RCrobar

Hey Guys Ultimately your boot binding interface needs to let your body move the way you want it to, without restricting the movements your technique requires. IMHO I don’t think you can say standard or step in binding are too stiff or soft for a given rider until the boots and bindings are both taken into account, this would apply to flex in any direction. I spent some time experimenting with a step in and a standard set up a while back: -I rode Raichle 325’s (set to allow the lateral cant to move freely) and Burton Physics step-ins with the toe hooks and the softest pads. -I also rode Northwave Point 900’s and TD2 standards. At first I much preferred the 325’s and Burton Step ins, they allowed me to move freely. The Northwaves and TD2’s, both very stiff, gave me a handcuffed feeling that restricted my movements. After a lot of tweaking, adjusting and readjusting the Northwave TD2 standard set up, to get the movement I was after, I preferred the much stiffer Northwave boots and TD2’s. My preference changed for a few reasons... I didn’t have any problems with the 325’s and Burton's when the snow as groomed and smooth. I noticed a HUGE difference, however, when the snow was bumpy like harbour chop. I felt that the very stiff shelled boot and spring system, combined with the TD2 standards suspension system, made it possible to carve harder, cleaner lines faster and with less effort. The very stiff shell is the foundation of the spring system that makes it possible to control the amount of forward flex. But, doing this creates a boot with very little lateral movement. Using a softer shelled boot, to allow lateral movement, will eventually cause the shell buckled rather than support the spring system when under high loads, like the bumpy terrain. BUT, I have to say that all the time it took to modify the TD2’s and adjust the springs, etc. is a real pain in the a$$! With all things there is a compromise ... The standard TD2’s allow you to set the toe lever to have the desired lateral movement even though the stiff boots have no lateral give. This MAY lead to the binding bails bending and/or breaking. I know that Jacques went to huge effort and expense to make a few custom TD2 heel bails that are much stronger than the stock TD2 bails. So, what binding to buy? Depends how much of a perfectionist you are and how much you can handle workshop mods to your bindings. I think the F2 race bindings are the easiest to use out of the box. You have already read Jacques’ review that combined stiff boots and the stiff TD2 stepins. Perhaps it would be better to use your Burton bindings and Head boots for a while and spend your cash on a board that has a waist width that corresponds to your foot size and preferred binding angles? A set up like this would be excellent for learning the EC technique. This is my take on the boot binding thing. Take this with a grain of salt as I am a weekend hack. Rob

I'm pretty sure the boots are Northwaves. The .900's are grey with a blue tongue. The .950's are yellow with a black tongue. I know that the .950's came with stiffer springs, but I don't know if the shells are harder, softer or the same? Yeah, what are those plate things under his bindings?

What is the advantage of having a longer TD2 toe lever/bail? Is it a disadvantage to have a shorter OS2 or F2 race toe lever/bail?

Hi Bob When extremecaving the board/binding interface regularly reaches an angle of approximately 84 degrees. (Jacques Rilliet experimented with and clarified this point to me.) What I personally found was that in soft snow the longer TD2 bail did not cause boot out, the trench in the snow left a deeper mark from the toe lever hitting. The rider/carve was not really affected. When riding on harder snow the longer TD2 bail consistently caused the edge to kick out of the carve. It did not matter whether the slope was very flat or very steep. FYI (23.1 cm wide board, 13 m sidecut, Mondo Point 28.5 boot, 46 degrees rear) The only way to avoid the toe lever over hang was: 1) to use higher angles, something I did not want to do 2) or eventually modifying the Catek lever to fit the TD2’s. I love my TD2’s, but I really wish the damn toe bail/lever didn’t stick out so far. Rob

