Pure Boarding, shapes?

[BlueB]

I have recently realised that Black Diamond 162 is very close to the shape I've been slowly gravitating to... However, I've noticed something interesting, looking at all of their models on website, it seems that nose outline has a bit of flat spot just ahead of the transition from sidecut to showel: 

At first I thought it was just bad image editing, but looking at some real life pics, it actually might be there? Hard to tell... 

Does anyone know, is it real? And why it would be there, function? 

Next, is there any nose decamber/early rise, like on most of the modern boards? 

Last, but not least, what the flex can be compared to? Slalom board? All mountain board? Pow board? 

Thanks.  

[lafcadio]

That's not an illusion. All the new Pure Boards have noses shaped like.  I'm not sure why. No decamber that I'm aware of.  It's pretty old school.  

I would characterize the flex similar to an all mountain board.  It's a fun board and flexes easily.  The Black Diamond/Bastard may be better for larger carvers. They come in longer length and are a bit stiffer compared to the Two. 

Also, if you're looking closely... the Black Diamond and Bastard are identical except for the top sheet graphics.  

[BlueB]

Interesting... They effectively made the contact point more aggressive and removed what would hsve been a tiny bit of decamber (radius going into the nose rise). Maybe we'll hear why, from Joerg himself, or one of Pure insiders. 

I thought the Black is a bit softer flexing then Bastard... 

Edited April 8, 2017 by BlueB

[slopestar]

I rode two versions of the Donek "secret" 

One board had similar nose/edge shape. One was hook version and the other without. Interesting how freed up and nimble the no hook version was. Personal preference likes the hook 

[Aracan]

The flat spot on PB boards is intentional. Jörg told me that the first prototypes did not have it, but it was developed to provide better grip in laydowns, where the board is weighted  toward the nose late in the turn, with the tail up in the air.

[H2O]

23 hours ago, Aracan said:

The flat spot on PB boards is intentional. Jörg told me that the first prototypes did not have it, but it was developed to provide better grip in laydowns, where the board is weighted  toward the nose late in the turn, with the tail up in the air.

I agree.

Also the same shape on my Two158.

On laydown turns it prevents the tip engages in the snow. Clever but in my opinion PB boards have too short effective edge and the the edge hold on ici slopes is not good.

Furthermore, at the same price (or lower price) it is possible to have a custom board with a better quality and with a better similar shape.

[Aracan]

Quote

Furthermore, at the same price (or lower price) it is possible to have a custom board with a better quality and with a better similar shape.

Maybe on your side of the Atlantic. Over here, custom boards run much further into four-figure territory. The effective edge is a function of overall length and shape. There are certainly boards of equal length with longer effective edge - at the cost of versatility.

Also, my PB Bastard has seen about 130 days so far, and while it certainly looks used, it rides lively and shows no signs of giving up. Not sure what you mean by "better quality".

[H2O]

2 hours ago, Aracan said:

Maybe on your side of the Atlantic. Over here, custom boards run much further into four-figure territory. The effective edge is a function of overall length and shape. There are certainly boards of equal length with longer effective edge - at the cost of versatility.

Also, my PB Bastard has seen about 130 days so far, and while it certainly looks used, it rides lively and shows no signs of giving up. Not sure what you mean by "better quality".

Hi Aracan,

I am from your side of the Atlantic!  I know the prices of the custom boards and considering the Pure boards as factory boards at the same price it is possible to try better.

The construction is "simple" (no titanal for example) like some factory boards even if they are done well and long lasting.

I agree about the effective edge but with a better mix of torsional stiffness and longitudinal stiffness with the same effective edge you could have a better edge hold and a better riding on different snows.

Edited April 11, 2017 by H2O

[Aracan]

Now I am intrigued. Where can I get a custom board for less than EUR 900,-?

As for the titanal vs. glass discussion: That, too, is intentional. Unless things have changed dramatically, metal boards are not nearly as durable as glass boards. And when you have seen Joerg ride, it is easy to see why a damper board wouldn't interest him.

[H2O]

9 minutes ago, Aracan said:

Now I am intrigued. Where can I get a custom board for less than EUR 900,-?

