. Anyone with a lift ticket is not trespassing and not breaking any laws.Let's say a group wanted to make a statement against Disney. It'd be like telling people to pay for admition to Disney World and get a picture of them giving Mickey Mouse bunny ears. (By the way, giving Mickey Mouse bunny ears is not permited at Disney World, but not against the law. They will throw you out if you repeat this offense after being warned.) Same concept. Where the snowboarders making the video cross the line is when they initiate contact with other patrons. Not sure the analogy holds up as the riders' sole intent for purchasing the lift ticket was to use the facility in a manner that the owners do not permit. In essence, the purchasers of the lift ticket misrepresented the reason for their purchase of the tickets and thus, their access to the mountain was obtained under false pretenses. Thus, said access could be considered a form of trespass. Essentially, the rider entered into the contract in bad faith and with the sole intent to violate the rules of the mountain. Thus, the lift ticket contract could be considered void and the rider could be considered guilty of trespass. Furthermore, should an accident occur and the rider was not only at fault but clearly reckless (the type of behavior encouraged by the videos) Burton could be held liable for damages as Burton encouraged (one could even say incited based on the prize money offered and the videos displayed on its web site) the reckless rule breaking behavior that was the cause of the accident. Because said accident was clearly a foreseeable result of the behavior Burton encouraged, Burton could - and should - be held liable for any damages created by a reckless boarder participating in Burton's poaching campaign. Such a scenario, btw, in some ways, is reminiscent of Weirum vs. RKO General (though hopefully the consequences would not be as dire). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Not sure the analogy holds up as the riders' sole intent for purchasing the lift ticket purpose was to use the facility in a manner that the owners do not permit. In essence, the purchasers of the lift ticket misrepresented the reason for their purchasing of the ticket and thus, their access to the mountain was obtained under false pretenses, and thus, said access could be considered a form of trespass. Essentially, the rider entered into the contract in bad faith and with the sole intent to violate the rules of the mountain. Thus, the lift ticket contract could be considered void and thus the rider could be considered guilty of trespass. Furthermore, should an accident occur and the rider was not only at fault but clearly reckless (the type of behavior encouraged by the videos) Burton could be held liable for damages as Burton encouraged (one could even say incited based on the prize money offered and the videos) the reckless rule breaking behavior that was the cause of the accident AND said accident was clearly a foreseeable result of the behavior Burton encouraged. Such as scenario, in some ways, is reminiscent of Weirum vs. RKO General (though hopefully the consequences would not be as dire). I think initially, Burton did not specify what "poaching" was. They pretty quickly changed there tune after the initial release of the promotion video. I think telling the people to buy a ticket is a way of releasing them from a little bit of liability. The first video I watched was significantly different than the one I watched a couple of days later. The lawyers must have gotten a hold of it. Although, maybe not. Sounds like you would know WAY more about it than me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Such a scenario, btw, in some ways, is reminiscent of Weirum vs. RKO General (though hopefully the consequences would not be as dire). For those of you who are curious, here is the jist of it: http://www.eejlaw.com/materials/weirum.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photodad2001 Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Not sure the analogy holds up as the riders' sole intent for purchasing the lift ticket was to use the facility in a manner that the owners do not permit. In essence, the purchasers of the lift ticket misrepresented the reason for their purchase of the tickets and thus, their access to the mountain was obtained under false pretenses. Thus, said access could be considered a form of trespass. Essentially, the rider entered into the contract in bad faith and with the sole intent to violate the rules of the mountain. Thus, the lift ticket contract could be considered void and the rider could be considered guilty of trespass. Furthermore, should an accident occur and the rider was not only at fault but clearly reckless (the type of behavior encouraged by the videos) Burton could be held liable for damages as Burton encouraged (one could even say incited based on the prize money offered and the videos displayed on its web site) the reckless rule breaking behavior that was the cause of the accident. Because said accident was clearly a foreseeable result of the behavior Burton encouraged, Burton could - and should - be held liable for any damages created by a reckless boarder participating in Burton's poaching campaign. Such a scenario, btw, in some ways, is reminiscent of Weirum vs. RKO General (though hopefully the consequences would not be as dire). If you don't think my analogy is accurate, please feel free to attempt to give Mickey Mouse bunny ears. About 4 years ago I tried while posing for a picture with my daughter. The attendant that accompanies Mickey put a quick and almost violent stop to the situation, jerking my hand down and giving me a firm toungue lashing. It is against the rules at Disney World and is grounds for expulsion from the park. Riding a snowboard at one of these resorts is not against the law even though it is against resort policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 If you are using a snowboard and sliding down a hill it is snowboarding. That's the attitude I can't stand about this message board. There is far too much terrain park bashing calling it "gimmicky". To me, the mere thought of you clowns attempting to carve 360 is alot more gimmicky and lame than terrain park riding. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 If you are using a snowboard and sliding down a hill it is snowboarding. That's the attitude I can't stand about this message board. There is far too much terrain park bashing calling it "gimmicky". To me, the mere thought of you clowns attempting to carve 360 is alot more gimmicky and lame than terrain park riding. YEAH thats about all jibbers can do is slide. Anyone can slide on a plastic box. Well A LOT fewer people can carve a 360 than ride in the terrain park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Well A LOT fewer people want to carve a 360 than ride in the terrain park. Fixed it for ya. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted February 27, 2008 Report Share Posted February 27, 2008 Fixed it for ya. people usually dont want to do what they know they cant do.... but I digress... your name is mud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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