Odd Job Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Just to let you guys know. I've read all the info on "tech files" + did a lot of forum searches. I've read that cross-through is used a lot at slalom g's, when I watch youtube videos of it, their cross through looks very weird. It's extended. then only at the moment of transition they suck their legs up and fling their cog over the board (hence cross over + cross under mix) I see pics on the tech files of cross-through, it seems like more of a "push pull" in extreme carving where one leads to the next. How do you ride on ice? I tend to skid out as the g-forces build up really fast. Should I be letting the g forces build up a lot, but stay angulated? I realized I get better edge grip somewhat if I stay low (but then I dont' have room to do a cross-through) I've started this year and have ridden around 52 times. On +30/+15 softboots/board. I can sometimes make it down a run without falling carving hard, most of the time not. Have tried "angulation" ala bomber style without upper body rotation, then with rotation, push pull, EC push pull (only got the toe side fully laid down), proactive (push pull) of my cross unders, or just regular cross unders. blah blah. Been experimenting/riding a lot and would love some advice on carving in the ice coast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Cross-through and push-pull are very similar. Basically the same, but cross-through does not include the rotation technique of the EC style. On ice, yes, you need to stay very angulated and really finish your turns. Carving round turns controls speed, gliding between carves allows speed to build, which is why you want to do a quick cross-through to minimize time between carves. You're right that when you're very low you don't have room to cross-under, hence the need to rise up a little as if you're starting a cross-over, and then finish the transition with a cross-under. This is cross-through. The point is to move as little mass as possible when changing edges. Move the light parts (board, boots, lower legs) under the heavy parts (the rest of you) instead of moving the heavy over the light. Of course, if conditions are good enough you don't have to do this, and then a big cross-over can be really fun - that's when you get that weightless feeling, or even catch air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd Job Posted February 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Thank you. For the cross-through, should I be "transitioning" aka lessining edge angle as i'm "pulling" the board. or try to maintain pretty much about the same edge angle for a while as i'm "pulling" the board? This IMO (novice opinion!) is the difference between a cross-through/push pull? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd Job Posted February 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 "You're right that when you're very low you don't have room to cross-under, hence the need to rise up a little as if you're starting a cross-over, and then finish the transition with a cross-under. This is cross-through." Meaning.. My legs are bent so low I need to "stand up" aka extend my legs only enough to bend them back? hence cross over + under cross-through? OR. I'm low as in My legs are extended but my body is low to the ground, and i cross under with my legs, but sine my body is so low already i also go up a little, hence cross over + under? :P --edit-- oops realized above push pull is like cross-through NM lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 I think you've got a good grasp on it, but you may be over-thinking it. Go out and ride and think about these things and see what works for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Prokopiw Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 I think you've got a good grasp on it, but you may be over-thinking it. Go out and ride and think about these things and see what works for you. with a young coach who has been giving me pointers whenever he sees me at the pool.I decided to make it official and book him for privates(amazingly inexpensive). His first official advice;"You've got a good grasp of things,but you're over thinking it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 with a young coach who has been giving me pointers whenever he sees me at the pool.I decided to make it official and book him for privates(amazingly inexpensive).His first official advice;"You've got a good grasp of things,but you're over thinking it." lol, these technique threads sometimes kinda make my head hurt. yeah, I agree with the over thinking it part. now I just need to stop over weighting it...... <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukgidvjfeek&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukgidvjfeek&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd Job Posted February 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 The thing is, nearly all of them work for me up to a certain point, lol. Question, would you guys agree rotation feels better/is more effective? (carver's almanac suggests using rotation a lot) I can also ride like the extreme carving guys when they do the quick s turns, it kind of feels nice prerotating with the upper body. But then sometimes I decide to use a quiet upper body, blah blah. It's fun experimenting, but I would really like to get better really really fast. Fun fact: yesterday I went from double forearms on the snow (I'm aware even with both forearms on the snow you can kind of bend down and cheat, but it's very slight when it's forearms, not hand), to ---> my stomach, chest, everything totally on the snow on a softboot board with some toe overhang. It probably was a combination of me slightly picking myself up without realizing it? when I lookd back I saw a carved track, oh and I felt a crapload of chatter/shaking which was probably the boot out and/or when I watch the EC video, i see their nose chattering like hell. Personal thoughts: sometimes I think maybe the EC style might be better, although bomber style is used by racers on ice right? Especially with Bordy's review of the swoard and that one comment where he says it felt like some freeride boards he's ridden. (I'm riding a never summer heritage 160cm). blah yep I think about a lot of things. I'm gonna go ride out soon :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack M Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 Rotation is simply not necessary. But for some people it helps them find their balance, so that's good. If it works for you then run with it, but it is another movement that must be coordinated with everything else you're doing. I prefer a quiet upper body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carvedog Posted February 24, 2010 Report Share Posted February 24, 2010 lol, these technique threads sometimes kinda make my head hurt.yeah, I agree with the over thinking it part. now I just need to stop over weighting it...... "I could cut glass with these......" FTW?? About technique, not being an ice coaster and only partly able to comprehend the written language. If I am carving on Rocky Mtn pseodo ice ( we never have real ice here right? ) it seems to be more extending to the sides - and retracting across the fall line. FWIW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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