Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I know that most of you are hard booters, but is it possible to truly carve in softies? I tried the Norm this last weekend and did a toe side carve (at least I think so), but when I tried to do a heel side the only thing that happend was me looking up to the snow gods. Any help or recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 This is why they make harboots. Why dont they ski in soft boots?? Sure you can carve in soft boots, the responce and edge hold wont be the same, and they kind of board for soft boots just isn't going to be the same. its like driving a subaru vs a ferrari, you know you want the ferrari. I have the perfect board for you for sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 To tell you the truth, I have been thinking of buying a hard boot setup. I like the way the carve looks. Right now my attention is geared towards my son. This will be his first year in hard boots so we are trying to learn this carving thing together. So far it has been really painful for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pebu Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Don't let some people hear you say carving in softies is bad... Some swear by it. Personally I think there's nothing quite like hardboots. It's a pretty awesome feeling. But what it sounds like to me is you have heel overhang and you leaned too far and heeled out (heel causes your edge to come out of the snow). You might want to try to turn your feet more towards the nose so you have less overhang. Then again it could just be that you leaned too far for the speed you were going. IE you were going too slow and leaned too far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Thank for the input. I am not sure of what I did wrong. But I will adjust my bindings a little and see how that works out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 To tell you the truth, I have been thinking of buying a hard boot setup. I like the way the carve looks. Right now my attention is geared towards my son. This will be his first year in hard boots so we are trying to learn this carving thing together. So far it has been really painful for me. I dont know, I think you should have the same thing he is learning on. I mean if you are trying to teach him, I dont think it will translate as well for me alot of it is the board, and you cant use softies on an alpine board. We got you now!! resistance is futile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I don't feel like I am resisting, but rather wading in to see how the water is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I don't feel like I am resisting, but rather wading in to see how the water is. Its Ice cold and deep, VERY DEEP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 well, as far as the hardware aspect goes if you tell us what you're riding maybe even post pics of your setup with your boots in the binding we can eliminate gear issues. with the right softboot setup and the right rider you can carve fairly well on softboots. ohh and BTW, divebomber has obviously not driven a Subaru STI <embed style="width:400px; height:326px;" id="VideoPlayback" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docId=-7922588590192438290&hl=en" flashvars=""> </embed> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Well I ride an Option 164. My bindings are +15 front and +6 on the back. As I look at my board I did notice overhang on both toe and heel sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buell Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Nick, Welcome to Bomber! You can definitely carve on softies. It is a slightly different carve than in hardboots, but it is also a great feeling. Most of us here, as you mentioned, carve in hardboots, but there are a number of posters who only ride in softboots. Use the search function with terms and combinations of terms like: softboots, carve, softies, carving, freeride boards,....... You will find lots of information already posted about carving in softies. Be patient with your progress since there is a lot more technique to carving turns than to skidding turns. Enjoy, Buell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Thanks for all of the information. Never thought of the search function. It will give me something to do tomorrow at work. At least work will be productive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pebu Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Careful. It's very easy to spend a week of work straight just reading articles and stuff. Then after that it might die down a bit, but the forum keeps you hooked for a couple hours a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Prokopiw Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I've said it before but I'll say it again,some of the best carvers I have known were and still are softboot riders(Chris Sandoski at Vail for one,and about a dozen Aussies like Andrew Burton for others).I find that hardboots just make aggressive carving,bumps,landing big airs,cutting through crud ,one foot in while teaching and a few other things easier and more comfortable for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinpa Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 the way I look at it is this... You can carve in soft boots, but you can carve much easier with hard boots on a carving board with much less effort (less work). Anyone remember how it felt getting off a lift for the first time with hard boots? So much easier and effortless to make the board turn with only one foot. So, imagine how much easier it is to control the board with both feet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiveBomber Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 well, as far as the hardware aspect goes if you tell us what you're riding maybe even post pics of your setup with your boots in the binding we can eliminate gear issues.with the right softboot setup and the right rider you can carve fairly well on softboots. ohh and BTW, divebomber has obviously not driven a Subaru STI YOU WERE SAYING> <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0M73wYuD6k&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0M73wYuD6k&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object> Man