How sad - VT College loss of life

[C5 Golfer]

My thoughts and condolences to the members of the Virginia Tech Community

How sad and difficult it must be for the families, and to any of you with friends and family close to that -- I am sorry for your loss.

[Justin A.]

Those families get some of my thoughts and prayers, but I have to say that the Majority my thoughts and prayers go out to the people in the northeast- NH especially (we've been flooded 4 times in the last year and a half) who are dealing with the floods, heavy winds, electrical line-puddles, and massive power outages. Especially to the people who lost their homes this time LAST year as well and have just finished rebuilding or are just starting to rebuild.

[bschurman]

Those families get some of my thoughts and prayers, but I have to say that the Majority my thoughts and prayers go out to the people in the northeast- NH especially (we've been flooded 4 times in the last year and a half) who are dealing with the floods, heavy winds, electrical line-puddles, and massive power outages. Especially to the people who lost their homes this time LAST year as well and have just finished rebuilding or are just starting to rebuild.

Wait. You have more compassion for people who lost their house and possessions in a flood to those that lost their loved ones to an idiot?

The ONLY thing you can't replace is your life.

->Ben

[LeeW]

The ONLY thing you can't replace is your life.

->Ben

How true. This tragedy reminded me of the sniper issues at Univ. of Texas in the 60s, even tho a large loss of lives today at V.T. Ironically, I saw a truck with V.T. sticker on the back of his truck.

[Justin A.]

Wait. You have more compassion for people who lost their house and possessions in a flood to those that lost their loved ones to an idiot?

The ONLY thing you can't replace is your life.

->Ben

Not house and posessions. THEIR loved ones, and their posessions, and their homes.

http://www.wmur.com/video/12196242/index.html

Nothing good will come of me being involved in this thread, so I'll leave it unless I think I can make a contribution.

[bjvircks]

these horrors deeply sadden me also. I'm afraid there is a movement among troubled souls to strive for ever higher body counts as the only mark of significance they can make.

[roscoe]

you have to wonder what would make people do that. what is so wrong with their lives that they would kill innocent people?

[bjvircks]

Several years ago at the University of Iowa (Iowa City) a man named Gang Lu killed several faculty, students and then himself because he felt he had been unfairly passed over for academic recognition and a position. What it is within people that pushes them this far over the edge is a total mystery to me. I would guess severe depression plays into it.

Early yesterday evening just at sunset I found myself standing with my girlfriend over the grave of a young man who died just days shy of 18. He is her son. He was just coming out of a bout of depression when he robbed a bank with a starter's pistol. He stayed in the area, and when the police arrived he stood next to the cruiser and pointed the harmless gun at the officers still sitting in the car. They had to shoot him thru the windshield. A classic case of suicide by cop. This was 10 years ago on April 30. I found myself grieving for a child/man I hadn't even known.

How can we help these people?

[Steve Prokopiw]

As the parent of two young children these things put a dagger through my heart.I can't imagine what the parents(at any age we are always our parents kids)of these college kids must be going through and for my kids' sake I hope I never will. My prayers are with them.

[pebu]

Those families get some of my thoughts and prayers, but I have to say that the Majority my thoughts and prayers go out to the people in the northeast- NH especially (we've been flooded 4 times in the last year and a half) who are dealing with the floods, heavy winds, electrical line-puddles, and massive power outages. Especially to the people who lost their homes this time LAST year as well and have just finished rebuilding or are just starting to rebuild.

The good thing is thoughts and prayers are something that you don't run out of. There's plenty to go around.

Justin, I'm not taking a shot at you, I'm just saying to everybody that theres no such thing as over-well-wishing or praying for people too much..

[D-Sub]

this news spawned a thread on another forum I frequent and it turned into a gun control debate.

I dont pay attention to the doom and gloom news anymore. I cant handle it. Sick world out there

had no idea the NE was having so much trouble! damn.

interesting comment made about possible feelings of insignifance and a "body count" being a way to "make a mark." Man...what a disturbing possibility.

[Dr D]

How can we help these people?

Love

Give it to everyone around you and give liberally. You never know if you are the only one that touches someones life and brings them back from a bad decision. It might only be killing themselves. the opposite of love is not hate its indifference.

[FTA2R]

"Tech" as it is known in the DC area, is huge here, even though I'm 4 hours from it. Their alum are everywhere here. many people i graduated HS with went to Tech. i know several people that graduated, and I have been there. i called a good friend just to make sure she didn't know anyone involved.

turns out the psycho is from about 1/2 hour away from me, in Centreville, VA, and that he went to the same HS that the kid who killed 2 Fairfax County cops in front of the police station last year went to.

the older professor (a holocaust survivor) gave his life and a few other students barricaded the door, which likely saved lives b/c it prevented the psycho from coming in to that room.

a lot of angry, very disturbed people in this country. way too many if you ask me. unfortuenatly i have no reason to believe these disgusting acts will cease. They've only increased over the year. Truly tragic and an absolutely horrible reflection of our country. i can't help but think how this rarely, if ever, happens in other countries (and reporters have also said this).

[bjvircks]

Love Give it to everyone around you and give liberally. You never know if you are the only one that touches someones life and brings them back from a bad decision. It might only be killing themselves. the opposite of love is not hate its indifference.

Great sentiment... but it does not get the job done. Dawn and her husband loved their son very much, but did not know that he was in so much pain and so close to the edge. We all have 'toolboxes' we dig into to work on emotional and psychological issues. Most of us have very general tools in our personal toolbox. A lot of these troubled people need help from very skilled 'mechanics' with very specialized tools.