Interesting Discussion! An American wood saw cuts on the push stroke. As a result the saw blade is often thick, able to withstand being put under compression. A Japanese wood saw cuts on the pull stroke. As a result the saw blade is often thin, able to withstand being put under tension. The American and Japanese designs and technique for cutting a board are in opposition, but the end result is the same. When reading about and trying the Rotation and Static techniques, then further reading about the design differences in, for example, the Swoard and Madd boards it becomes very clear that the two designs and techniques for cutting snow are in opposition. The the end result is the same, carving down the mountain with a huge grin on your face! A quote from Dr Seuss’s ‘Green Eggs and Ham’ is perhaps in order: I do not like (insert preferred wood saw or snowboard philosophy here) Try them ... try them ... and you may! Trying to prove that one philosophy is better or worse is futile. Trying to understand both philosophies leads to an open mind. Rob

Hey Kelvin With the swing analogy I used the word *similar* because the ultimate goal of a golf drive and a snowboard turn are so different. I hoped to create a mental image of say a golfers rear foot twisting as the hips ‘snap’ through during a drive. But a golfer doesn’t start in a squatted position, stand up straight, then squat down again ... while this is exactly what a snowboarder does; very bent legs at the transition and straight at the apex of the turn. A better analogy of the leg movement is a kid swinging on a swing set. A child quickly learns when to ‘pump’ their legs is they want to go higher, maintain a constant swing height or slow down. Sensing when and how hard to push on a swing set is very similar to the finesse needed when bending and extending the legs during a boarding turn. One tip that may help is the slight ‘push off’ at the end of a this little push helps to break the edge from the turn, the legs are pulled through ready for the next turn. The stomach comment was meant to address the original Extreme carving question, before the thread was hijacked:) A better way to explain it might be the shoulders/hips are perpendicular to the tip/tail on the heel side but and are parallel to the tip/tail of the board on the toe side. With regard to the boots I agree with you, as long as you can move the way you want to all is good. The issue with the boots is more related to the spring system as a support system to protect the ankles. If a boot shell is soft it allows the lateral movement, but *may* not have enough support for the heel-toe boot flexing. The spring system is only as strong as the shell that supports it. So a soft shell lets you move laterally may collapse under a hard impact. Sounds like you are having fun, guess this is the main point! Cheers from one rookie to another. Rob

Hi The problems stems from the way the body needs to move with the push-pull, rotation, surfboard (what ever you want to call it) technique, the resulting stance angles and boot out. With this technique the body moves from leading hip to stomach, rather than hip to hip Don’t think of the rotation as a shoulder rotation, think of it as a combined hip and shoulder rotation (like they are fused together). Imagine a golfer, tennis or ice hockey player trying to swing without involving the core muscles (torso/hips) in the swing, not very effective. The rotation technique uses a similar approach. Step ins (stiff bindings and stiff boots for this example) really restrict the riders ability to roll the boot, permitting the hips and shoulders to come around. I took a video (on the carpet) of my rear boots movement inside the bails and couldn’t believe how much movement the standard bails allowed (Note - they are NOT designed to do this!) The step in cable, on my rear boot, KILLED, me when I tried step ins... pressure from trying to force the boot to move laterally. To have a strong rotations it helps to have the stance angles set a little lower, mid to high 40’s for the rear foot. If you have small feet you can use a 20 cm wide board, if your feet are big you will boot out. So the main issues I see are restricted movement and big feet booting out on a narrow board. If you can move the way you need/want to, your boots don’t kick the edge out and the snow is forgiving enough to hold the edge all will work IMHO. J,P,N have tried to optimize every part of their riding, but I bet they could lay down a turn on any board with a variety set ups! They have tested a lot gear and believe they have recommended the best arrangement for what they are trying to do... even though others will work. I hope this helps, but take it with a grain of salt as I am definitely an apprentice. Rob

Yes and No If you are using the hip to hip technique, then I agree with Jack, you will have no problem. If you are using the EC technique, then I agree with RJ, you will have a quite a bit of trouble. The body English/Style of the two laid out turns are similar in some ways but very different in others, thus requiring slightly different set ups ... definitely first cousins. IMHO this question needs to be asked and answered with the prescribe technique being used clearly stated. Rob

