Practice drills/advice on initiation of carves

[lonbordin]

I need to get into my carves earlier, higher (board angle to snow) and harder.

Anyone got any drills or pointers on how to achieve this... right now I'm initiating carves and not getting the board high enough early enough. I do on occasion but I really need to do a lot better on this area.

The data: I'm running 63 F 3 toe lift 0 cant, 60 R 6 heel lift 0 cant on OS1 (Indys Mondo30) 20.5 stance width on a 19 waist width 178 BS Liberator. I'm 6'4", inseam 34, weighing in at 240lbs sans apparel.

(Wooo... tired I am... might edit this in the morning.)

[lonbordin]

Above post too long?

In a nutshell how do I break out "The Hammer"? :)

[Jack M]

http://www.bomberonline.com/articles/practice_drills.cfm

http://www.bomberonline.com//articles/cross_over.cfm

[lonbordin]

I've read the practice drills page and do many of them. I've read every tutorial as well. I can Norm. There is a line (degree) between carving and CARVING. I can do a little carving and occasionally lock into CARVING. In searching the boards for advice and really taking an introspective look into my own technique I have come to the conclusion that when I'm CARVING it is because I am initiating earlier, higher and harder. I know I need more snow time but I was looking for advice specific to this endeavor.

Especially things to look for to increase inclination and angulation earlier. (See I've even read the physics articles).

***Important! Thank you Jack for your articles and your work on BOL I would not be where I am today without them. Thank you!***

[Jack M]

sorry for the brief response, I'm "multitasking" in a meeting at work!

cross-through is one way to get on your new edge and angulate sooner.

also try the front boot cuff grab, and see how quickly you can change hands.

and thank you for thanking me! :D

[Corey]

I recently struggled with this same issue, especially on a heelside turn: How to get that carve started early and hard. I was tipping the board on edge and waiting for the G-force to build, which then decambered the board and got it turning. It's kind of a chicken and egg problem: How do you decamber the board without G-force? How do you get G-force without decambering the board?

For me the answer was starting with a push-pull technique like the Extremecarving guys. End one turn compact and load that board up as soon as it's tipped over. I mean _really_ press it into the snow early in the turn. The challenge was to keep proper angulation. As I got more experience the movement became more subtle but it was always a dedicated shove to get the board biting and decambered.

When you nail it the board just bites and rockets through the turn. Now I'm riding the board instead of it riding me, that's REALLY fun! Hopefully this helps somewhat.

[SWriverstone]

This is a topic that, frankly, (and with kudos to Jack Michaud for all his excellent tutorials) never gets discussed enough.

Corey touched on it above: G-forces. Centripetal force. At the highest levels...meaning when you see guys laying out on the snow with every turn and popping back up again...this is NOT something that can be taught, IMO. It can only be arrived at after a LOT of time on the slopes.

Sure, the basic steps necessary to reach that point (laying out on every turn) can be taught (e.g. stance, angulation, etc.)...but to **actually** reach the point of laying out on every turn requires a huge amount of repetition and practice.

This is because there is a relationship between how far you can "tip over" (e.g. lay out in a turn) and how fast you're going (e.g. how much centripetal force is generated in the turn).

Nobody can teach this relationship. If anyone could, they'd start out by saying "You have to be going exactly __mph to be able to lean over __degrees." But of course it doesn't work like that.

What happens instead is that you go out and start doing "baby carves" (like the Norm)...then...over a loooooong period of time (likely several seasons) you start pushing it. You start riding faster and leaning over more. Bit by bit. Along the way, you try to get the other things right (stance, angulation, etc.)

You also fall a lot. Sometimes it's from catching an edge...but most of the time it's for a very simple reason: you just weren't going fast enough (generating enough centripetal force) and angulating enough to sustain your lean angle and plopped down into the snow! :)

It's for this reason that (again, with respect for everyone who dispenses excellent technique advice here!) I often get frustrated with technical advice. Because ultimately, when you've absorbed all the advice you can absorb...and even after you're angulating beautifully and positioning your body well...

...you still have to figure out the whole speed/centripetal force vs. lean angle thing. And again, there is NO way to teach that other than by sheer experience.

Scott

EDIT: I'm not suggesting carving is all about high speeds. I do recognize that turn radius, your board, etc all play an important role. But the basic gist of what I'm saying remains the same, which is that nobody can be taught to lay out in every turn. You just have to practice, practice, practice...repeat...repeat...repeat...repeat! (And be in pretty good shape.)

[big canuck]

Have you tried a shorter board? As a guy who thought "If you're not riding a 185 you're a wimp!!" I have really warmed up to 160-163 lenghts. Try one you never know.

I went through the same frustration you're expiriencing. I'm 6 ft 250 lbs Size 12 feet shoehorned into 28.5 boots. I like 18 cm waist boards and my angles have crept up toi 62 deg fr 60 rr. 6 deg cants fr and rear.

The other thing that I think helped me was some rear leg outward cant.

Jack is a wicked rider, I am fairly average. Take it for what its worth.

[Beckmann AG]

I need to get into my carves earlier, higher (board angle to snow) and harder.

Begin the exit of your previous turn earlier.

Perhaps, by the time you feel 'secure' in the previous turn, it is too late to get out clean. Pass through the 'secure zone' on the way out the door.

You don't really need 'speed', or 'G-force', you need accurate movement, and the appropriate timing of said movement.

If you move large body parts around as a means of changing the angle between board and snow, then you may simply have a distance-rate-time problem.

Are you having difficulty on both turns, or just the toeside entry?

[lonbordin]

I added ~1degree outward cant to the rear prior to Big Canuck's suggestion... great minds and all that... I really liked how that felt... more stable even.

I ran the gates all of last night... only one short carving run... not much data there, yet.

I think getting out of the last turn and getting the mechanics in place for the next is solid advice. I'm going to think about my timing during Friday night's session while practicing Jack's drills, of course. :D

Beackmann AG- I would have to say both but probably more so toe side. I will introspect more Friday night and write back. Maybe I should carry a clicker in both hands! :D

[ARCrider]

if your coach was at the bottom of the hill looking up watching you come down,

try showing him the top of your board when you get on your new edge