Hann17 Posted February 13, 2022 Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 (edited) Hi, I've been snowboarding for quite some time since (8 years) and want to transition to Alpine snowboarding. The problem is I am not snowboarding with my shoulders in line with the board, after I stopped taking lessons I started snowboarding my own way. I want to know how the transition felt for you and if my snowboarding position could become a problem. Edited February 13, 2022 by Hann17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucasgo Posted February 13, 2022 Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 I definitely don't always ride shoulders in line. It depends on what I'm trying to accomplish. The PureBoarding guys like massive rotation from what I recall of a clinic. Some people like to have rigidly locked boots, others ride in "walk" mode. Once upon a time I rode with knees jammed together, now they're neutral. Unless you're trying to get into racing, do some experimentation because it's an art. Watch some carving videos and try something new each time. Knowing *how* to snowboard, you'll have an easy transition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hann17 Posted February 13, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 @Lucasgo Thank you very much for your response. Exactly what I needed to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted February 13, 2022 Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 If anything, shoulders in line with board's long axis would be detrimental to riding in alpine stance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hann17 Posted February 13, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 @BlueB Thanks for the reply! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted February 13, 2022 Report Share Posted February 13, 2022 Look at lots of hardboot carving snowboard videos and look at the riders stances on turns to both sides. You will see that many riders ride most of the time with the line of their shoulders more across the line of the board rather than in line with the length of the board. I've a big YouTube collection of carving video playlists you may find helpful. https://youtube.com/channel/UCbFkVPcmsd5oH-Oe0s3LEMw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnE Posted February 14, 2022 Report Share Posted February 14, 2022 That is one of the issues that I had the most trouble with when I was hardbooting: When I skied, my shoulders pointed toward the tips of my skis. When I soft boot snowboarded, my left shoulder lead. When I worked at hardbooting my shoulders were somewhere between. I never really got used to the in-between orientation. So I regressed back to softbooting and all is well. The other thing I had trouble with hardbooting is that driving one's knees is partially lateral. With softbooting knee flex is in the direction knees were meant to flex. Good luck on the transition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted February 14, 2022 Report Share Posted February 14, 2022 26 minutes ago, JohnE said: The other thing I had trouble with hardbooting is that driving one's knees is partially lateral. With softbooting knee flex is in the direction knees were meant to flex. The lateral "knee drive" actually happens at the hip and somewhat ankle joints. It's not that you bend the knee in an impossible way. Actually, this move exists with soft boots too, when you do it well. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hann17 Posted February 15, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2022 @SunSurfer Thank you very much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted February 15, 2022 Report Share Posted February 15, 2022 (edited) https://beckmannag.com/hardboot-snowboarding Erik Beckmann has created a resource for setting up gear, then self learning alpine snowboarding. Many people have found it helpful. Lots of gems tucked away in there. There are also Tech Articles here. http://alpinesnowboarder.com/tech-articles/ Then there's this playlist of tips from Sean Martin at Donek Snowboards. Edited February 15, 2022 by SunSurfer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VSR-Alex Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 Hey Hann17! I transitioned to alpine snowboarding recently in 2018, and I had the same questions as you do.Do not feel like you need to change your own style, or that your current style is somehow not proper. I just want to provide you some resources in case you discover another style that feels better to you. Alpine does not feel the same as regular snowboarding; and I do not think it will unless you are riding a very wide board with low binding angles. Though it will not feel the same, the physics of snowboarding still apply. Pressure the edge evenly, and keep your center of mass inside the turn. The important point about alpine snowboarding, no matter what style you use, is to first re-learn how to position your center of mass inside of the turn since your feet are now positioned differently. You can accomplish this with many different techniques, and these can apply to regular snowboarding as well. The style you use for regular snowboarding may or may not be the same as what you use for Alpine snowboarding; It is to some extent a preference and what feels better for you. I can classify the most popular styles into 3 categories: 1. Hips and shoulders facing the same direction as the binding angles (Race, or neutral). 