catek FR2s!

[svr]

SWT,

thanks for the pics and info.

cheers,

sandy

[Neil Gendzwill]

Not being a softie rider, what exactly is the appeal to these bindings? You pay $350 for them, then everyone wants to replace the straps, replace the back, whatever. Is the cant/lift adjustability really that big of a deal?

[dshack]

I kind of wondered about that myself (Esp. now that it's $450 for the top-end model). Is the heelcup deeper or the ankle strap positioned significantly higher than normal stiff softboot bindings (Burton P1 carbon, Salomon SP55, Nidecker 900, Flow CFX etc)? What makes them, in the eyes of so many on the Catek forum, almost comparable to hardboot bindings?

[bobdea]

what makes them so good is they are stiff and quit rugged

they ride nice as well

as for the straps, I like burton strapsmaybe because they work better with burton boots but just about any binding I use I end up puting c series or P1 straps on not just cateks

as for the highback most people will like this new highback, it maks the binding a little more supple, I would like it a little stiffer is all

[lonerider]

I kind of wondered about that myself (Esp. now that it's $450 for the top-end model). Is the heelcup deeper or the ankle strap positioned significantly higher than normal stiff softboot bindings (Burton P1 carbon, Salomon SP55, Nidecker 900, Flow CFX etc)? What makes them, in the eyes of so many on the Catek forum, almost comparable to hardboot bindings?

Basically they are stiffer and virtually unbreakable, which is something heavy (+180lbs) and aggresive riders prize. At only 145 lbs, I switched from the FR1 with SPX straps/highback I went to the Nidecker 800 Pros and prefer them myself. I currently also have Burton P1MD (way too soft) and C60 (pretty good so far).

[EndUser]

Sunday I tried my new Catek FR2s (non-limited edition). Here is my review!

Overview:

First, it's a bit unfair of a test as I mounted them to a new board that I have never ridden before (F2 Respect 176) -- so I won't really comment on their feel/damping/handling. These are areas that I really have no concern with the bindings themselves --I had no issues and they perform well in these respects. They were comfortable and didn't cause any pain, and retained my feet to the board.

The main reason I bought these is for durability, serviceability, and adjustability. My comments are mostly in these areas.

Construction & Assembly:

First, these are very well thought out, engineered components. The machining is meticulous. The parts provided (and there are several) were exactly the right number, and fit together well. The hardware is pretty high quality. Spare parts for gaskets, spacers and smaller screws would have been appreciated in a product in this price range, but were not included.

I almost lost several small screws! The straps attach with a pretty small screw, and ALL FOUR screws (factory installed/tightened) loosened , two FELL OUT onto the snow after a few runs! I can't believe these weren't secured better. Needless to say, I did the Locktight thing today. Also, as someone else mentioned, these Allen heads are too small and strip out easily. I tightened them with the provided tool, and one is now stripped. Luckily larger sizes are used on other hardware.

Assembly instructions were worded in English and with engineering precision. I appreciated these a lot, and I would have been clueless for finding where all the parts went otherwise. The photos helped but could have been larger.

As I mentioned before, they come with 4x4-only compatible discs, but 3Ds can be obtained from Catek as a special order (at additional cost, unfortunately). There is no universal 4x4 & 3D compatible disc available.

The Black anno of the base plate looks cool, but I'd actually just prefer silver/natural aluminum. It will only get scratched up anyway and look worse then. I did catch the liftie checking them out a bit...

Damping/Elastomer Shockmounts:

The rubber elastomer shock mounts beneath the mounting disc and on the power-bar seem like a good concept, and also protect the board from top-sheet damage. As I mentioned, I used the bindings on a board foreign to me, so I can't comment on how these affect the ride. I did find that the board insert screws seemed to loosen quickly, and I wonder if these elastomers and also the gaskets/grommets used on certain parts might allow enough flex in the system for screws the back out. This is something I will have to watch -- could just be a break-in thing, but might be a drawback to the design.

