Plate insert patterns (UPM, Allflex)

[rjnakata]

On 7/11/2019 at 5:45 AM, skategoat said:

You can see that the mounts screw into the 4x4 holes but the plate axles are pushed out towards the nose and tail.

It sounds like the Apex 4x4 mount system solved the problem that others weren't able...outboard  axles and mounting in the thick portion of the board.  Would you say this is the ideal mounting system then?  

Edited July 15, 2019 by rjnakata

[SunSurfer]

Utilisation of any 4x4 insert plate system then depends upon what the actual spacing is between the front and back insert sets and what the designed offset is from the centre of the effective edge. I own a snowboard where the max C to C stance distance using the 4x4 inserts is 48cm, and another where the distance is over 60cm. 

Any design is a series of tradeoffs and compromises. Long isolation plates with long interaxle distances give greater torsional resistance but need to have their inserts in a thinner part of the core.

Most plates have a restricted choice of interaxle distances determined by the holes that allow the plate to be screwed to the isolation mechanism. Bomber's 4x4 mechanism has considerable positioning flexibility to allow a working combination of the boards 4x4 insert packs and the BBPs interaxle distance options. But I still struggled to find good combinations on some of my boards. 

The advantage of a 12.9 cm X 3 cm pattern (Apex/UPM/????) or the AllFlex pattern is that the board designer has optimised the board's whole construction around a plate being used and fitting a plate is then generally very straightforward. 4x4 setups, in my experience, take much more fiddling to get the best performance.

Edited July 16, 2019 by SunSurfer

[Jack M]

Late to the party, summer whizzed by.  A few items:

Based on my conversations with Fin at the time, the motivations for calling it UPM were not nefarious.  Nobody is trying to get rich in this industry, so there is no point in cutthroat tactics.  Fin and Sean recognized that the Apex plate was the state of the art then, and wanted to make that insert pattern into an industry standard.  This was intended to be a good thing for Apex and everyone else because then stock boards could be made to that standard and people could try different plates on one board.  This made Apex's plate (and Bomber's and Donek's and Jasey Jay's and whoever else's) more accessible as people could get into the world of plates without having to buy a custom board for every plate.  I think keeping the ASIP name would have decreased the likelihood of the pattern becoming standardized, IMO.

This is all somewhat moot because Allflex/Iron Rock have basically conquered the racing market for now.  A shame, because the Apex is awesome for freecarving, and still good for racing, if not at the top levels.  Kessler is not even making stock UPM boards anymore.  Good thing you can get an Apex plate with Allflex hardware, or swap your X-Plate's UPM hardware for Allflex hardware.

The 4x4 version the Bomber Boiler Plate also properly moved the axles towards the tip and tail so that your feet were mostly inboard of them.

[TimW]

Does snow getting stuck between a plate and the board ever become a problem?

The plate I will make will be quite close to the board, I wonder if I should give it a bit of a V-shaped bottom and ptex it.

 

[pokkis]

Some type snow is problematic, regadless what you do.

[lowrider]

14 hours ago, TimW said:

Does snow getting stuck between a plate and the board ever become a problem?

 

 

It's only a problem if you have difficulty handling the added weight not to the point that it packs in so tight it prohibits the plate from performing. Mostly a negative for those who don't like or won't try a plate (convenient excuse in my opinion) given that a plate is best used when conditions are rather poor in the first place. My plate is 5mm off the board in the middle and the snow that does get between plate and board is only a problem when cleaning it out to put it in the car. In my opinion v shape not need or the added weight of ptex. Wax or Pam cooking spray would serve as well.

[pokkis]

To clarify my comment, i seen issues only with plates with duck nose, that gathers some cases snow which makes nose work wrong way.

Never had any issues with snow below/between bindings.

[TimW]

Ok, thanks for the feedback. I will put PA12 topsheet on both sides of the plate for protection, that is quite good for snow, so should be fine then. 

[Jack M]

Anyone got the Vist (not Vistflex) hole pattern?  Asking for a friend.

Edit - I asked Bruce.  He said:

"Vist holes are done at 130mm width and directly on the centerline in between the normal set of insert holes"

Edited April 14, 2020 by Jack M
update