1st carving board, gear

[Guest KrudKarver]

NOW that the snow is decent here out east, I'm thinking that I'd like to haul off and get a carving set-up. I currently have 2 boards, both "freeride-freestyle" types that I've been using for 7 years now w/ softboots (Limited 162, rossi somethin' or another..). I go about 175lbs or so and would probably be classified as "stupidly aggressive" based on the number of metal pieces in my body.

As I'm spending all my time trying to carve that line deep enough to dig up worms, I suppose it IS about time....

My question is what set-up do you all think might be a good bet to work within these narrow, short, steep, ice-covered, cruddy NY hills with? I'm all but decided on a hardboot w/ the TD-2 step-ins.

The boards I'm considering are: Prior 4wd 169, Coiler freecarve 173, Donek axis 167, Donek freecarve..or maybe even the silberpfeil or speedster gts.

Without getting my hands on one to demo, it's a crapshoot when trying to decide..

Off-subject somewhat, the Limited 162 is old, but is the better carver of the two.. however, the tip does tend to fold up under duress.. neither are good on ice.

[Gecko]

Axxes, my one regret though I love my RC is that I haven't acquired an All Mountain board FC boards are not the best for starting out as they have a lot of hook to them holding an edge is easy, releasing it to transition to your next turn is what will be difficult...taper is needed for beginners to make good carves . That and of all the boards you list the Axxes is the smallest which on Ice coast trails is at least as important as type of board

[Justin A.]

Are you planning on buying new or used?

If you're buying new, I vote for the coiler HANDS DOWN. Bruce will take you through the build process and build the board according to your skill level, height, weight, riding conditions, all that stuff. It will be YOUR board. Sean at Donek will do the same, but his stuff costs more last time I checked. Custom boards are the way to go if you're buying new, if you're buying used, I would actually try to steer clear of them, as you'd be buying someone elses custom board (unless you can get a history of it and the board's former owner(s)).

[Pow]

narrow, short, steep, ice-covered, cruddy NY hills with?

How far up NY do you go? are you ever around Bellayre?

all are good choices, id say youre after something in the mid 60s to low 70s... you could go for an all-out alpine board if you know you'll only use it in trenchable conditions. the way i see it is you have a board (limited 162) you can ride in poor carving conditions (fresh powder and bumps), and a board you can use as a rock board (the rossi) so if you continue to use the setups you have you may not need a "one board carves all" type of board.

but if you plan on riding plates in everything, which dramatically improves the responsiveness of your gear and, to me at least, the quality of your ride then the Axxess is a great choice. also a good choice for somebody who wants to ease into alpine instead of diving head first into the sport.

ohh, and welcome to BOL:cool:

[Jack M]

Here's some reading to get started:

http://www.bomberonline.com/articles/welcome_center.cfm

You don't need a custom for your first board.

Good luck!

[abakker]

drive up to startingate in bonville vt, and demo a whole setup. i believe they carry donkek boards, catek and bomber bindings and head and deeluxe boots. they are the ones who got me into carving and i higly reccomend the service.

http://www.startingate.net/

also as important as all the other parts are, i highly reccommend getting your boot thermofitted if you can. it makes all the difference. i now don't have to loosen my boots all day and my feet don't even get cold.

in my opinion, the speedster is an advanced rider's board. it is also my first caving board because i was able to get one for rather inexpensive but still new. however, the number of falls i have taken this year because i am not giving just the right inputs makes me fel like i should have gotten a slightly more freecarve and less race board.

all that said, good luck and welcome to hardbooting.

Alex

[Mike T]

I've gotta agree with Gecko here... taper is a good thing on one's first carving board. Early on in my carving career I had both an Axxess (formerly Axis) 172 and a FC 163. Similar edge length and sidecut... the FC was easier to flip from edge to edge but looking back, I had a certain swagger on the Axis that didn't have on the FC because it was easier to get out of trouble. At the time I couldn't have told you why, but owning a number of bnoards since then has showed be a pattern: 4mm of taper makes it noticably easier to bail on a turn.

So yeah, I like the Axis from your listed choices as well. Of course, you could get Bruce @ Coiler to make you a FC 173 (or AM 172 or AM 169) with say 4mm of taper pretty easily, as long as you don't mind waiting for your turn in line.