As for the titanal vs. glass discussion: That, too, is intentional. Unless things have changed dramatically, metal boards are not nearly as durable as glass boards. And when you have seen Joerg ride, it is easy to see why a damper board wouldn't interest him.

I think in Canada, in Usa, in Switzerland (semi-custom), in Slovenia ......

Might be intentional, it isn't a problem (I like also glass boards) but I think that 850 euros for a glass factory board is too expensive. 

I've seen of course Joerg ride (and I admire very much his skills....he was for me a true example....and I rode with PB setting for many years....) but it is also easy to see the limits of PB boards on hard and variable snows......and the best PB videos are on good snow .....

 

[Neil Gendzwill]

8 hours ago, Aracan said:

Where can I get a custom board for less than EUR 900,-?

Coiler's prices start at $CDN880, about ‎€620.  For that price once you pick the basic design you choose length, width, nose shape, tail shape, plus side-cut and taper (from a few choices), with flex built to your weight and riding style.  Custom topsheet is another $30 if you provide the graphic.  If you want a completely custom shape he can do it too but I'm not sure why you'd need to.

[bigwavedave]

Donek Incline. Lively, all glass wood core board, custom to your specs for $650USD. My favorite board for riding soft snow conditions with hardboots. One of Donek's cheapest custom boards, with all-mt versatility and it carves like crazy. Mine doesn't have the secret nose shape (which is where this thread started), but maybe it's an option.

[Ladia]

6 hours ago, Jim Callen said:

I'll throw my 2 cents in here:

...... They were poppy and energetic, and when I was in Tahoe they handled variable conditions like a champ (trees/moguls/corn).  I haven't gotten one on true ice yet, so I can't speak to their performance there,

I did. I took 162 Bastard to Sentinel bowl and it was still pretty icy on the left side. The board handled it decently. It was not like MK I rode earlier, but very good for wide board. If you are one board man PB boards are not bad choice. And about metal. It seems to me that metal fever is cooling down. I have bunch of board without metal and they ride very smoothly.

 

 

[Eric Brammer aka PSR]

I rode a 'Two', 157 on Saturday at Sunapee Mt. It was an odd day, condition-wise, as the top was a 'froze-in-place' icy groomed-to-perfection skating rink, while from mid-mountain on down, there was a layer of slush that (in shaded areas) at times would be quite firm. I also had brought my 1997 Burton Alp (Had to ride it at least once this season), which was an interesting comparison with the newer, wider PureCarve. Oddly, the Burton handled the overly firm upper mountain conditions better than the PureCarve (though, it might've been my having 4* Acute Edges on it), but, on the lower mountain, the Burton pretty much only had one arc to it. The PureCarve, while not very grippy on the firm stuff, came alive in the softer snow, and let me play with turn shapes seemingly at will. While not as 'flowing' as the Alp (and, much easier to shed speed with), the PureCarve was happy doing a carved dance down a narrow chute next to some Black-diamond bumps (this, right under the Triple chair), and then once over on the wide, groomed-out Nastar race hill, it would let me pretty much just lay over and ol' arc I wanted. There is something to that nose profile! I could be quite a bit more aggressive about loading the nose on it than I could with the Burton. 

I want to thank Alex for letting me borrow the PureCarve, as it has been quite entertaining the 3 days I've been on it!

[nutmeg]

6 hours ago, Neil Gendzwill said:

Coiler's prices start at $CDN880, about ‎€620.  For that price once you pick the basic design you choose length, width, nose shape, tail shape, plus side-cut and taper (from a few choices), with flex built to your weight and riding style.  Custom topsheet is another $30 if you provide the graphic.  If you want a completely custom shape he can do it too but I'm not sure why you'd need to.

The CDN$880 is before taxes as far as I understand it, while the EUR 850 quoted for PB  *includes* 19 percent VAT (=EUR 136). And I guess the higher shipping costs from Canada to Europe might sum to up more than the remaining difference.

[Aracan]

Thanks nutmeg

Of course you can ORDER a custom board from Canada or the U.S. for less than EUR 900. You will, however, be out of considerably more money when you finally HAVE the board. Transatlantic shipping rates for oversize items, anyone? Duty? Import tax? Import tax on shipping cost (I kid you not)? Believe me, I looked at that option long and hard.

