Guest jschal01 Posted November 1, 2005 Report Share Posted November 1, 2005 The AASI forum seems to me to have a pretty good signal/noise ratio all things considered. Discussion of pipe edge changes was good, for instance, if a bit geekish in places. Having been exposed to a limited to degree to several different sports' teaching organizations, I'd say AASI does a good job actually trying to promote teaching of sound technique relative to the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpinegirl Posted November 1, 2005 Report Share Posted November 1, 2005 this is noisy, sorry. this whole "schlept" of garbelly gook has been very frustrating. and it shows in my fabulous posts (grains of salt). i will admit that i was spoiled during my first encounter with an actual member of AASI staff. it was none other than the infamous tom vickery so i had a grand old time during my exam. i find it odd that KC feels the need to act all rebellious just because he's riding a twin tip. i've met him. i know that he rides extremely well, is always pushing himself and really does know his stuff. oh, and is a blast to work with according to all the people who had him as an examiner last year from my area. but i wouldn't accept him as a coach of my alpine riding, especially in light of racing. in a coaching situation i want someone who is willing to invest as much (and usually much more) effort into it as i am. to me that includes riding the gear. aspects of riding are altered by the gear that we ride and how it is set up. i do believe that riding alpine can aid people in becoming better instructors. i do believe that the strict focus on freestyle is limiting to the organization. i've become a better rider and have gained a greater understanding of snowboarding due to riding both plates and softies. the discussion on the aasi forum that took place regarding this thread at least brought up some valuable points. obviously i have been frustrated (yes phil, i wrote the second essay as well and timed out) by discussions both here and on AASI. there is truly a lot of crap on the AASI forum, just as there is a considerable amount of crap on this forum. crap rooted in attitudes and understanding. but that is human nature, and the best we can hope for is that we learn as we spout off our opinions. i believe in ANKLES!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sickmove Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 Cindy- I'm also bummed that you had that experience. I know that I have been lucky that all of my experiences with AASI have been very positive. I echo Phil in that I am stoked you are still in the industry. I hope that you realize that we are not all like those you speak of. Phil- I'm with you for sure about the manual. It's a base point for those who want to learn about riding, teaching and learning. I have my own ideas and theories that move away from the manuals and handbooks, and have brought them up and backed them up at exams and what not. From my experiecne, those who can back up their ideas has always passed an exam, even if they were debating examiners. Alpine- I was rebelious with my twin tip expecting to get flamed for being involved in AASI and for not rocking hard boots. That was silly of me. In fact, I'm looking at my Burton Reactor boots right now, thinking about finding some plates (a little help?) and giving it another shot this season. I didn't realize that hard booting was as large as it obviously is. Don't get mad :) I just don't see it on the hill. BOL has changed the way I think about it. SYOTH- KC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncermak Posted November 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 KC... I'll set you up with some Cateks for a while...especially if you come down and ride with us... -Noah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timinor Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 Cindy, I taught snowboarding in Sun Valley back in the early '90s. I had a great experience with the snowboard school, the snowboard director and other instructors. We were pretty much on our own and helping each other with a new and growing sport. But...then the PSIA came to town so we could all be certified. I won't go into details but they were a bunch of arrogant, self-important a$$holes. They were the smartest people in the room condescending to us for the entire 2 or 3 days. They were all PSIA SKI clinicions who had started boarding and so were now the experts. The PSIA, of course, had turned their noses down at snowboarding for many years but then realized they were getting left at the station so they jumped on the bandwagon. But they didn't just jump on the bandwagon, they now claimed they BUILT the bandwagon. I remember one guy had only begun snowboarding the previous November and it was now March...but he was a ski clinicion something something so that made him an expert. During a chairlift conversation, we asked him a question that refered to beginning lessons and he said arrogantly, "Oh, I don't teach beginning lessons." My instructor buddy and I looked at each other thinking, "Who do you think you are? 90% of the lessons are for first timers." I remember trying some of their "clever" drills on classes. I asked the students if those drills helped. To a one, the students said the drills were crap. The PSIA are a bunch of elitist snobs who sit around and tell each other how important they are and how smart they are. The clinicions travel around to ski areas and hold clinics with puppy dog instructors who have to kiss their a$$ to earn their next merit badge. "Wow, that drill really helped," the puppy dogs all gleefully say. The PSIA clinicions all go home and think, "Wow, I'm incredible." Look at skiing today and how much it has changed in the last 10 years. I would say 100% of those changes (shaped skis, parks, pipes, big air, skier X) came from snowboarding. The PSIA did not effect one change. Where were the PSIA genius' 15 years ago advocating they put some sidecut into the skis so you can turn the darn things? I know nothing about the AASI. I only know about the PSIA and how they were. I honestly doubt they have changed one bit. By the way, I passed the exam but chose not to pay the money to receive my merit badge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jschal01 Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 Funny thing about the drills, don't know which ones were in question but I do know that the drills in the Tech article part of this website were distilled from a discussion last year of drills to which Lowell Hart contributed quite a bit among others. A teaching approach that utilizes drills is going to be inherently less fun if the drills are any good -- they are changing a movement pattern that feels more natural to the student than the one the drill is trying to instill. Giving a bunch of "clever" drills to be used could even be viewed as closer to coaching as per this discussion. In terms of criticizing the AASI/PSIA for not driving innovation, I'd say they seem to have been relatively fast in both cases to try to take what's useful to the recreational rider/skier from the evolution of modern equipment and technique. Technique-wise, look at say some of the AASI demo photos and they are consistently much closer to modern racing technique, softboots and all, than most of the images that appear on this site. People criticize them for freestyle emphasis, but again that is where the sport is, they are being responsive to demand. Criticize them for poodle