[Gecko]

Taper....what I've learned about it recently. It allows for survival from the mistake of driving from the back of the board when it happens and shortening a turn when something scary happens in front of you.

[SEJ]

I'm about your size and I would recomend the 169 4WD. I just picked one up and am AMAZED at how easy it is to make tight turns on it. It will also carve long sweeping turns whenn you want to. All my other boards are race. Speedster, Nidecker GS, etc. I've found it very easy to carve, and easy to run in all the other "Less perfect" conditions.

[Guest KrudKarver]

Sweet info from everyone. Thanks.(I have been viewing this for ~month or so and expected as much.)

I spend most of my time at Holiday Valley, 'thou I'm closer to PknPk, Pow..but hope to get further N. (been a few times to Killington, but not lately. I usually reserve those time chunks to spend a few days up in Berthoud.)

SEJ, the 4WD your first carving board?

Boots to stay away from? I'm sporting a pair of 9's w/ the right ankle slightly larger due to hardware, otherwise med.wide toebox. So, comfort, support, durability in order of priority. I realize boots are really subjective, but there may be some real headaches out there that I'd want to avoid!

[SEJ]

No. Started With a 164 Burton Aysm air, (Stolen by the airlines) and replaced it with an Asym Alp 164. Rode it a couple of years in a STIFF soft boot set up at about 45/35 degrees, then went to a soft plate set up. After dumping the nose a couple times, (BOY is that fun!), I realized I had more boot than board.I bought a 164 FP which turned out to be fun on the hill, but to much sidecut radius for slalom, to short for GS. I then went in seach for a longer board. I picked up a 172 F2 Speedster, 177 Nidecker Custom GS, and a rocket ship Prior 184 no name. (15.4 meter sidecut) I haven't found a hill I can safely launch it on yet! It's a little beyond my skill sets.These are all fun to ride when the snow is right, but I have trouble with them when it's not. Enter my new, (used) Prior 169 4WD. It will run alot like the Speedster, but will come around quick like the old Alp. Plus, I can ride it in just about anything. It's not a race board, but I think it would be an exellent transition board. You won't outgrow it. If later you move up to a full blown race board, you will want to keep it because there will always be times when it's the best stick for the conditions. Scott

[Fastskiguy]

Is this some kind of crazy hardbooter affliction? I'm referring to equipment hoarding of course. I just started this year, learned on an ebay Rossi, just got a donek fc 11 171, and now want to get something for out west (I'm in Illinois) . Heh, I'm at risk...I've got 9 bicycles!

So I'm a new carver but the comments that a non-tapered board is harder to get out of a turn, especially when you get scared and lean back was confirmed here. And I don't have a lot of carving experience but the FCII is worth a try if you can find one.

No. Started With a 164 Burton Aysm air, (Stolen by the airlines) and replaced it with an Asym Alp 164. Rode it a couple of years in a STIFF soft boot set up at about 45/35 degrees, then went to a soft plate set up. After dumping the nose a couple times, (BOY is that fun!), I realized I had more boot than board.I bought a 164 FP which turned out to be fun on the hill, but to much sidecut radius for slalom, to short for GS. I then went in seach for a longer board. I picked up a 172 F2 Speedster, 177 Nidecker Custom GS, and a rocket ship Prior 184 no name. (15.4 meter sidecut) I haven't found a hill I can safely launch it on yet! It's a little beyond my skill sets.These are all fun to ride when the snow is right, but I have trouble with them when it's not. Enter my new, (used) Prior 169 4WD. It will run alot like the Speedster, but will come around quick like the old Alp. Plus, I can ride it in just about anything. It's not a race board, but I think it would be an exellent transition board. You won't outgrow it. If later you move up to a full blown race board, you will want to keep it because there will always be times when it's the best stick for the conditions. Scott

[Blue Bird]

is your girl (assumption (not that there is anything wrong with that)) going to allow you to start a new addiction?

Do you ride backwards alot? if no, buy a square tail

[Guest KrudKarver]

:lol: That 'be funny, Blue.. I used to ride motocross and had a real problem with gear, bikes, etc, so my wife is very happy that I'm looking into something else, that, one the surface, looks less expensive(cough,cough..yeh,honey..it WILL be MUCH less expensive).