Hey Fleaman Here is a guess to add to the ideas the others have offered. Assumptions Because you were riding with steeper angles I am going to assume you were riding straight down the zipper line, with a static upper body. I am also going to assuming that you are trying hard to keep your upper body quiet and facing down the fall line, while the legs are doing all the work. Guess My guess is that the trouble you are having going from the heelside to toe side edge is an upper body issue. I’d be willing to bet that you are going great for a few bumps, then you get kicked out of the zipper line, your upper body gets pushed so that it is facing more or less ACROSS the fall line (not down it) and you are trying to get the lower body to rotate in the opposite direction ... a counter rotation. The key advantage of the static upper body technique is the quick edge changes of the lower body, the main disadvantage is that counter rotations can happen quite easily. Of course this is all pure speculation! Get one of the boarding buddies to shoot a quick video so you don’t have to guess what the issue is. Hope this helps. Rob

Hey Surfinsmiley Check out the Prior ATV, it is basically a wider 4wd. This board was designed with guys like you in mind. I'd recommend the 171, 23.5 waist, 10m sidecut for your weight and boot size. http://www.priorsnowboards.com/boards_atv.php# Here is Priors description: The ATV model is designed primarily for learning hard boot snowboarders. It's also an excellent choice for experienced alpine riders who want a fun board for use everywhere on the mountain. The ATV's 23.5cm waist also make it a realistic option for directional soft boot riders with angled stances searching for a high performance carving tool Rob Edit Check out this used ATV, it has a square alpine tail with and Allmountain nose. Very rare to find a wide (23.5cm) alpine board. I'm guessing it is a proto or the wrong picture? Serial Number 7596 in the used section. http://www.priorsnowboards.com/used_boards_list.php?BSTY_ID=13

Hi Oldvolvosrule If I am able to find a set of FAST binding, pictures would be great! Thanks for your effort and the elongated hole(s) tip! Rob

Hey Fleaman Ahhh!! I didn't think of the 3 - 4 hole issue!! Thanks for the heads up! Maybe I will get lucky and someone in the community will have a 3 hole FAST. Thanks again. Rob

Hello I'm looking for a pair of FAST bindings (any brand) at a brother-in-law price. Here it the story .... One of my close boarding friends is finally talking about getting back into boarding. He has a Checker Pig G6 in his garage, this is the last board/season that he actually rode! I just bought him a pair of Raichle 125's for $40 bucks (the Raichles came with FAST heels installed), he bought a Burton Super Model a few years ago ... but still has not ridden it yet! He wants step in, the gut gets in the way when bending over to do up the toe clips I offered him a pair of my old Burtons, but he really wants step ins. So, if you have an old pair of step in bindings, that aren't being used, please send my an e-mail. Thanks in advance for any help Rob

There are a lot of ways to come down a hill, try em' all and see what works best for you. I agree, get a lesson ... but be aware of your options. Here are the two most common options. http://club-ski.web.cern.ch/club-ski/snowboard/tutor/frswiss.html

IMHO board width should be based on boot size AND preferred stance angles. Yup! I like lower bindings. But I also really like the feel of my TD2’s with the yellow E-Rings. So the trade off is a choice between improved vibration absorption/leverage (higher) or better board feel with good vibration control (lower). Guess I need to hear more bar stool chatter before forking over $80 Canadian, hence the post.