Quote

I think in Canada, in Usa, in Switzerland (semi-custom), in Slovenia ......

If any Swiss boardbuilder as much as answers the phone about a custom job for EUR 900, he must be a very frugal Swiss boardbuilder indeed. Last I checked, a STOCK Kessler cost nearly EUR 900 at my local board shop, and that was discounted from 1,100. I don't know about Slovenia, but I'd be happy to hear more.

 

Edited April 12, 2017 by Aracan

[wulf]

Hi BueB,

I'd like to throw in a SG Cult 159/169. Versatile AM shape with a little racing background.

Very positve ride reports here in EU on that shape

SG Cult

[H2O]

9 hours ago, Neil Gendzwill said:

Coiler's prices start at $CDN880, about ‎€620.  For that price once you pick the basic design you choose length, width, nose shape, tail shape, plus side-cut and taper (from a few choices), with flex built to your weight and riding style.  Custom topsheet is another $30 if you provide the graphic.  If you want a completely custom shape he can do it too but I'm not sure why you'd need to.

I totally agree!!!

[H2O]

1 hour ago, Aracan said:

Thanks nutmeg

Of course you can ORDER a custom board from Canada or the U.S. for less than EUR 900. You will, however, be out of considerably more money when you finally HAVE the board. Transatlantic shipping rates for oversize items, anyone? Duty? Import tax? Import tax on shipping cost (I kid you not)? Believe me, I looked at that option long and hard.

If any Swiss boardbuilder as much as answers the phone about a custom job for EUR 900, he must be a very frugal Swiss boardbuilder indeed. Last I checked, a STOCK Kessler cost nearly EUR 900 at my local board shop, and that was discounted from 1,100. I don't know about Slovenia, but I'd be happy to hear more.

 

Aracan, believe me, from Canada to Europe you finally have an amazing board at less than 900 Eur .... not comparable with any PB boards.

Other better solutions: Donek, Swoard, SG and the next season there will be the new SG full titan 22 wide.

I am not saying the PB boards aren't good boards but simply that the price is too expensive, not justified. 

I have a Two 158 and on several occasions I rode the Bastard 162 and 168 so I think to know them; I rode with PB setting for several seasons but then I changed it beacause of knee pain and now I am riding flat with less splay, always with a rotational style.

PB boards and style express perfecly the concept of a multipurpose riding, one of a kind, And I like it very much!  ...... probably the price also includes this.

Joerg is a great rider and master as well as very helpful.....

   

[Neil Gendzwill]

5 hours ago, Aracan said:

Thanks nutmeg

Of course you can ORDER a custom board from Canada or the U.S. for less than EUR 900. You will, however, be out of considerably more money when you finally HAVE the board. Transatlantic shipping rates for oversize items, anyone? Duty? Import tax? Import tax on shipping cost (I kid you not)? Believe me, I looked at that option long and hard.

The solution is to plan to attend ATC next year and pick up your new ride then! 

[BlueB]

7 hours ago, wulf said:

Hi BueB,

I'd like to throw in a SG Cult 159/169. Versatile AM shape with a little racing background.

Very positve ride reports here in EU on that shape

SG Cult

Yup, should be a good board, except maybe a bit too wide for my baby boots, in 169 length. 

I had the old version of it, which was narrower and pointer. It was probably the best hard boot specific board for steep pow and trees, I've ever ridden. However, the nose shape wasn't as good as on my beloved Proto in flatter pow or slush... 

A similar board I tremendously enjoyed this season, is a super wide Coiler AMT 169x24/9, soft flex. I'll probably order a slightly narrower and shorter version, to improve agility in moguls, and be done with it... 

Edited April 12, 2017 by BlueB

[H2O]

16 hours ago, BlueB said:

A similar board I tremendously enjoyed this season, is a super wide Coiler AMT 169x24/9, soft flex. I'll probably order a slightly narrower and shorter version, to improve agility in moguls, and be done with it... 

It will be my next board! ..... Coiler AMT 166x23,5/9-10 radius, soft flex.

Meantime I've bought an Arbor Steepwater narrow that I ride with hard setup ..... very very beautiful!