Plus, the cash from that sell-off is still in hand.

I haven't ridden backwards in quite awhile. I've found that I'm just not that coordinated going the other direction. I do appreciate significant airtime thou and hope that in a year or two, I, too, can carve it up with the likes of those guys on the "hard attack" vid...

(i sit here laughing,of course. We don't have any mountains or powder like that around here.)

[Jack M]

Krud, you really want a set of these for the internal bling in your ankle:

http://www.bomberonline.com/store/accessories/liners.cfm

[Blue Bird]

....I do appreciate significant airtime thou...

no wonder you're packin the bling, hope you kept your chest protector and helmet

[Fastskiguy]

And I don't have a lot of carving experience but the FCII is worth a try if you can find one.

I just wanna add a little, today I rode my donek fc2 171 for the second time and had a really great time. It was 40 degrees, sunny, and the snow was soft and I was carving around, really diggin' it. A few times I brushed the upper thigh of my rear leg on the snow on my toe side turns and popped up and into the next turn. No problem on our narrow (but not very steep) midwest runs. The board felt great! Now for full disclosure it's only the 3rd carving board I've ridden...and the only one made this century LOL! but I am so psyched!

[SEJ]

Hell' I'm not hoarding, I'm just getting started. You should see the quiver some of these guys have. 30+ boards! You won't be sorry with the 4WD.

[Guest KrudKarver]

..yeh, I kept the box of orthodic braces, helmet and chest protector.. Nice pic FSG.. How much do you weigh (..just to get an idea of flex/stiffness of the fcII..)?

Last nite, my wife suggested that I take a "few days" out in winterpark..(man, she is a keeper..) to calm myself down a bit.

Thanks for a the great info. -been very helpful.

Now over to the wanted equip. page..

Looking for Catek os2's (short's ok), or the TD2's.

deeluxe 225 or 325's, My foot size is 10.5 inches (which, according to chart, is a 26 )?

[Bullwings]

a little bit about boot sizing. if i convert those 10.5 inches to cm, i get 26.67cm.

Deeluxe tends to run a little bit big with their sizing. My foot measured 29.4cm, and I wear a size 12 shoe, so i got some mondo 29 suzukas. I wore them for 12 days so far this season, and have done all sorts of things to get them to fit. Finally, i just ponied up and and bought some size 28s. They feel SO much better, of course i haven't ridden them yet (tomorrow and monday i will), but i can tell how much better they will be. Even after the liners pack out after 5 days or so of riding, it'll still be a much better fit.

My 12 days of hardbooting so far this season, has told me that the most important piece of equipment is your boots and their fit.

Also, a slightly small boot is better than a slightly large boot. A skilled boot fitter can make a smaller boot fit well. It's hard to do the same with a slightly larger boot - which i've had experience with (not too sure about the small boot, but that's what everyone else here says).

[D-Sub]

KK

if you have the $$ I would say your first step should be to go immediately to a bootfitter. Have them tell you what MONDO size you should get then proceed.

OR, find a shop (there are a few in the NE) that both sells/fits hardboots. The Starting Gate in VT gets high praise all the time.

I used to wear a size 11 shoe due to width, but my feet are around 26.7 or so, and I have size 27 boots. THese work for me but I suspect I could move down to a 26 with a little work from a bootfitter (and, of course, moldable liners)

[Guest KrudKarver]

When I used to ski, boots were always a P.I.A., so, fit is a real concern.

Anyone hear of/comment on scarpa denali boots?

I'm drawn to their AT 2005 model due to them actually having a walking sole and potential for approaches. + I have a pair of scarpa's (mountaineering boots) that I've loved for their quality and fit.

Also, don't know if they'll work with the catek or td bindings (step-in's I'm supposing not.)

[D-Sub]

will NOT work with intec, but should work fine with bails, although ledge length might affect binding angle?

[yyzcanuck]

I spend most of my time at Holiday Valley, 'thou I'm closer to PknPk

Try to get yourself over to Holimont (private I know)... there are a large number of carvers there.

[mcbane]

Does everyone have the same experience with Raichle boots-that they are a bit oversized? My foot measures 11.4" as well, probably a normal width and I just bought a pair of Raichle 423 mondo 29. haven't gotten them yet but did I just bite the big one???