Adjustability:

The adjustability of cant and lift is great, clearly this is the greatest benefit of the binding. VERY COOL, smart, system that is infinitely adjustable, robust, and easy enough to configure. I loved canting my feet inward to reduce knee stress with my stance. I also lifted my rear heel and front toe. You might not think these things are important, but the feel of the ride is substantially improved, I think it makes a huge difference! I'm guessing Catek holds some intellectual property on this aspect, and is similar to what they use on their hardboot OS2 bindings (perhaps even compatible with).

The height of the baseplate is also adjustable using the same lift/cant set screws. I wasn't sure how I would feel about being lifted off the board so I used the smallest master-screw to keep it to a minimum. After riding I didn't really notice it, and I think its a good idea to reduce boot-out. Of course with lift/cant settings, you have to have some hight in there... Oh, and I was worried about snow getting underneath the baseplate, which it can -- but this seems like an unreasoned concern and didn't bother me. Why would I care, weight maybe? Maybe it will bother me more in powder?

The angle adjustment is neat, with good silkscreened graduations on the disc for measurement. The power-bar thingy has two screws used to set the angle, and is independent of other settings like cant and lift, which is good. The metal of this part seems soft and does deform when the screw heads are tightened to secure the setting. This may be by design to help retain the screw and prevent slip. The only bummer about the angle setting is you have to remove the main binding platform to make changes -- but since its only one big bolt its not a big deal.

The forward/aft setting of the heel loop is a good feature, I'm impressed that this is an option - you set the boot-to-edge distance how you want. With this I configured my boot centered over the board with minimum (but equal) boot overhang on toe/heel side.

Weight:

The weight, yeah, it's heavier than plastic bindings, but not excessive in my estimation. They've shaved weight where necessary, but not too much to compromise the mechanical integrity. I haven't weighed them, sorry. Weight-weenies, here's some advice - just take a crap before your board session if you are that concerned. (for those into mountain biking I call it "the XTR crap")

Highback:

The plastic highback (non-limited edition), is too flexible. Also, the highback angle adjustment is a bit chintzy relative to the rest of the package. There are only 4-stops/settings. The injection molding process made the plastic imperfect cosmetically with some wavy lines in it (but I don't mind it much, ). Stiffer highback needed, more robust adjustment.

Highback rotation involves flexing the metal heel loop. You are forcing it to flex. The instructions suggest a single hole offset (plus a sub hole adjustment) is permissible. It would be better if the rotation was better integrated into the design without having to flex (and possibly stress?) the heel loop. I think the stifness of the heel loop prevents rotation from being enough, and the profile of the flexation might be the issue (how and where it bends) -- it just doesn’t bend the way plastic heel loops do. --- I want more highback rotation than what the FR2 seems capable of offering.

Straps / Ratchets:

The Nidecker straps were comfortable and caused no pressure points. I like how easily the top strap's position of the pad section (and length) can be adjusted with a screw/cam mechanism.

While the Nidecker ratchets are metal, but they seem to give out and stop tightening after a certain amount of pressure is achieved. This is a real problem! Some of the ratchets did this more than the others. I am disappointed with them and I don't know if this is how they are supposed to work or if I have 1 or 2 that are defective. I get the feeling the spring isn't strong enough to grab the plastic ribbed strap under high tension. I wonder if the FR2-limited version uses better ratchets? -- Regardless, I wanted my straps righter and I couldn't do it with these ratchets! On the plus side, when they are engaged they hold well and don't slip (it's just adding additional tension that is the issue). They release easily, and they seem durable since they are all metal.

The toe strap retention hardware to the base plate is kind of interesting. Catek gives you spacers so you can set the width for the toe end of your boot. Neat. They seem a little weak, and I worry they will eventually bend the screw that goes through the spacers (well, maybe not with the Nidecker ratchets!). But, they haven’t bent yet and I'm no mechanical engineer so I'm speculating here.

One criticism I have of the toe strap attachment hardware is that they allow the toe straps to flop around when your foot is not in the binding. I'm used to straps that have some sticktion in the hinges. It looks like a rubber gasket part is used in this assembly that might have been intended to cause some sticktion, but it fails to do that -- perhaps a flaw in the execution of the design with too narrow of a gasket? Anyway, getting on and off the lift (skate mode) the rear toe strap ends flop forward onto the snow. You might think is not a big deal, but when skating your front foot ends up kicking or stepping on the rear toe strap at times. I wouldn’t worry about it so much, but since I lost screws earlier in the day I was extra concerned that kicking the straps around might just loosen more screws and ruin my day. I ended up flopping the rear toe strap ends back onto the board after I removed my foot just to keep them out of the way -- fine, but an extra maneuver my back muscles don't appreciate.

