RCrobar Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Would using a heel CABLE rather than a than a traditional heel bail, in theory and for the sake of a discussion, work on a standard style snowboard binding (ie the TD2)? Why you say? Well, in all my years of snowboarding I have broken very few pieces or parts of my equipment, I am not that hard on my equipment. The EXCEPTION to this has been heel bails, which I have broken on a variety of bindings. This past weekend I snapped the rear foot heel bail of my TD2 Standards. (Fin has been absolutely fantastic helping me out with the bails, by the way!) I’m hoping to hear what the engineers etc., or anyone with an opinion, has to say about this idea. Pros and cons etc. When a work shop hack, me, ponders this idea it seems that a cable could eliminate the single fatigue point (the paper clip wiggling back and forth) that occurs when using a traditional bail. I do remember reading about Rat Trap bindings, built in Vancouver I think, but I have never actually seen these bindings. I’m pretty sure they used a cable system to hold the boots in place? Thanks, in advance, for your thoughts. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirror70 Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Due to its flexible nature, it would be hard to take up the slack in the cable. You would also be trusting yourself to a couple of cable crimps. I've broken enough of those to know I'd much rather trust a screw. Where and how did you break the bails? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCrobar Posted March 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Hi Mirror70 The binding broke while simply riding/carving, sometimes carving pretty hard by weekend warrior standards. This particular day was pretty icy with some steeper sections here and there. The bails tend to break where the rounded part of the bail (that holds the boot) and where the straight section (that connects to the lug) meets. The bail was really bent or deformed before it broke, so I was worried it may go. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 I have seen some people set their bindings way too tight. this causes a few things to happen 1 bindings to break 2 crack boots 3 distort boots, actually to arch boots while in the binding 4 it can accelerate the wear where the bails make contact with the toe and heel blocks, this is not really a issue with bombers due to the design Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCrobar Posted March 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 No, they are definately not too tight. If anything I tend to adjust them to a minimum 'tightness.' Thoughout last season, a half dozen times or so, I had to re-adjust (tighten) both my front and rear toe bails. At first I thought my boot was very cold and had shrunk. Later I realized that the bails were 'stretching/bending' causing the overall bail to loosen off. Eventually the heel bails seemed to form to the shape of the boot and I no longer had to tighten the bails. I haven't adjusted them this season. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirror70 Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Originally posted by RCrobar The bails tend to break where the rounded part of the bail (that holds the boot) and where the straight section (that connects to the lug) meets. The bail was really bent or deformed before it broke, so I was worried it may go. That sounds to me like you're not keeping the bails or the heel/toe blocks tight enough. The heel & toe blocks should be tight enough that when you pull up the toe clip it is very very firm - not so snug that it will distort the boot, but firm enough that if there is even a little snow on the lip of the boot, you can feel (with your foot) the boot distort when you engage the clip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 I think in order for a cable to work, the shape of the heel ledge on the boot would also have to change. A cable would probably just slip off the existing heel ledge. I don't think it would stay on at the corners. The SS bail must be work hardening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Todd Stewart Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 well i know i'm swithing to to step in's because i keep blowing out of my standard bails no matter how much i tighen them up. Its gotten to the point where I can't get my boot in the bails if the weather is warm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RCrobar Posted March 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Hi Bob Hey, my thread has already been hijacked:) Any comments on the cable idea? I agree, I didn’t break the bails through a hard impact. I also feel it is a result of small, micro bends.’ No, I don’t think I have improperly installed the boots/bindings. I do feel it is the way I am riding and my set up. The rear boot, which is very stiff, is set at 46 degrees. Add to this a skate/surfboard rotation of the hips, knees and ankles and I think the bail is being ‘wiggled’ back and forth, on each toe then heel side turn, as the boot levers the bail. Yes, the bails break in the same place each time, but I have only broke one TD2 bail. The first time I can recall breaking a bail was in the late 80’s early 90’s. The bindings were a set of Emery Surfs, I was using a cheap pair of rear entry ski boots. YES, the bail then and the bail now broke in pretty much the same location. I have sent you pictures of the bent, then broken bail. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark.Andersen Posted March 2, 2005 Report Share Posted March 2, 2005 Rob, I think Chris Prior has a set of rattraps hanging about somewhere. I saw them bolted to a demo WCR once. Perhaps you can check them out if you get up to Whistler. If I recall correctly, there were still normal heel and toe bails on the rattraps. The cable was actually used to adjust the size. So I think you'd have the same problem with those bindings as well. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 Wouldn't the micro-movement of the SS cable saw the heel piece with each movement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirror70 Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 Wouldn't be a problem if the cable is laminated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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