turns, well I don't know if instructors really should always be riding at the edge of control where they look a bit more dynamic, that is a difference between a lot of coaching and teaching, but not necessaorily a negative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpinegirl Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 hmmmm, i sense an AASI/hardbooter clinic open to hardbooters and AASIers, with one goal being to get all those weird ed staffers out on plates. everybody would have to ride plates and follow phil. maybe even PSR would come out to play. and of course this would just be experiential learning, working towards writing an article for the prestigious publications and seeing if we can make the groomers cry. of course beer and wings would have to be involved. but really just have a gathering to butt heads and talk and see what people actually think. get some fabulous photos all over the place (um, this isn;'t a trail and frankly, we don't know where we are). it would be an interesting environment in which to play with AASI AASI does have good info, and i think that acknowledging this aspect of riding would help move the industry forward by disallowing ignorance. if instructors are supposed to know their stuff, then this should be included under the heading of "stuff." dang, i really need snow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 I thought PSR and AASI saw something less than eye to eye. Maybe I'm misremembering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncermak Posted November 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 alpine girl - I love the way you think. maybe at ECES? of course I'm poartial to something else since I can't make SES or ECES... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sickmove Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 What's a poodle turn? What's PSR? I'm in, if I can make it. Love to be coached...er...taught...er... :D Couldn't resist:eplus2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jschal01 Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 A poodle turn means a turn rehearsed to the point where it looks like a poodle trotting during Westminster, as opposed to a dog running in the field. AKA showdog turns. In one of these related threads a few people have mentioned that instructors at some resorts all seem to ride the same, depending on perception this could be viewed as the poodle turn phenomena. I actually don't think this is always a bad thing where it exists. Think whether the instructor with the rehearsed turn would be riding better or worse if he or she hadn't worked to get to that point? The poise can be beautiful of itself. I also note that some racers with really good technique, e.g. Jasey Jay Anderson, look almost the same, hands arms and body always in the same place at the same time. It can become annoying when combined with Rampant Boyscout Leader Syndrome, however. In each good there is the potential for bad. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sickmove Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 I like it! Thanks. Not going to ask about boy scout leaders though:lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 PSR == Pre-school Rider, AKA Eric Brammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sickmove Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 I thought Brammer invented the halfpipe.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Gendzwill Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 I don't know about that, I do know he's been riding and teaching a long, long time and is one of the most helpful people around on the net. He mostly hangs around the freecarve forums, or did last year - they're kind of dead this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostertwo Posted November 3, 2005 Report Share Posted November 3, 2005 I don't know about poodle turns or boy scouts, but I do know that aasi-rm is offering a <a href="http://www.snowfun4you.web1000.com/AASI-RM-Snowboard-Race-Clinic.html" target="http://www.snowfun4you.web1000.com/AASI-RM-Snowboard-Race-Clinic.html">race clinic</a> this year (not just for folks in hardboots but most will be, I suspect).<p></p><img src="http://tinypic.com/erzxp2.jpg" alt="Unknown Rider, Aspen Grand Prix"><p></p>Clinic offerings are determined by each division. If you want to see hardboot stuff on the calendar, let 'em know. Then help promote it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Marty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Wow ! You guys have A LOT free time. Hows the line from Aspen extreme go ? " We're all just teaching people how to slide down the hill with sticks on their feet ?!?! " ( or something like that. ) Don't get hung-up one the " teaching " part. I think, IMO that who ever ( coach or instructor, I am neither, since it was asked... ) spends more time with a "student" will get more / better results. Can " we " atleast agree on that ? I can understand one is proly better than the other... is arguing on the internet ( Don't make me, post the picture. LOL. You seen it... ) the best way to convice someone ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfell Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Yeah Booster, it's about time Tyler got a little press time. There is little that an AASI person could teach Tyler, but a good coach can take him to the Olympics. Sorry, but sometimes the truth hurts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpinegirl Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 well, the idea is really just to have people come out to play. and honestly, brammer is very knowledgable and actually quite helpful out on the hill. oh, and a lot of fun to ride with. no "governing body," with the exception of nature. so i am thinking it would be separate from SES and ECES and all that funness. kinda like seeking out neutral territory for anyone who comes. it couldn't even really be called a clinic. simply folks riding and talking and observing. no silly badges or nametags. and yeah, the race clinic thing is cool booster. unfortunately i can't travel that far to play. i also get the impression that there is a healthier population of hardbooters out that way than in say, western NY. there are pockets of activity on the east coast too. we may find ourselves making that request for next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boostertwo Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Yeah Booster, it's about time Tyler got a little press time.There is little that an AASI person could teach Tyler, but a good coach can take him to the Olympics. Sorry, but sometimes the truth hurts. Hi Phil, I've seen Tyler ride and that truth doesn't hurt one bit. He rips. I was stoked to video him and some of Thedo's SWSC riders when they were at the Basin last spring. I used the image because I felt it showed strong riding--not to suggest that Tyler was in an aasi race clinic. To clarify, 'aasi people' aren't running this clinic--it is offered to help aasi instructors learn more about racing, and coaching, from someone who has coached at an international level of competition. I've never trained with Nick before, but I'm looking forward to it as he's apparently helped coach Klug, Kosglow, Price, and other US Team riders. Sorry you can't make it alpinegirl--no stupid nametags, titles, or badges. Just good info and lots of riding. At least that's what I heard. B-2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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