Summary:

I'll give the RF2's an 8 out of 10. Nice, but not perfect. The numerous adjustment options, aluminum construction and attention to detail are benefits of the product. I'd give it a higher score if it weren’t for some of the issues I mentioned; in combination with the high-end price of the product. Also, I've only ridden these things for one day - I gotta give them more time, see how they wear, and if I can "feel" the difference. I'll keep you posed as I learn more about them!

[refried]

I have about 10 days on my FR2s and am very happy with them. Before using them I Loctited everything that I was sure I wouldn't change and those screws have not moved. yesterday I moved my heelcup and didn't Loctite the screws and paid for it on my last run today, The screw fell out, and I took a nice slide on the ice. When I got home I had an Email from the folks at Catek saying that they would be sending out new screws with Loctite patches to cure the Loose screw problem and new longer allen wrenches to make sure everything is tight. Nice to see that they are doing this even though it only takes a second to do it yourself. My bindings are back together with Loctite on all screws. I keep a set of allen wrenches in my pocket, I'll just have to make sure I check the screws occasionally.

[Jrobb]

While the Nidecker ratchets are metal, but they seem to give out and stop tightening after a certain amount of pressure is achieved. This is a real problem! Some of the ratchets did this more than the others. I am disappointed with them and I don't know if this is how they are supposed to work or if I have 1 or 2 that are defective. I get the feeling the spring isn't strong enough to grab the plastic ribbed strap under high tension. I wonder if the FR2-limited version uses better ratchets? -- Regardless, I wanted my straps righter and I couldn't do it with these ratchets! On the plus side, when they are engaged they hold well and don't slip (it's just adding additional tension that is the issue). They release easily, and they seem durable since they are all metal.

I've had the Nidecker Pro 800's for 3 years and the ratchets do the same thing. I've only had one time the heelstrap released on me and that was after augering my 4807 into the side of a gully going about 25mph. It was enough to bend the metal tip protector of the board and delam it back 3". And sadly it didn't just slip back a couple teeth, it came completely undone. It still works like "normal" though. Mine have "slipped" while cranking then for the last 2years but I've not really thought of it much as I get sufficient hold. You can push down on the ratchet part near the teeth (past the release tab) as you crank to get a tad more pressure...like pushing the ratchet into the ladder strap.

J

[EndUser]

I have about 10 days on my FR2s and am very happy with them. Before using them I Loctited everything that I was sure I wouldn't change and those screws have not moved. yesterday I moved my heelcup and didn't Loctite the screws and paid for it on my last run today, The screw fell out, and I took a nice slide on the ice. When I got home I had an Email from the folks at Catek saying that they would be sending out new screws with Loctite patches to cure the Loose screw problem and new longer allen wrenches to make sure everything is tight. Nice to see that they are doing this even though it only takes a second to do it yourself. My bindings are back together with Loctite on all screws. I keep a set of allen wrenches in my pocket, I'll just have to make sure I check the screws occasionally.

Yah, sounds like I best put locktite on everything. So far Ive done the the toe strap bolts, but I'll probably set more. Do you also have the issue with the toe strap flopping forward when you are in 'skate' mode? I'm wondering if maybe I should put another rubber washer in the assembly to add some friction.

[refried]

My straps seem to fall back into the bindings and stay there, I don't have to do a lot of skating at Baker, so maybe I don't notice them flopping around.

One thing I did notice is that the screw holes tapped into the baseplate are a little big for the screws (It looks like the tap was run in a little deep when the anodizing was cleaned out of the threads). I thought I had stripped the threads on the baseplate when I lost the heelcup screw because it threaded in so easily, then I checked the others and found that they were the same way. I have them in with Loctite now, but I think I may put some longer screws with Nylocks or cap nuts in place of the short screws. I was also thinking of adding a second screw to the heelcup, but I think with them being thru bolted it will make this unnecessary.