[Dr D]

I intended that as a societal generality not specifically something that was missing in your particular case. By in large the "shooters" in these types of situations have been individuals largely ignored by society that made a last desperate act in hope of getting noticed.:( Nice sentiments work better the more people participate and believe in them. take a moment and notice someone today that you would ordinarily ignore its simple and who knows you might make a difference.

[Jack M]

you have to wonder what would make people do that.

among other things... anti-depressants.

[bjvircks]

What sometimes happens when a patient is on an anti-depressant is that they become just 'strong' enough to take some sort of action, but choose the act of suicide instead of continued healthy growth. It can be a very difficult to manage two-edged sword until they are past the danger period. Tightly integrated well matched counseling is absolutlely required.

edit: Lucy to Charlie Brown- "That will be five cents, please"

[BobD]

This is not a gun control comment, but just a reality check. When 200,000,000 or so people have easy access to guns, this is going to happen. I'm shocked that people are so suprised. All the school security in the world is not going to prevent this happening again and again. It's just going to be a part of lives, like or not.

Doctor D's comment is right, but ironic. We have the most comprehensive intervention programs in schools for watching out for and helping troubled kids of any where in the world. This is not motivated by a real desire to help those kids though. It is because of our fear of thier killing potential with guns.

If we want to reduce the number of these incidents (without gun control), huge sums of money need to be spent on mental health -cradle to the grave. We also need to find a way to reduce the desensitising effects of video games, TV and movies.

BobD

BobD

[Bubba]

I had one ear on work and the other on the radio listening to what is going on out there. I think what was said (I could be wrong) was that the shooter was already on meds for mental health issues. He also wrote some disturbing things for a creative writing class that caused the prof to take it to someone with more authority. From what I understood not much was done. As far as spending huge sums of money on mental health, I am going through a divorce from someone with a huge family history of mental illness. Sometimes you can spend alot of money on counseling, meds, etc., but it doesn't make a damn bit of difference. My 2$.

[BobD]

read - real effort

BobD

[Bubba]

Real Effort Was Made For 15 Years!!!!!!!!! Cradle To The Grave Doesn't Work With Someone With No Desire To Make It Work, Even Though They Know They Are Mentally Ill And Don't Use The Resources Presented To Them.

[FTA2R]

a friend of mine is a dr. and told me that there are many many people in this country on anti-depression / anxiety meds. of course that's all he said b/c he's a dr. and can't say any more, but my understanding is that mental illness can certainly be a biological condition - lack of dopamine (or whatever) in the brain and that these drugs act to counter that, perhaps via somehow manipulating receptors (or something).

if you really think about it, Americans are a very stressed and angry nation- the country is pretty divided over several issues (like Iraq and immigration) people work way way too much in the US, divorce rate is huge, angry people are everywhere. People in general are stressed, though this varies greatly by region. here in the DC area aggressive driving is certainly the norm.

i personally think that something happens to these kids in the school system. they are outcasts, have no friends, are teased or otherwise lonely. so what do you now a days if you're that guy? apparently become disullionsed (normal for teens) and actually act on it by committing some heinous crime. tragically, that seems to be becoming the norm.

violent video games have been around for years, i remember playing "contra" on super nintendo, yet school shootings weren't a problem when i was in school. i'm not saying they help, either. when I become a parent, however, and if I have a son, I will obviously make it clear to him video games should never be confused with reality. and there are obviously some parents out there who dont' spend enough time with their kids. Violent games are not the root cause of these school shootings, though.

though many people have a hard exterior shell and like to come off as someone they really aren't, when it comes down to it, i believe there are very few people who really prefer to be loners. compionship is a very natural human characteristic.

[BobD]

violent video games have been around for years, i remember playing "contra" on super nintendo, yet school shootings weren't a problem when i was in school. i'm not saying they help, either. when I become a parent, however, and if I have a son, I will obviously make it clear to him video games should never be confused with reality. and there are obviously some parents out there who dont' spend enough time with their kids. Violent games are not the root cause of these school shootings, though.

I agree with the rest of what you're saying, but video games do have an effect on people. The military is spending millions on video similators because the things are very good at training people to do things they wouldn't normally do. The more realistic the better. Sure, we played "war" when we were kids, but it wasn't very realistic. We knew when we pointed the toy gun at someone and shouted bang that nothing would happen. Now when kids point thier video guns at someone in the game, they expect to see blood and guts flying. If that's not desensitising, I can't think what could be more so, other than the real thing. I know it's not a root cause, but may be another factor.

BobD

[Allee]

Bubba is dead right. You can't help anyone who doesn't want to be helped. Because we live in an ultra-politically-correct world of rights and freedoms, you simply can't take people off the streets and force treatment on them, whether they need it or not. And you can't arrest people on the suspicion that "they might be a psycho", even if all the signs are there.

Everyone says "poor guy, he must have been bullied to this". But let's face it, EVERYBODY I know has been bullied in some way, shape or form, and 99.99% of us turn out to be happy, healthy and well adjusted adults. For some reason people think that child abuse, bullying and mental health issues are completely recent phenomena. They've always been there, and they always will be, because that's just part of the human animal.

Mental health is a real problem, and with the pace of life ever increasing more and more people are going to fall through the cracks. Most of them we will never hear about. I don't know what the answer is, apart from the obvious - if they can't get guns, this would never happen. Defend your right to arms to the bitter end, but this is about the only truth to emerge out of this.

Brad, that is such a sad story, and I can't begin to imagine the pain that parents go through, and the helplessness they feel to deal with it.

[FTA2R]

"Everyone says "poor guy, he must have been bullied to this".

not sure who you're referring to but just to be clear i definitely would never use "poor guy" in teh same sentence as this psycho. bullied is one reason of several.

how many here have actually dealt with a very mentally ill person? they're not gonna say "i need help." so "they hvae to help themselves" doesn't apply to people who are very mentally ill.