now I really want a subaru! NOT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpalka Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Check this video for some tips on carving on softies: Not necessarily the style and technique that hardbooters strive for, but fun all the same :) tom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadBrad Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 It sounds like you are having problems with the heelside carve. I always had trouble making a good heelside carve, too, and still struggle with it sometimes. On the toeside it is easy to bend your knees to get the board up on edge. On the heelside, your knees don't bend that way so you really need to have good angulation. What helps me is to tuck my back knee behind my front knee and drive my knees toward the heelside edge of the board. To stay balanced you need to also move your upper body the opposite direction. Don't lean backwards over the heelside edge or you'll just fall over (although some advanced carvers and eurocarvers can do it). One thing that can help is to reach your rear arm toward your front toes as you start the heelside carve. This will help give you the upper body angulation you need while rotating your upper body toward the direction of the turn. It's a little hard to describe in words, but study carving photos and videos and it should make more sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex1230 Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 . What helps me is to tuck my back knee behind my front knee and drive my knees toward the heelside edge of the board. bad advice - read jack's articles - separate zee knees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pebu Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 As soon as I read that I knew somebody was going to say it. I know I'm gonna get yelled at but I don't care. I dislike the separate the knees technique. As soon as I separate the knees, that's when I start sittin on the toilet and counter rotating. With my knees in line, it helps keep my hips in line so I can actually get it down instead of the typical knees down, ass up, face down toeside carve. I've only got a season and a day on hardboots under my belt, so listen to the pros if you can, but I can't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Morgan Posted December 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Wow, It seems so over whelming. I suppose that I will just take it one step at a time and learn as I go. Thanks for all of your support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pow Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 As soon as I read that I knew somebody was going to say it. I know I'm gonna get yelled at but I don't care. I dislike the separate the knees technique. As soon as I separate the knees, that's when I start sittin on the toilet and counter rotating. With my knees in line, it helps keep my hips in line so I can actually get it down instead of the typical knees down, ass up, face down toeside carve.I've only got a season and a day on hardboots under my belt, so listen to the pros if you can, but I can't. I had that problem late last year when i realized that i was carving fairly well, but my knees were together and i could probably do better with them apart... well i tried pushing my back knee out to push them apart, and it destroyed my form. I couldnt hold a heelside and just skidded out every time. If that wasnt enough, I experienced "knee out" when i leaned it over too far on toeside, which is much more painful than boot out! I reverted back to knees closer together for the time being. This year i tried again but isntead of out, i pushed that back knee down, with great results! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadBrad Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I apologize if I gave any bad advice. I am not a coach or a super accomplished carver, so you certainly should give more weight to the advice of those who are. I was just saying what I have found works for me, so take it as one data point. I have been riding in hard boots for over 15 years now, but I don't ride that many days a year, so I haven't gotten really good at it. From other replies here, I am not alone as far as the knee tuck on heelside carves. Equipment setup might have something to do with it too. For the past several years I have been riding with my bindings flat (no cant) and a narrow stance (16-17"), which my boards were designed for. Perhaps a wider stance and/or some rear cant would reduce my need to tuck my knee. I don't know, but I'll experiment and find out. I just bought a new Prior 4WD and set it up with a 19.3" stance and more relaxed angles than I use on my narrow carving boards, and I'm eager to see how that works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinpa Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 I think (and I could be wrong....) that the heelside turn would be much easier if you angled the bindings up more and tried to align your hips more perpendicular to the board. Much easier to show than to explain!!!! You can get your body in that position with lower binding angles, but I think it puts a lot of unnesessary pressure on your knees. And with your bindings angled up more, you shouldn't have to worry so much about the toe/heel drag. I wear a women's 7.5 boot so I've never had that experience with my toes or heels dragging. However, I did get on another instructor's Fat Bob once where my toes barely came near the edge.... that was kind of wierd! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobdea Posted December 4, 2007 Report Share Posted December 4, 2007 Wow, It seems so over whelming. I suppose that I will just take it one step at a time and learn as I go. Thanks for all of your support. don't let it be, this place is the land of propeller headed geeks. What you're doing is pretty simple once you figure out what you need to do and if you have the proper gear. the biggest gear issue you could run into is toe and heel drag, the pictures in this thread are close to optimum for drag http://www.bomberonline.com/VBulletin/showthread.php?t=16976 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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