At what point is a binding too high? My rough calculations tell me that the TD2 with the new suspension kit puts the boot *approximately* 4.5cm above the top sheet! What qualitative performance differences (pros-cons) are there to having higher vs. lower bindings? The difference in the feel of a high vs. a low binding is noticeable, similar to a wide vs. a narrow board. Is performance affected by mixing, for example, a narrow board with a high binding or a wide board with a low binding? Are racers restricted to how high their bindings can be? (If yes, how high?) Looking for a bit of insight from any tech experts. Thanks Rob

Good Morning Bob Thanks for your explainations. The final question is: Is that your hand in the spy photo? (hehe) Cheers Rob

Hi Jack (or any other spy) I’m really surprised there seems to be no interest in this thread? The ‘professional’ looking quality of the E-Ring molding and the matching yellow ‘super soft’ color leads me to believe that this is a soon to be released creation from Fin and Bob. A few questions to the creator (Fin/Bob?) 1. Is the purpose of this stacking E-Ring simply more vibration absorption? 2. Why stack two disk directly to the board? Wouldn’t it make more sense to offer a thicker E-Ring (with the tabs for vibration absorption) in combination with a single thicker center disk? The spied photo does not show any slotted teeth on the center disk, so I will assume that the center disk and the additional disk are stacked. 3. Does a thicker E-Ring automatically result in more ‘squish’ or movement as D-Sub suggested? Before the release of the TD2 Bob explained to me that the movement of the new Bombers was as follows: ‘The Elastomer Ring (No matter which durometer) under full compression to one side, only deflects .23 degrees from center. (.46 degrees inclusive.)’ 4. Would a thicker (single) center disk, made of a composite material, reduce the potential wear between the aluminum cant disk and a composite center disk; when the really thick E-Ring is used? This is assuming a bit more movement and vibration absorbtion were either the goal or the result of this modification.) Thanks is advance Rob PS - I can’t wait until the legal issues are resolved, I’m keen to see the new products!

Hi Adrian I'll take the Freerides, sent you an e-mail. Rob

Hi Fin What stops the main ‘threaded rod’ from unwanted movement/rotating when it experiences vibrations? Fin, you mentioned that you were having a hard time finding springs that were happy with. You also explained that the springs you wanted were expensive. The springs in the picture look like a standard inexpensive flat wire spring. Could you give the community an explanation as to why you selected the springs that you did, bit of a Springs 101 for dummies? Thanks Rob

Hi Bob I have a Mac that when I try to turn it on as soon as I hear the hard drive start to turn on the power cuts out. any ideas on what the hell is wrong? I’ve had the same problem a few times before, I run an Apple network. Most of the time, in my case, it turned out to be the battery. Yup, the small inexpensive battery that maintains all your preferences then the computer is unplugged. The batteries are cheap and are easy to swap. It’s worth a try, especially on an older Mac. Rob

Hey Fin Was use in powder, resort to back country split board powder situations, a design goal/consideration for this project? Any info would be interesting to hear. How about posting a proto picture for all the junkies checking the forum in June! Thanks Rob

Hi Stevo The Catek Freerides and your modification look very good together! Bet your Madd BX/Catek freeride combo is a lot of fun! The picture of your 3 strap soft bindings seems like it would be very similar to a soft hardboot/soft plate combo. Also, the hardboot walk/powder mode would appear to be like a soft binding where you can choose between two are three straps. Could you comment on the differences in feel and ride between your three strap Cateks and a hardboot set up that is on the softer side? What advantages do you feel the three strap set up has over a soft hard set up? I live in an area where I am unable to demo equipment, so your comments are appreciated. Thanks in advance. Rob

Hi Nate/Neil (or any AM Coiler owner who cares to comment) Now that you have had a season on your Coiler AllMountain(s) are you happy with the the model (Length/Sidecut, etc.) you picked? Would you change any part of your selection if you were to do it again, longer/shorter/flex etc.? Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks guys. Rob

Hi D-Sub Again, I agree 100% with you. There are MANY great boards that will do the job, I didn't mean to imply anything different. The Swoard is simply ONE very good board that you might enjoy riding. Case and point. I'm in the cue for a Coiler AllMountain. I'm hoping to fill the gap between my Swoard and my Undertaker. No doubt in my mind it will work great for a wide range of turning techniques/styles. Thanks again for posting your video, wish more guys would do this! Rob