philfell Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 When did you first try to link turns with your body dragging on the snow. We'll use the honer system here, but please be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfell Posted March 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Come on nearly 50 views and nine votes?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Randy S. Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I can't get laid. And what do skies have to do with anything? Did you mean skis? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdboytyler Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I think you need an accompanying poll with questions like: *I can do a laid out frontside turn. *I can do linked laid out turns. *I can do linked laid out turns, but it's lame, so I don't. Phil, are you the same Phil that will be coaching in Chile with Anton Pogue? Too bad my budget doesn't allow spending a week or so in a summer race clinic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfell Posted March 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I am the same that will be down south with Anton this summer. We are working hard to keep the cost to a minimum, so don't write it off yet. The question isn't if you can do them or not. The question is if you've tried. Sorry Randy I ment skis. It would be hard to lay out on the sky, I guess if you had a parachute. Sorry for the bad spelling, an issue I've been working through since I started spelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trikerdad Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Was trying to do it about 12 years ago, long before I had seen anyone else do it but was told (and finally convinced) by "racers" that it was all wrong. After visiting the Swoard site last year, I remembered that it had been the most fun I had had on a board and went back to it. All the "racers" I used to ride with have moved on to other things but I'm having more fun than ever on the snow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARCrider Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 I'm finding this year that I'm trying harder than ever to not touch the snow but the snow is coming closer to me. The linked laid out turns are happening on the steeps without really trying. Might be self preservation kicking in, dragging the body to slow down. In my fourth full season of riding alpine, still learning lots and still having fun. My face tan shows it. Besides the goggle and helmet lines, I've got grin tan. Two little white lines where my face creases when grinning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Todd Stewart Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 i was always told it was called euro-carving, i never heard of ec untill i started posting on this site a couple of years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted March 17, 2005 Report Share Posted March 17, 2005 Back in the day (late-90's) when the terrain park at Killington was at the Ram's Head lift, my friend Blake used to like to do big wide carves down the slope after the park and then do a really big laid out 180 toeside and then trace it back switch at the flat right before the chairlift... anyways he told me this was "eurocarving" a silly/stylish move that people used to do. Eventually I started doing them as well, but only on toesides. I've never actually tried to linked the laid out turns because I always try them on a flat wide area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarvCanada Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 link laid out turns... on skis?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnovak Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 phil, I never heard of laid turns on skis -- do you mean leaned over extreme enough to get your hands in the snow? Can do that, but can't imagine getting much lower because the inside leg gets in way. Would love to see pics/vids of skiers going all the way over, like so-called EC but on skis! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hagen Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 Check out this website for carvers on skis.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordy Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 O-yea I am bringing Skis on Saturday for the u-know what filming!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baka Dasai Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 ...but I've done a few toeside ones accidentally. I have the same type of "accident" on heelsides, but on heelsides the natural tendency is to sit upright so it's not really laid-out. Anyway, it just doesn't appeal to me - I guess I must be some sort of carving purist. I don't want to touch the snow - I want to be balanced on the edge while feeling as many Gs as possible. Also, when I have (accidentally) done them, the turn was ridiculously tight and fast so that it would be very difficult to get the timing right - I think I'd need a bigger board for it to work properly. But I often use the EC push-pull technique on easier slopes because it's fun and graceful. As far as I can tell it's just cross-under turns with an upright stance and a lot of upper-body rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ar(angel Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 I'm able to pull them off on my toeside, especially on steeps, but can't quite get them on my heelside, I usually fall down and do the "pop back up and hope no one saw me" thing. On the steeps, it's not so much that I'm trying to do them, but more like ARCrider said, I'm having to get that low because I'm trying to stay alive....:D I would like to pull them off both toe & heelside though, maybe next season :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mark Jeangerard Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 I voted only after I saw the EC guys do it but it would have only been a matter of days.... My bro and I were trying a bunch of stuff we found on the internet. Some of Jacks articles, the CERN site. Mid to late 90s? We had been doing toeside "Fishhooks" for years, finishing a run by getting as low as possible in a straight line, then leaning over and extending through the rest of the turn until laying out, chest down on the snow. The resulting trench looking like a fish hook. One day it dawned on me that a heelside fishhook should be possible and I started doing them. A few weeks later I wondered if I could link the two. I thought, if I didn't drive it uphill, I could keep some speed for the next turn. By coincidence, I found a short two turn video of Patrice from uphill right at that time. Then I knew it was possible and started doing them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnovak Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 thanks Hagen and Crave2carve -- I was looking for such a site, but couldn't find anything. Damn, they "stole" my idea -- after experiencing carving on a board I figured that would be cool for skis too if you had super-shaped wide skis. Looks like I'm just behind the times. :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hagen Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 mnovak, you're not behind the times - just on the wrong continent. :D Last time I was skiing/snowboarding in Austria (9 or ten years ago...) they were really starting to get into carving back in Europe (I guess the shaped skis that started to be marketed helped...). You could see alot of people carving it up. ...and b.t.w. the better carvers on skis also didn't use poles... Hagen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtslalom Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 I tried linking Euro-Carves in 1990-91 season on my Burton PJ. The one that was white and pink. Success happened at the end of this season, some of my friends were doing it on their soft boards. One kid was carving Euro style on his Look Lamar trick stick and another guy on his Kemper freestyle board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astrokel Posted March 18, 2005 Report Share Posted March 18, 2005 Can link laid out toeside with an inclinated heelside but not fully extended both sides... the hand touching the snow is not for support but for a gauge of how much further you can go and just because it feels good! Any of you motorcyclists out there that have ridden on the track and gotten your knee down on the tarmac at 70 mph knows what I'm talking about :D ! Been working on heelside but I think I need a bigger scr on the board to do it (been riding my Incline exclusively this year, can get my butt near/skimming the snow with a lot of angulation but the layout eludes me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philfell Posted March 20, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2005 Bump. Trying to keep this up top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kipstar Posted March 21, 2005 Report Share Posted March 21, 2005 Well, I guess technically you could say people were already doing pretty much every type of turn in the 80s prior to the real explosion in snowboarding. However, despite claims by various ppl, nowhere have I seen people ride like P&J prior to seeing it on their videos. Since then, I have seen some guys in Tahoe riding the same style with (IMHO) comparable skill to those guys (as can be seen in the videos anyway); namely a guy called James Ong, who rides with grace, power and gets right down on the snow without appearing to try. As a former racer, my interest does not really drive me to specifically learn this style of turn, although from time to time, I feel like I am getting pretty low, more so on toeside than heelside, from the hips up - in general I prefer to ride with my upper body straighter than the EC style of laying it right over. So, my thoughts are not coming from a "I am trying to EC" viewpoint. From what I have seen with snowboarding, and many other sports, techinically being able to do something, compared to technically being able to do something effortlessly are two different things. It is fairly debateable whether what Bauer and Nerva were doing 10+ years ago is even in the same park as what those EC guys do now; certainly their technique approach on the asym boards and seeming lack of push pull technique that I can vaguely remember suggested that they instead pretty much used to fall into turns and let the board carve through it, and these were almost all toe sides not linking to anything. Those purecarve videos look like nice carving, but they don't seem to be the same thing as the EC guys. And the short video from Bordy isn't quite high enough quality to compare, but again while very good riding we are not talking hip and shoulder to the snow turn after turn after turn. And in terms of all the guys I used to see riding 10 years ago (including the US amateur nationals held in Mammoth, Japanese national team, a few of the Euro ski teamers out snowboarding) I never saw anyone ride anything like the EC website. Yep, snow has a lot to do with it, but I've ridden with an EC rider in Tahoe on fairly hard snow, and he had no problem pretty much replicating the video moves for the steepest groomers on the mountain. So my vote goes to not having seen it b4; although then again you don't see much snowboarding here in Thailand :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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