carving toeside - jack michaud,bob dea, william blake. rob stevens et al

[GeoffV]

from Bob Jenney

Many people, numbering in the hundreds, can testify that the technique Jack speaks of works and that he kills it just about everywhere on the mountain and in just about all conditions.

These very techniques are used by hundreds of riders as well.

While a friendly debate is one thing, championing one style while attacking a well known style, particularly when your style has been proven difficult to replicate in the free-carve arena, is narrow minded and confusing to newer riders. At best.

We all know that free-carving and racing techniques do not cross over well. While many riders can do both with a single set-up, they tend to be a select few who are physically gifted.

Your style may work for you, but it is not universally transferable and empirically obvious to the masses.

[nigelc]

"We all know that free-carving and racing techniques do not cross over well. While many riders can do both with a single set-up, they tend to be a select few who are physically gifted."

I have no loyalty to either camp.In a perfect world i would love to be able to do both. I am sure many of the posters here are better riders than me and so I am interested in what they have to say.

Of interest to me in the statement by Bob Jenney above is that the setup for each style may vary - how in general?

[JJFluff]

Hey Geoff, that has got to be one of the coolest signatures I have ever seen.

[BlueB]

Of interest to me in the statement by Bob Jenney above is that the setup for each style may vary - how in general?

I wouldn't worry about it. Figure out the setup that works for you and stick with it. Listen to all advice from people who seem to be knowledgable, try it out and see what worked for you, setup and technique wise.

[JJFluff]

I chose my setup 17 years ago. No exageration. I found a comfortable stance width, I put my bindings on like most, so that I would have little toe or heel drag, and went with it. In fact when I showed up to SES in 05 and wanted to demo gear, I couldn't even tell Fin what angles I was riding at. It wasn't that I didn't remember, I didn't even know.

My point is that comfort is really all that matters. Of course if your way to narrow, there will be problems and vice versa, you should know when you find that comfort level. At that point totally focus on technique. And try not to keep changing angles, and gear. Otherwise it will be tough to keep moving forward.

I've been on an alpine board for a long time, every day I find new movements, although slight that improve my riding. They allow me to go faster, ride smoother, or just feel something new. I know I have a different style than most, but so does most of us. But at least keep the gear somewhat constant so you can work on the riding. Thats how I look at it.

[carvedog]

In fact when I showed up to SES in 05 and wanted to demo gear, I couldn't even tell Fin what angles I was riding at. It wasn't that I didn't remember, I didn't even know.

JJ - that's awesome. For some of the overly tech guys - if they would spend half as much time riding as going over all the minutae of options of cants, angles, lifts, etc they might be better riders.

Sometimes there is the idea that my riding sucks, maybe if I change to 3 degree forward lean I will be a better rider. ????

Overthinking is a dangerous thing. Leads to brain seize and next to brain fart. And this one WD40 can't help.

Ride, rip, relax.

[JJFluff]

"Amen, Alleluia...where's the tylenol?" -Clark W. Griswald

[Kirk]

and not worry about allowing your knees to be together or not- when you're compressed, they should touch, as it's difficult to keep them separated, then- when you extend, they should come apart, as it will be physically impossible to make them touch, at that point.

Knees-together is a good , solid way to both tuck and to absorb racecourse ruts, washboard and chatter, by allowing both knees to work as one in such instances of multi-frequency "turbulence & feedback".

Interesting perspective. This completely contradicts my own experience as well as all the formal coaching (admittedly not an extensive amount) I've received on this very issue. I find the knees-together a very limiting position in absorbing chatter from chopped-up terrain. I know this approach is working for JJFluff and some others and that's great! Like Jack said, try 'em all and decide what works for you. The one thing I have noticed is that, on an aggressive heelside, occasionally my rear knee will come close to the top of the boot cuff of my front foot. That's as close to things coming together for me.

[David Glynn]

"We all know that free-carving and racing techniques do not cross over well."

Though it is very obvious to see the differences between the two styles I have always coached that if you want to become good on the race course you should free ride, free ride, free ride...................!!

Sorry no pics.

[GeoffV]

Hey Geoff, that has got to be one of the coolest signatures I have ever seen.

of course it is JJ:D:D:D Your the designer... Thanks again for putting this together for the ECES.

[Dave ESPI]

Night-riding yesterday on a perfect piste, I was watching some soft-booters carve with soul and style, dropping their front shoulders into toeside, and bring them out for heelside carves. Wanting to imitate and innovate, I decided to copy the basic movement but add a swing to it, building up momentum in my shoulders before I swung my whole body, front first, into each turn. If you're having trouble imaging this, think of swinging your left hand, followed by your shoulder and hips, from above and behind your front shoulder, down across that shoulder, to diagonally in front of your chest for a toeside turn, and back to the same position but behind your shoulders (lower than the position you rotated into toeside from, because that position is already part of the toeside turn) for a heelside carve.

This momentum build-up into each turn really helped me keep my weight over the nose of the board on both heel side and toe side. Coupled with weighting and unweighting the board by bending my knees up and down, I managed to get a board whose tail is a custom cut in what used to be the center-rear just behind the rear bending (see 'Rad-Air Custom Swallowtail' in videos) into jump turns, to carve more consistently and solidly on flat(ter) pistes, and finally to control the distance from my body and the piste on heel-side turns.

I don't know if this is 'driving' the board, and maybe it looks really silly, because people kept stopping to look at me ride down the mountain, but for someone like me who has no coach save for the forums, it's a good start. :p It felt nice too.

RIGHT ON !

This is very much how I self-taught to ride in softies, and carve efficently in such years ago without even knowing it was a "technique". When I transitioned to Carving with hardboots, the only adjustment I needed was to extend and flex the center of the board with a pinching of the knees and pulling of the tail twards the nose as I rolled over the the front of the board with the steering "sweep and drop" movement.

It does cause whip lash in some people as their heads turn when you arc past them, or from the chairlift as entire chairs of 6 people turn to look as you rip under them.... Sometimes I see it out of the corner of my eye, and Yeah... when I see it, its a great rush to know that we are doing something "different".

Had a guy today following me for a few runs and then he finally came up and talked with me for a while. We may have a new member in the forum soon :)