2. Hips and shoulders positioned across the long axis of the board (facing the nose). 3. Hips and shoulders rotating into the turn (extreme carve and push-pull) It took me a few years to realize that I actually prefer the neutral technique (shoulders and hips mainly facing binding direction), but that is the preference that I developed over time. I faced the nose of the board at first, and my snowboarding style changed over time. Just the process of finding my own style was a really rewarding and sort of a soul-searching experience. Check out these videos to see if you want to keep your own style, or change it up. I tried all of these styles to find the one I like. Take a look and see which one is closest to your current style and try it first. Notice the styles are very different, but they all put the center of mass inside of the turn: Extreme Carving and push-pull: No better learning tool than one of the original sources: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1T8I0inVfA Petr Lorenz has a good extreme carving series: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCc8k9ipkO30jF8WGAm6MWxA Facing the nose: OES Snowboards posts a lot of freecarving videos with an exaggerated version of this style. This video has diagrams: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Me96_f-_3WM Race Technique: Great race technique video series called "Midweighting" by Marc Cirigliano: https://www.youtube.com/user/mcirigliano52/videos "ride with me": by Sigi Grabner is one of my favorites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MC7HWs3kPjs I still do these drills: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOJ3u64cvgU 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 Welcome! The first step before trying hardboots is to make sure you can carve your downhill edge on your current gear. That is, can you finish one carve, roll the board over and begin carving the next turn before the board points downhill? If you are fluid at doing that repeatedly and at will, then you're ready. The ultimate goal is for your hips and shoulders to be facing your binding angles throughout the turn. Some people need to think about facing the nose of the board in order to achieve this. An expert softbooter can jump on an alpine setup and start carving right away. Here's proof: https://forums.alpinesnowboarder.com/topic/52597-good-softbooters-can-easily-try-hardboots/ Good luck! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Jack M said: An expert softbooter can jump on an alpine setup and start carving right away. Here's proof: https://forums.alpinesnowboarder.com/topic/52597-good-softbooters-can-easily-try-hardboots/ That's only proof that that particular person had success, not proof in general that strong softboot skills easily translate. Contrarians r us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 Just now, Neil Gendzwill said: That's only proof that that particular person had success, not proof in general that strong softboot skills easily translate. Contrarians r us. over the years I've seen several other strong softbooters try and succeed. Including myself. I believe it is generally true. If you don't, that video is at least proof that it's possible. The act of simply engaging and standing on the sidecut is not so different between the two setups. The biggest difficulties are during non-carving moments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 42 minutes ago, Jack M said: The biggest difficulties are during non-carving moments. As a guy who recently went the other way, I disagree pretty strongly on that. Heelside carves on a softboot setup are something I am struggling with. Toeside is OK, but I wash out lots on the heel. I think it's partially due to lack of mobility on my part. I also have to be much more delicate with the board, the shorter sidecut and softer flex gets me in trouble. All the non-carving stuff I am just fine with, the setup is a hoot in powder and bumps and general relaxed cruising around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 43 minutes ago, Neil Gendzwill said: As a guy who recently went the other way, I disagree pretty strongly on that. Heelside carves on a softboot setup are something I am struggling with. That's a completely different scenario. I'm saying a softbooter trying hardboots is going to have more difficulty with skidding, steering, and maneuvering than with carving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cthulhufish Posted February 23, 2022 Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Jack M said: I'm saying a softbooter trying hardboots is going to have more difficulty with skidding, steering, and maneuvering than with carving. As an experienced softbooter and newbie hardbooter, I second that. I’ve acquired more bruises from low speed maneuvering than carving. Maybe that’s less about difficulty than consequences though. There’s definitely still a learning curve to alpine carving. And I do try to avoid speeds I’m not confident about bailing myself out of. My ability to carve on my alpine board is outpacing my ability to emergency skid/brake, and if I didn’t hold back… yeah, I’d probably get myself into a lot more trouble carving. Something something risk tolerance. Edited February 23, 2022 by Cthulhufish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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